King Jela 20,360 Posted September 24, 2017 Share Posted September 24, 2017 Either way, the ref was absolutely shocking yesterday. Unbelievably shocking. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
WeirFleckNRothen 1,789 Posted September 24, 2017 Share Posted September 24, 2017 4 minutes ago, Inigo said: Yes, you can. Read the rules. The kick has to be deemed excessive force to be a red. A pathetic wee flick isn't a red, it's a yellow. A good few years ago this was discussed at length after a similar Nacho Novo flick, against Hibs, I think it was, and it was confirmed by referees that a petulant kick is not a red, that it has to involve excessive force and there has to be a danger of injury. A pathetic little kick out of the boot as with Morelos doesn't constitute that. Hell, even the Sportscene crew gave it pretty short thrift, because it was minor. You won't find something like that being assessed by the compliance officer either (as it wasn't in this case). Rightly so. And look again. Dorrans Didn't grab anyone by the throat. Your account has been hacked. They're both violent conduct. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inigo 32,526 Posted September 24, 2017 Share Posted September 24, 2017 1 minute ago, WeirFleckNRothen said: Your account has been hacked. They're both violent conduct. Nah mate, they're not. Why do you suppose the compliance officer didn't assess it as so? Because the rules don't regard it as a red, they regard it as a yellow. It's 100% not excessive force based on the definition of excessive force in the violent conduct/serious foul play definitions. It was petialant and minor, and the rules are written to separate that kind of thing from something that is genuinely violent and dangerous (which, come on, that just wasn't ). Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
WeirFleckNRothen 1,789 Posted September 24, 2017 Share Posted September 24, 2017 1 minute ago, Inigo said: Nah mate, they're not. Why do you suppose the compliance officer didn't assess it as so? Because the rules don't regard it as a red, they regard it as a yellow. It's 100% not excessive force based on the definition of excessive force in the violent conduct/serious foul play definitions. It was petialant and minor, and the rules are written to separate that kind of thing from something that is genuinely violent and dangerous (which, come on, that just wasn't ). So, you're trying to tell me that you're within your rights to go around kicking out in frustration, so long as you don't use excessive force? Nonsense and you know it. Beckham's on Simeone at the '98 World Cup, by your assessment methods, wasn't a sending-off? That literally was a flick. If we're using your way of judging, Stokes on Tavernier wasn't excessive. It was 100% a sending-off, though. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Al 55 9,241 Posted September 24, 2017 Share Posted September 24, 2017 Excessive force and violent conduct are different things. Excessive force in within the context of a tackle. Why do people get sent of when folk square up and there is the motion of a headbutt? It's rarely ever excessively forceful. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inigo 32,526 Posted September 24, 2017 Share Posted September 24, 2017 Just now, WeirFleckNRothen said: So, you're trying to tell me that you're within your rights to go around kicking out in frustration, so long as you don't use excessive force? Nonsense and you know it. Beckham's on Simeone at the '98 World Cup, by your assessment methods, wasn't a sending-off? That literally was a flick. If we're using your way of judging, Stokes on Tavernier wasn't excessive. It was 100% a sending-off, though. Eh, no, I'm trying to tell you if you do it you get booked, if you do it again you get sent off. How does that constitute being within your rights going around kicking out in frustration? Have you read the rules yet? It's not me making this up mate. Beckham was 19 years ago mate. As for Stokes, the way he was flailing his arms (both of his arms towards his neck/face before chucking him aside by means of his forearm grabbing around that area) was clearly more dangerous than a flick to the calf. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
thegambler 61 Posted September 24, 2017 Share Posted September 24, 2017 Our being in 5th isn't down to refs, that's for sure. It's down to our inability to win games consistently. Too many excuses being peddled to justify the teams' own shortcomings. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inigo 32,526 Posted September 24, 2017 Share Posted September 24, 2017 4 minutes ago, Big Al II said: Excessive force and violent conduct are different things. Excessive force in within the context of a tackle. Why do people get sent of when folk square up and there is the motion of a headbutt? It's rarely ever excessively forceful. Excessive force is part of the description of violent conduct AND it's part of the description of serious foul play. Excessive force isn't an offence in itself, whereas violent conduct is. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
