Hullo Hullo, Who Were The Billy Boys.

[Siam69 26,876]

Another interesting read from PZJ, you'd need to click on the link to get the full article with vids showing the taigs in all their sectarian glory, not that I'm sure you havn't witnessed that before, many times And about the Kingsmills massacre, the anniversary of that horrific event was a few days ago


https://examplewordpresscom7073.wordpress.com/2015/12/30/hullo-hullo-who-where-the-billy-boys/

Hullo Hullo Who Were The Billy Boys?
Posted on December 30, 2015December 31, 2015by Pharez Zarah and Judah


Much has been said very recently on the subject of ”The Billy Boys” in the press and on social media. I must admit for the formative years of my life growing up in a Loyalist working class area of Belfast and acquainted with the song from my youth I had no idea the song depicted a certain Billy Fullerton. In my youthful ignorance I thought or believed the ”Billy” was no other than the famous and immortal King William The Third.
Little is really known of Billy Fullerton and the google search button reveals scant information. I even read some forums on the man and you get the feeling that more is legend and myth rather than facts when people talk about the man Billy Fullerton. Legend and myth about ”hard men” are not uncommon and usually go hand in hand.
Luckily I came across this picture of Billy Fullerton and the band he helped form Bridgeton Purple and Crown Flute Band. Fullerton is the one in the centre with the mace on his right shoulder.

What I did find out from the scant information I could find on the man was that as a young man he was badly beaten by a group of Catholic youths on Glasgow Green after it is believed he scored the winner against them in a football match. The Bridgeton Gang were it seems formed after this incident in 1924. At this point it must be highlighted that there were many gangs around the greater Glasgow area already in existence. Billy Fullerton did not create the gangs. I found this extract describing the times at this period ”The Bridgeton Billy Boys gang had 800 paid up members at its peak in the early 1930s, though many of its members were not from Bridgeton. The gang attracted many likeminded youg men – Scottish Protestants who felt they were being swamped by Irish Catholics – from other Glasgow districts such as Calton, Gorbals, Townhead, Garngad, Cowcaddens and even a few from nearby Lanarkshire towns such as Coatbridge and Airdrie”
From the same source there was extant at this period Gangs including the ”Norman Conks” and the ”Tim Alloys’ and ”Kent Star” and ”Calton Entry” (Catholic) along with the Protestant ”San Toy” who made up some of the famous gangs from the period in question.
Now we know certain incidents in our lives can define us and even shape the rest of our lives and make us into the people we become. Not to excuse anyone or anything but as pointed to earlier, a young Fullerton was attacked by a Catholic Irish ”gang” and left badly beaten. This attack was believed to have taken place In 1924, during a ‘friendly’ game of football, Billy scored a goal against the Catholic Kent Star team and after the game was attacked with a hammer, receiving head injuries.
Was this the defining moment in Fullerton’s life? Was this the reason why in a very short period he was to form his own ”Gang” and nurse a hatred which resulted in a life of violence? Make no mistake this was ”territorial” and not based on relgion. Like the troubles in Northern Ireland most was fought in the name of religion which in reality was territorial. Gangs and likeminded people flock together and they do so for protection. Did the young Fullerton feel isolated after being attacked by the so called ”Catholic Gang”? It would certainly be interesting to see if he had any criminal record or had been in trouble with the law previous to the incident.
When people comment on Billy Fullerton they usually mention his politics and claim that he was a facist. It certainly appears he joined In the late 1930s Oswald Mosley’s British Union of Fascists and he even started a Glasgow branch of the Ku Klux Klan. Again like many in this period their politics were all over the place. We know for instance that in Ireland and particularly amongst the I.R.A. there was a known flirtation with Nazism.
http://www.qub.ac.uk/sites/frankryan/InterpretativeResources/HistoricalContext/IrishRepublicanismandNaziGermany/
After the war it appears that fascists, Nazi collaborators and war criminals came to Ireland, including some who flourished and became respected members of the community.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1538969/Ireland-welcomed-Hitlers-henchmen.html

