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Union Bears statement


dezrfc1

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Surely police horses who are supposed to be involved it taming "riots" and the like are trained enough not to cause threat to humans when a loud noise is made? If not, they shouldn't be used as its a clear threat to humans.

The lad who banged the drum was inside the concourse whilst the horse was outside, he had no idea a horse was actually there. Yet thats him banned at Ibrox until his court case outcome due to being arrested.

Yeah seems a bit odd.

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Surely police horses who are supposed to be involved it taming "riots" and the like are trained enough not to cause threat to humans when a loud noise is made? If not, they shouldn't be used as its a clear threat to humans.

The lad who banged the drum was inside the concourse whilst the horse was outside, he had no idea a horse was actually there. Yet thats him banned at Ibrox until his court case outcome due to being arrested.

If the horse was outside then there's no way for him to know and hopefully the court case shouldn't even make it to court imo.

Hope he gets back in to support his team (tu)

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Really no excuse for that - whatever the reason the horse was there - it was there.

Maybe they should arrest the members of our armed forces who play drums while on horseback. Police horses are trained to deal with crowd situations so banging a drum near them should not cause an issue. If it does I suggest that the training of the horses is substandard (much like the training of some of the police officers).

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The idea of a horse being close enough to the UB inside a stadium with 40,000 odd folk, at night with all the lights etc seems a bad idea to begin with imo. Surely theres no need for horses to be inside the stadium, and the police know fine well the UBs have drums etc, did they expect the guy with the megaphone to tell everyone to shut it until the horse had trotted by?

What if Rangers had scored and 40,000 started screaming and shouting and the horse freaked out? Would 40,000 people be arrested for creating a loud noise near a horse?

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The idea of a horse being close enough to the UB inside a stadium with 40,000 odd folk, at night with all the lights etc seems a bad idea to begin with imo. Surely theres no need for horses to be inside the stadium, and the police know fine well the UBs have drums etc, did they expect the guy with the megaphone to tell everyone to shut it until the horse had trotted by?

What if Rangers had scored, would 40,000 people be arrested for creating a loud noise near a horse?

They aren't all odd, some don't even know about RM or the Off Topic forum! :ohmy:

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Unfortunately, there are still a number of questions that haven't been answered by either side of this argument.

The only arrest that I can see specified was the drummer... is there a story around banners/songs/chants, etc, with any of the other arrests, or attempted arrests?

There are many things that seem to be inappropriate from the police: baton charges and locking the doors sound rather mad unless it was kicking off royally. It is also important to remember that fans are also customers, paying good money to enjoy the spectacle, and I know from many years of being stopped and searched that being a football fan seems to see you treated as sub-human.

But with all that being said, the UB statements seem very carefully worded (understandably given that people have been arrested), and don't convince that there wasn't some inappropriate behaviour going on. The way it is, you can't try to block the police from arresting someone and expect them to be fine with that.

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It was'neigh the Horses fault, the polis and BF1 should get around a table.... The story looks like to have 2 sides, but in Union bears favour, the police presence was never so apparant than before kick off at the Annan game, so outside looking down from club deck, the polis meant business.

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Just to get the facts right. From your perspective:

The fans should not try to stop a perceived injustice? Even though they are there, you were not, and they seen or were at the point of offence being committed.

You should never bang a drum near a horse? Establishment and public order horses are specifically trained for that. Horse bands, gunfire, whistles, bombs...

That our fans were at fault? When you were not there and seen nothing. You ask, who are you to pass judgement. I ask you that same question. So at least we agree on one thing.

Edited to fix damned autocorrect

we agree - the fans should not stop the police doing there job - perceived injustice or not! let the cops arrest the alleged perpetrator and let the courts decide guilt. Mob rule where innocent or guilt is decided by a mob is not on!

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We need to know what the first guy was accused of doing and why the UB decided that he was not going to be arrested.

it doesn't matter what he was being arrested for - the mob have no say in that - the police arrest based on suspicion of wrong doing - the courts decide innocence or guilt!

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There are a disproportionate amount of plod at Ibrox on match days. Shouldn't they be doing something useful?

this is what i dont understand - a football match is the perfect place. everyone is in a designated seat, there are cameras everywhere - frankly you barely need stewards there when you consider how different fans are (or are allowed to be) when compared with 30 years ago. there should be minimal plod there, and as you say, they could be doing something useful instead of itching to get their numbers up at a game.

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it doesn't matter what he was being arrested for - the mob have no say in that - the police arrest based on suspicion of wrong doing - the courts decide innocence or guilt!

i understand what you are saying here, but the problem is that people's faith in the police is plummeting - just because they are the police, doesnt mean they are right. they are just normal human beings who have to make judgement calls, and the more i hear, the more i realize that they are not up to the task.

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IMHO The club cant make a statement defending the UB when, evenin their own words, they tried to prevent the police making an arrest! That would be folly on the clubs part and an own goal of epic proportions!

It is 100% lawful to try and prevent an arrest, or resist an arrest, if you believe that said arrest is indeed unlawful. I know you won't like this, but that is the law in Scotland. Cops take the pish everyday, and everyone knows it. Most of the time its with scumbags, and so none of us bother. For some reason, it is still the senior officers view that football fans are scum, thus the treatment. That is a fact that cannot be denied. One thing I would say though, as you have probably observed, the UB were not running riot and out of order that day, so why immediately say that their arrests were legit? Seems odd to me. I watched the video showing the first half on the UB - I didn't see anything that warranted a charge in - everyone knows that will only put the whole groups back up - and that applies if you are at a game of football or in a pub. The Match Commander is undoubtedly the man who gave the order. Who was that? That should be your focus.

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