Moralising Over Ebts Says More About Scotland Than Rangers.

[Blue Avenger 22,567]

If title stripping fucking happens i hope we as a fanbase riot.

Not just a few hundred,i'd like to see thousands tear Glasgow apart tbh.

Only the bad parts please!

IMO It starts from the top with a well thought through strategy covering all eventualities. It's called scenario planning, but I somehow doubt this board have heard of it, going by their actions thus far. First of which is that our board formally serve notice on resignation from this corrupt league, then let them show their hand. We could murder them if we had the will, even if the eventuality was that we were no longer part of Scottish football. I for one would have difficulty with us remaining if we were stripped of titles as we would be seen as being unprincipled, no balls and just patsies awaiting the next kicking from all comers.

However I doubt this board would care, as they appear to be working to an agenda of self preservation no matter the cost. Hope they prove me wrong.

[The Educator 1,572]

All the propagandists' buzzwords are getting an airing, with angry paragraphs strewn with references to "financial doping", "cheating" and "money they wouldn't have had".

Some might say the highlighted is actually a very accurate description of how they financed their team via tax schemes involving film companies and dodgy land deals with the help of like minded members of the GCC, and EDC.

Let's not be fooled by the "they should keep their titles" comments from O'Neil and Sutton. I seem to remember the latter going on about how we cheated them of titles and medals. So what's the difference now? The fact is they are shit scared that the work done by the likes of PZJ will expose to the world how the financed their squad and want to try and set things up so they can keep their titles if things go wrong. Their master plan has failed big time and they know we are getting stronger and will soon be coming after them.

[writingranger 1,412]

Something that has bothered me and I don't think there is a specific thread for it, however, what right did that judge have in saying players may have gone elsewhere if they had not been offered ebt's at Rangers. Surely that was not in his remit to give an opinion on footballing matters. Was the appeal not on whether ebt's were a legit loan scheme and therefore had no tax burden. His "extra" little comments have absolutely ensured a shitstorm.

Yep & grounds for appeal

[The Educator 1,572]

Something that has bothered me and I don't think there is a specific thread for it, however, what right did that judge have in saying players may have gone elsewhere if they had not been offered ebt's at Rangers. Surely that was not in his remit to give an opinion on footballing matters. Was the appeal not on whether ebt's were a legit loan scheme and therefore had no tax burden. His "extra" little comments have absolutely ensured a shitstorm.

The inclusion of that paragraph was conjecture, and could be conceived as a show of personal bias. The people are meant to be law experts, since when has conjecture been acceptable in any part of UK law. It would seem they have now added two one off exceptions to the rule of law in the UK by their use of conjecture and common sense. Neither of these would hold up in a court case, and as such had no part in their legal remit in judging the EBT case. In my opinion they have by their misuse of law given a very powerful cause for a successful appeal and they should now be requested to stand down from the positions they hold.

[OlegKuznetsov 10,816]

Talking of "players you could not otherwise have afforded"...

Robbie Keane last night moved on loan to Celtic from Tottenham Hotspur until the end of the season in a transfer that has been funded personally by Dermot Desmond, the Scottish club's majority shareholder.

The Republic of Ireland striker travelled to Glasgow last night and, having undergone a medical, agreed a six-month deal with Desmond funding his £68,000-a-week basic salary after Tottenham apparently waived a £1m loan fee.Celtic become the 29-year-old's seventh club in a nomadic career after he fell down the pecking order at Spurs despite regularly captaining the team this season.

[sandyinroyalblue 16,478]

Talking of "players you could not otherwise have afforded"...

It would be scandalous if lets say an owner of a football club was funding a transfer from money he earned from a care home that turned out to be abusing it's residents,just theoretical like.

[OlegKuznetsov 10,816]

For your further perusal... Pay attention to the starting dates.

From March '02 to March '06.

So will we be getting those titles back? Will our rivals be stripped of anything that was won during that period?

Was Seville a sham, breached by an unfair sporting advantage? Oh, that's right. They lost.

Darren O'Dea must be equally scathing of his former club. No doubt tomorrow, after learning of this, he will be in papers for demanding his old club be stripped of their honours.

This scheme was aimed at doing what EBTs did, but by shifting the burden of responsibility back onto the player. It's still a tax avoidance scheme that had it not been used, those players might not have signed.

Bringing all this perspective to the issue, must be a right bugger for some.

[Terry Hurlock Loyal 12,133]

Talking of "players you could not otherwise have afforded"...

Don't forget film investments, offsetting tax due from a few interesting characters

http://citywire.co.uk/wealth-manager/news/former-celtic-boss-lennon-faces-big-bill-over-tax-scheme/a795765

[OlegKuznetsov 10,816]

Don't forget film investments, offsetting tax due from a few interesting characters

http://citywire.co.uk/wealth-manager/news/former-celtic-boss-lennon-faces-big-bill-over-tax-scheme/a795765

Yep!