Ireland’s treatment of the Jewish Community is well documented
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2092138/Irish-minister-admits-time-Jews-fleeing-Nazis-denied-visas-1930s-morally-bankrupt-regime.html
From the above you can see quoted ”Ireland has admitted for the first time that its ‘morally bankrupt’ regime of the 1930s denied visas to desperate Jews trying to escape from Nazi persecution”.
”Justice Minister Alan Shatter said that, following Adolf Hitler’s rise to power, Ireland’s anti-semitic Berlin ambassador Charles Bewley ensured ‘the doors to this state were kept firmly closed to German Jewish families trying to flee”.
A nation which fully understood what fleeing ones country to safer havens, denied Jews entry to their country and much needed refuge during a brutal period of their existence. Not only that but the Irish ambassador was a known anti semitic.
Today the new ”Gangs” revel in the I.R.A. Facism which included Kingsmill
click link at start to see the video
In fact one of the ”Gunmen” believed to be responsible for the above atrocity had a Play Park named after him. The modern chants of fascism are clearly heard here
click link at start to see the video
These songs are regularly sung at every ground in Scotland that a certain football club visit and are ”excused” as political. They are not political but the chants of a fascism that pervaded a society for over a generation and still does.
The above does not excuse what Billy Fullerton became or even was but it gives an insight into the times he lived in and the gangs that were on the streets of Glasgow and the skewed politics of the day. At other times it was claimed that Fullerton and the Billy Boys were the foot soldiers of the Conservative Party the Orange Order and Freemasonry. It is claimed the Gang were employed by local Tory politicians to break up socialist, Labour Party, trade union and other left-wing gatherings.
It is also believed that Fullerton and some of his associates were awarded medals and certificates for their strike-breaking activities during the 1926 General Strike.
Using and employing bullying ”Gangs” is something that is a common tactic in Scotland and this can be seen in the following articles when the S.N.P. appear to be taking over the mantle of the old Glasgow Gangs by breaking up gatherings of those who differ in their politics
http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/566675/Ed-Miliband-attacked-in-street-by-thugs-wearing-masks-of-SNP-ex-leader-Alex-Salmond
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3112992/Hounded-SNP-hate-mob-weeks-lonely-death-Charles-Kennedy-endured-vile-campaign-bullying-abuse-separatist-fanatics-deeply-wounded-vulnerable-man.html
There is no doubt that Billy Fullerton had a fearsome reputation and not all of it was built on myths and legends. But I came across a very strange story in my research of the man. One of the ironies of Fullerton’s life was that he often worked for Bridgeton bookmaker and boxing promoter Tommy Gilmour, who was a Catholic. Fullerton was often employed by Gilmour to erect boxing rings, an occupation for which he had a reputation as a specialist. Furthermore, after the 2nd World War, Fullerton worked as a ring whip for Glasgow bantamweight boxer Peter Keenan, who was also a Catholic. Keenan was the first and only Scottish boxer to win 2 Lonsdale Belts outright in 1953 and 1957. Keenan was a keen supporter of Celtic FC. At a match in the 1950s, Keenan was carried onto the pitch at Celtic Park on the shoulders of Billy Fullerton to receive the adulation of the Celtic supporters.
Another irony for those that are most Vociferous in their condemnation of Fullerton usually mention that he was a strike breaker and used by politicians to be so. Funny that those who are most vehement in this condemnation laud a man who treats his workers no better than slaves. Funny these same people say nothing of the horrendous working conditions the employees of Mike Ashley are subjected to.
It is hard to really get an insight into Billy Fullerton with the scant information that is available but I was fascinated to discover that the Bridgeton Band he played in was a regular visitor to my native Belfast for the 12th of July parade and celebrations. I was also surprised that some claim that Fullerton named his gang after my youthful belief that it was the celebrated King William who was the ”Billy” in the ”Billy Boys”
I also discovered that the ”Billy Boys” also had a youth gang called the ”Derry Boys” and one gang would stand at Bridgeton Cross opposite Orr Street at the Midland Bank which is now a chemist I believe. The ”Derry Boys” stood across the Toll at the Bridgeton Cross weighbridge at Olympia Street. That also explained the ”Bridgeton Derry Boys” often sung at the end of the song.
Billy Fullerton died in poverty in 1962 aged 57 years in a single roomed tenement home in Brook Street, Mile-End, just to the north of Bridgeton Cross. He was given a spectacular send-off as around 1000 marched in his funeral cortege – including flute bands – from Bridgeton Cross to the cemetery at Riddrie in the north east of Glasgow. There were even a few Catholics from Glasgow’s east end and the city’s boxing fraternity – including Peter Keenan – who quietly attended his funeral, such was their begrudging respect for this Glasgow hard man.
Today there is no begrudging respect for the hard man. He alone it appears is the cause of all the sectarian ill’s that pervade a modern Scotland. A type of Bogey Man that reminds us all what will become of us if we do not behave. What many forget is that he did not create the ”Gangs” that roamed the streets of Glasgow in the period he lived, because the Gangs were already extant . As pointed out he formed his own ”Gang” after he was attacked with a hammer, receiving head injuries. That is not to excuse what he became as this post is not a pro Billy Fullerton eulogy but incidents like this have changed people and made them into the people they became.
Sectarianism is not a one way street. The media have certainly waged a war on the Rangers support in recent days. And yet they have ignored sectarianism that has emanated from the other side of the religious divide perceived. Who can forget for instance the abuse that Walter Smith and every Rangers manager were subjected to everytime they played Celtic at their stadium? Was there a similar outcry after this for instance?
Click link at start to see this video
The abuse which was of a sectarian nature was sung by a vociferous majority within the Celtic stadium and yet there was not one mention of the true nature of the abuse which was sectarian at its very core. I read of not one journalist who after the sectarian tirade made mention of the bile that came from the Celtic support. This game was also a live televised match.
This post was made to highlight the myths and the legends that exist in our modern enlightened age. At this time it is the common perception that if anyone sings ”The Billy Boys” that they must be a fascist and are immediately demonised and who have even in the recent past been sentenced to serve a prison term. In reality many or the majority do not even know anythng of the meaning of the song or its significance or even its origins.
I grew up in a working class Loyalist district of Belfast and most young lads from these areas are street wise and very aware of the world around them. They understood the songs and the heritage they were born into. But even I did not know who the supposed ”Billy” was in the ”Billy Boys” Even today some still claim that Fullerton named the Gang after King William The Third. That is debatable but certainly not one that can be dismissed.
To end this post I would ask a few questions. Is it only Rangers supporters who are to be targeted in this new sectarian drive? Is it only Rangers supporters who offend? Are sectarian songs sung by others going to be continually ignored and described as political?
After all when Celtic fans glorify their Terrorist organisation of choice they are literally glorifying a fascist group who were actually ”Up To Their Knees in Protestant Blood”

[.Williamson. 82,179]

Nothing like a good Protestant giving a Catholic a hard kicking.

Superb stuff

[sonofbear 398]

Good read .

[dummiesoot 16,005]

Interesting read, the story certainly highlights that this 'bigot' was nothing of the sort. Why would a bigot actively work for and engage with known high profile Catholics?

It would be good if some of these courageous journalists actually took time to research the subject of their ire.

[ritchieshearercaldow 22,137]

Well said.

But some of the comments on his page.?

He gets criticised for using Google, yes more can be found out about Fullerton and his gang by in depth research but in general Google has the main facts correct.

One gang was as bad as the other, gangs were part of the make up of Glasgow back then, high unemployment and a pub and a gang of men on every corner.

[Ben10 2,272]

'Make no mistake this was ”territorial” and not based on relgion'

Hmmm, you may want to clarify the preceding paragraph then.

[Bad Robot 21,149]

I hate those fucking cunts. Fenian facist scum is one of my nicer terms for them.

[Corky True Legend 2,682]

A good read and well done on your research. But what has Ashley got to do with Billy Fullerton or "The Billy Boys"? An unnecessary diversion.

[Siam69 26,876]

A good read and well done on your research. But what has Ashley got to do with Billy Fullerton or "The Billy Boys"? An unnecessary diversion.

I disagree.

I think what PZJ was pointing out here -

Another irony for those that are most Vociferous in their condemnation of Fullerton usually mention that he was a strike breaker and used by politicians to be so. Funny that those who are most vehement in this condemnation laud a man who treats his workers no better than slaves. Funny these same people say nothing of the horrendous working conditions the employees of Mike Ashley are subjected to.

Was that those, and we all know who he means by those, those who like to portray themselves as socialist, standing up for the oppressed, revolutionaries, anti capitalist etc, like to use as condemnation that Fullerton was allegedly a strike breaker for greedy people to keep the poor working class in their place, yet the very same people laud Ashley who's greed and contempt for his workforce is absolutely repugnant, as born out by many recent media articles and Political led enquires.

He is merely pointing out the hypocrisy of the self styled ' revolutionaries and defenders of the poor working Class', and we all know why they don't condemn fat Mike.

PZJ is great at pointing out the many, many hypocrisies of the taigs, he certainly takes the fight to them, whether it being dodgy land deals, exposing taig bloggers posing as Bears trying to sow discord and suspicion in our support, or like above, their straightforward sectarian hatred of us being much more important to them than their supposed socialist, revolutionary, anti capitalist viewpoint that they are supposed to endorse and live by.

PZJ and D'Art are always worth a read in my humble opinion.

[siddiqi_drinker 14,635]

Articles like the only pander to the lies of Speirs aND Co about the origin of the song, thereby demonizing the support, again.

What next, Rangers fans agreeing that the Bouncy was about jumping on a taigs head.

As a support we need to challenge these lies, not perpetuate them.

[Inigo 32,526]

Hmmm.

Fullarton had a pretty cuntish history, regardless of what life changing moments he might have had. The article falls too far short in the criticism of some of the things he was. I find that aspect of it a bit uncomfortable. Some of those things we as a support need to distance ourselves from at all opportunities, considering that others like to make us out as virtual fascists.

The stuff about double standards is on the mark, but I can't help feeling that in relation to other bits of it, if you used a similar approach in some other subjects on here, you'd be called an apologist.