According to STV News, Lennon (who now manages Bolton Wanderers) alongside Aberdeen chairman Stewart Milne, St Mirren caretaker boss Gary Teale and former Scotland captain Gary McAllister, are being probe for investment investing in schemes operated by Ingenious Media Holdings.

HMRC is questioning the legitimacy of three schemes operated by Ingenious – Inside Track Productions, Ingenious Film Partners 2 and Ingenious Games LLP.

And that cunt Lennon had the temerity to moralise over us?

[OlegKuznetsov 10,816]

FINANCIAL experts say the Celtic manager and his fellow investors could face a bill of up to £20million after a judge threw out their lawsuit.

Neil Lennon put £200,000 into two investment schemes

NEIL Lennon is being chased for legal costs after losing more than £100,000 in a tax scheme and failing to get his cash back.

Experts say the Celtic manager and his fellow investors could face a bill of up to £20million after a judge threw out their lawsuit.

And the group going after the money include lawyers Collyer Bristow, who advised Craig Whyte on his

disastrous takeover of Rangers.

Lennon put £200,000 into two investment schemes in 2003, when he was earning £30,000 a week at Celtic.

He was told they would save him almost £500,000 in income tax.

Celtic striker John Hartson, England goalkeeper Paul Robinson and English rugby stars Joe Worsley and Jason Leonard also invested cash.

But they all lost out after the Inland Revenue said the schemes were against tax rules.

Lennon only got back £80,000 of his money – and received none of the tax benefits he was promised.

The schemes’ architect, disgraced Danish entrepreneur Bjorn Stiedl, was jailed for an unrelated pension fraud in 2004.

Lennon and more than 500 other investors teamed up to sue the company behind the schemes, Innovator One. Stiedl was the driving force behind the firm.

But they all lost out after the Inland Revenue said the schemes were against tax rules.

The highly complex investment plans were designed to exploit tax breaks for investors who put their money into software and technology.

The incentives were brought in after the dotcom crash hit technology shares on global stock markets in 2000.

Lennon put a total of £200,000 into two schemes – one called Mamjam Technology Platform Partnership and another called Casedirector Technology Partnership.

Investors put in a little more than £6million.

The schemes then took out another £19million in bank loans and used the cash to buy software from another company.

The idea was that Lennon would be able to count £800,000 of the borrowed money as part of his investment, giving him a total of £1million and allowing him to reduce his income tax bill by £400,000.

But the company who sold the software to the schemes then put the borrowed money on deposit with the bank, meaning it had effectively gone round in a circle.

And the taxman ruled that, because of that, the investors could only claim tax breaks on the money they had put in themselves.

That meant Lennon would only have got back up to £80,000.

And since the investment scheme failed, the rest of his stake was wiped out, saddling him with a £120,000 loss.

Hartson invested £120,000 in the same two schemes as his former teammate. He joined Lennon and the other investors in the lawsuit against Innovator One.

They claimed at the High Court in London that the schemes were fraudulent and had been badly put together.

In all, they alleged, their investments had been mis-sold for more than a dozen different reasons.

But judge Mr Justice Hamblen rejected their case.

He ruled: “Although the claimants were understandably aggrieved to lose their cash contributions and receive back only limited tax relief, there are obvious risks in going into aggressive tax schemes which offer the prospect of almost immediately doubling your money.”

Collyer Bristow were one of the defendants in the lawsuit after acting as lawyers for Innovator One, and are now preparing to try to claim back their costs from the investors.

A costs hearing is expected later in the year. No date has been set.

If the bill does reach £20million, it will leave the 555 investors facing costs of £36,000 each. Lennon and Hartson declined to comment.

The Innovator One schemes were similar to more recent schemes involving film financing which have also proved popular among footballers because of promises to massively lower their income tax bills. But the film schemes have often proved similarly unsuccessful, with the taxman refusing to hand over rebates.

Collyer Bristow advised Whyte on his takeover of Rangers and handled the money paid by Ticketus in exchange for the rights to future Ibrox season ticket sales.

Whyte’s lawyer at Collyer Bristow, Gary Withey, briefly served as Rangers company secretary. But he claimed he had no involvement in the day-to-day running of the club and knew nothing about the decision by Whyte not to pay income tax and VAT.

He quit Collyer Bristow in March, claiming he and his family had been threatened because of his Rangers involvement.

Rangers’ administrators, Duff & Phelps, sued Collyer Bristow and Rangers FC Group – the company Whyte used as a vehicle for his takeover – for £25million in April.

They claimed Whyte and Withey conspired to buy Rangers when they knew they didn’t have the money to do so, and the club’s board shelved plans for a £25million share issue as a result.

A full hearing in the case has been set for October.

Collyer Bristow and Withey deny wrongdoing and the law firm have vowed to strongly contest the claims, which they have described as “highly speculative”.

[285miles 499]

Something that has bothered me and I don't think there is a specific thread for it, however, what right did that judge have in saying players may have gone elsewhere if they had not been offered ebt's at Rangers. Surely that was not in his remit to give an opinion on footballing matters. Was the appeal not on whether ebt's were a legit loan scheme and therefore had no tax burden. His "extra" little comments have absolutely ensured a shitstorm.

The irony is that those who sat on the lower tribunals will have had more practical experience of tax issues instead of appeal judges who are detached from reality

[OlegKuznetsov 10,816]

Notice that Lawwell and Eric Riley were on the list. That's the board just happening to be on the same illegal tax evasion scheme.

Of course, they all joined of their own freewill, and just happened to stumble upon the same schemes to avoid income tax.

Please don't even consider the possibility that the board were directing players towards this scheme, thus accessing funds to pay players they would not have otherwise had access to, by mean of this illegal income tax avoidance scheme. That might be just too uncomfortable for some.

[sandyinroyalblue 16,478]

Notice that Lawwell and Eric Riley were on the list. That's the board just happening to be on the same illegal tax evasion scheme.

Of course, they all joined of their own freewill, and just happened to stumble upon the same schemes to avoid income tax.

Please don't even consider the possibility that the board were directing players towards this scheme, thus accessing funds to pay players they would not have otherwise had access to, by mean of this illegal income tax avoidance scheme. That might be just too uncomfortable for some.

If you were a player involved in one of these schemes and the taxman told you money had to be paid back do you think that somebody may point the finger at their former employer?

Just a thought.............................

[OlegKuznetsov 10,816]

If you were a player involved in one of these schemes and the taxman told you money had to be paid back do you think that somebody may point the finger at their former employer?

Just a thought.............................

Perhaps it will be a matter of "doing a deal".

[OlegKuznetsov 10,816]

Would Roy Keane have signed for them without these sweeteners?

Keane swallows £70,000-a-week cut to join Celtic

Midfielder signs 18-month deal with Glasgow club Scan on troublesome knee only impediment to deal

Michael Walker

Thursday 15 December 2005 02.10 GMT

Roy Keane was last night in Glasgow having a scan on his knee as he moved closer to signing an 18-month contract with Celtic. It is understood Keane is prepared to take a £70,000 a week cut on his Manchester United wage, instead taking a salary of only £20,000 per week. However, it was reported that a percentage of the shortfall in Keane's wages will be made up by Celtic's largest individual shareholder, Dermot Desmond.

[Helicopter Sundae 5,967]

Interesting:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3313583/The-Powys-revolution-entire-Welsh-town-going-offshore-avoid-tax-local-businesses-just-like-Google-Starbucks.html

[BLUEDIGNITY 33,638]

Hate obsessed cunts, it's been drilled into them at both ends from an early age by the dhirty bheasts!

[OlegKuznetsov 10,816]

Hate obsessed cunts, it's been drilled into them at both ends from an early age by the dhirty bheasts!

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That Mastermind image!

[dummiesoot 16,002]

Hate obsessed cunts, it's been drilled into them at both ends from an early age by the dhirty bheasts!

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Factually incorrect BD, the ghuys answer would be "Sevco FC, ra zombies, pyoor deid byraway"

[Thermopylae 15,286]

The truth is that they hate our club, and would love to see us go to the wall.

The truth is they hate us more than they love their own club ... 3 years without us has left them losing home and away to the 6th best team in Norway but that will hardly matter to them as long as Rangers are cast down

[cushynumber 25,178]

normally I dont really like whataboutery.

However, I'll be fucked if I'll be moralised to be a club that had endemic and systematic child abuse that they have tried to hide. Thats like Joseph Fritzle criticising your parenting skills.

I'll be fucked if i will be moralised to by the BBC who themselves use EBT's extensively. There is the pot calling the kettle black

and I'll be fucked if anybody will moralise to me over HMRC tax payments depriving us of services, when the Governments own Civil Servants use of the scheme is widespread and systematic. HMRC should be getting its own house in order first.

[daviec1953 147]

A very, very fine piece of work.

If only our Club spokesmen were as good at arguing the Club's position.

[Guest]

Its obvious that that they hate is more than they love themselves. They get called out about it on reddit etc all the time and reddit is full of americans and neutrals who can see how obsessed they are. And reddit hates Rangers so its not like theyre trying to wind them up.

The whole of scottisb football is based on hating Rangers, really hope the day comes when we leave this shitey country.

[Inigo 32,526]

Hate obsessed cunts, it's been drilled into them at both ends from an early age by the dhirty bheasts!

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