[Tontospal 1,116]

Can anyone provide answers to the following:

1. Who came up with the lyrics and when?

2. When was TBB first sung by Rangers fans?

[Guest]

Can anyone provide answers to the following:

1. Who came up with the lyrics and when?

2. When was TBB first sung by Rangers fans?

Theres a lot of details in TBB Wikipedia page. Apparently the gang started coming to Rangers games and singing it and it started then

[plumbGER 24,518]

I thought it was a good peice by PZJ,puts a few home truths to these bastards who have been demonising our support.

[Siam69 26,876]

I thought it was a good peice by PZJ,puts a few home truths to these bastards who have been demonising our support.

I agree.

He's just released another good piece, putting a couple of taig bloggers in their place...

https://examplewordpresscom7073.wordpress.com/2016/01/09/the-ringmasters-mac-giolla-bhain-and-john-james-now-the-clowns/

[Young Bob 1,360]

Every member of our Board should read that and take it on board. It isnt a one way street and ignoring the taigs for the moment and just looking at the song then is tolerating people being up to their knees in Killie blood etc really helping the situation.

Anybody really wants to stop sectarianism in this country then state funded religious schooling should be abolished overnight. Public schooling should have no RE and anyone who wants their child brought up in a religous way should teach them at home and take them to places of worship. Banning a song will only rekindle the flames.

[Tontospal 1,116]

Theres a lot of details in TBB Wikipedia page. Apparently the gang started coming to Rangers games and singing it and it started then

Thanks, I didn't even think of looking there.

I had no idea that our fans have been singing it for so long.

I wonder what the oldest footage is of it being sung.

[Tontospal 1,116]

Every member of our Board should read that and take it on board. It isnt a one way street and ignoring the taigs for the moment and just looking at the song then is tolerating people being up to their knees in Killie blood etc really helping the situation.

Anybody really wants to stop sectarianism in this country then state funded religious schooling should be abolished overnight. Public schooling should have no RE and anyone who wants their child brought up in a religous way should teach them at home and take them to places of worship. Banning a song will only rekindle the flames.

The Board shot themselves in the foot and did our support no favours with their statement.

There are much bigger problems in our society than the lyrics of songs sung at football matches.

Our support is an easy target but none of the experts has explained how stopping the singing will eliminate sectarianism.

Drink is a bigger factor in Scottish violence and sectarianism yet there are no hastily passed laws to ban the sale or consumption of the devil juice.

[Siam69 26,876]

But it's the blatant double standards and demonization of our support compared to others, that is particularly repugnant, and pointed out well by bloggers such as PZJ.

[siddiqi_drinker 14,635]

Thanks, I didn't even think of looking there.

I had no idea that our fans have been singing it for so long.

I wonder what the oldest footage is of it being sung.

Wikipedia is a great source where everything g is 100% accurate.

[delamonty 992]

@Siam69..... I have read many articles on here... Certainly D'Arts are thought provoking, insightful, thoughtful and so on. This is up there with D'Art.. The depth you have gone to is substantial. A great read and I thank you

Please continue this work.

[siddiqi_drinker 14,635]

@Siam69..... I have read many articles on here... Certainly D'Arts are thought provoking, insightful, thoughtful and so on. This is up there with D'Art.. The depth you have gone to is substantial. A great read and I thank you

Please continue this work.

Think the article was from here

https://examplewordpresscom7073.wordpress.com

[Briton 394]

"Today there is no begrudging respect for the hard man. He alone it appears is the cause of all the sectarian ill’s that pervade a modern Scotland."

I thought it was a poor article in general. While I read a few things I didn't know, I don't trust the source. The above is a typical piece of bullshit. WTF has ever claimed that Billy Fullerton is the cause of the sectarian shite that exists in Scotland? He's not even a minor factor in that and I can't imagine anyone has ever argued otherwise.

Also: to the O/P, ask yourself this question; have Rangers fans ever been censored for eulogising loyalist paramilitary groups? It puzzles me that many seem to be confused at the difference between supporting the IRA, despicable as that is, and rhetoric aimed at a religious or racial group. It's another Athletico Bilbao type confusion.

[BridgeIsBlue 66,606]

[Siam69 26,876]

@Siam69..... I have read many articles on here... Certainly D'Arts are thought provoking, insightful, thoughtful and so on. This is up there with D'Art.. The depth you have gone to is substantial. A great read and I thank you

Please continue this work.

"Today there is no begrudging respect for the hard man. He alone it appears is the cause of all the sectarian ill’s that pervade a modern Scotland."

Just to confirm, and as Siddiqi as already clarified, the article in the OP is not my 'work'. It is from a great (IMO) Blogger who goes by the name of PZJ.

I always read his 'work', and give anything he does credence.

I posted a link to his original article at the start of the thread, or could be found again here - https://examplewordpresscom7073.wordpress.com/From which you could also access his other work, especially exposing taig bloggers and dodgy taig land deals, amongst others.

Well worth a read in my humble opinion...