WeirFleckNRothen 1,789 Posted September 24, 2017 Share Posted September 24, 2017 Am I being Punk'd? Is Ashton Kutcher about to post, laughing at me being stitched-up? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Al 55 9,241 Posted September 24, 2017 Share Posted September 24, 2017 Just now, Inigo said: Excessive force is part of the description of violent conduct AND it's part of the description of serious foul play. Excessive force isn't an offence in itself, whereas violent conduct is. How many sending off for headbutts have been with excessive force? It's a straight red every time. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
big blue Fin 3,724 Posted September 24, 2017 Share Posted September 24, 2017 4 hours ago, WeirFleckNRothen said: Paranoia is ripping out of some people. Personally, I didn't think it was a penalty; Morelos' theatrics probably didn't help him, but regardless, we had 90 minutes to rectify any wrongs and we didn't lay a glove on them. We're turning into Mowbray & Lennon's celtic; its fucking embarrassing. We are dropping points and losing games because our manager is a dud Said it before and I'll say it again. We need a dislike button. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inigo 32,526 Posted September 24, 2017 Share Posted September 24, 2017 Just now, Big Al II said: How many sending off for headbutts have been with excessive force? It's a straight red every time. At a guess I'd say they assess even minor headbutts as excessively forceful because it involves the head and it's a recognition of the importance of protecting the head and discouraging force towards it, because head injuries are more serious than most. There's more potential danger there so they probably err on the side of being quite severe with it. You don't have those kinds of considerations for a flick to the calf. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boybluesy 3,693 Posted September 24, 2017 Share Posted September 24, 2017 Saw the playback. Penalty all day long. Walker called it and ex- ref in Sunday papers as well. Ref was pish poor and clearly biased toward the unbeatables. Still if there is a worse full back in SPFL than Hodson I haven't seen them. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
magic8ball 27,901 Posted September 24, 2017 Share Posted September 24, 2017 it can be argued that we should be better to be winning games by a big enough margin to stop bad calls effecting us . but that's not the point .we are playing in a competition. a competition that has rules that the competitors need to play by.but the rules being applied to our team aren't the same as others just wait till we do get a decision that does go our way.the press will be all over it and the manager of the team it's against will have collums of moaning that it's what Rangers get Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sket 13,610 Posted September 24, 2017 Share Posted September 24, 2017 48 minutes ago, big blue Fin said: Said it before and I'll say it again. We need a dislike button. Why? For telling the truth? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeparateEntityMyArse 53,626 Posted September 24, 2017 Share Posted September 24, 2017 22 minutes ago, Sket said: Why? For telling the truth? For disliking an opinion he disagrees with or disputes. Appears fairly obvious. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimfanciesthedude 24,507 Posted September 24, 2017 Share Posted September 24, 2017 1 hour ago, WeirFleckNRothen said: Your account has been hacked. They're both violent conduct. Okay then so why didnt brown get any punishment for kicking tge Hamilton player in the face? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LaudrupsPatrickBoots 13,510 Posted September 24, 2017 Share Posted September 24, 2017 Seen it again and it's still easy to see how it's not been given. Could have went either way tbh it's nowhere near being a stonewall penalty. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LaudrupsPatrickBoots 13,510 Posted September 24, 2017 Share Posted September 24, 2017 1 minute ago, Jimbeamjunior said: Okay then so why didnt brown get any punishment for kicking tge Hamilton player in the face? Cos it's Brown. Same as he won't get any punishment for his elbow on Morelos. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeparateEntityMyArse 53,626 Posted September 24, 2017 Share Posted September 24, 2017 Just now, LaudrupsPatrickBoots said: Cos it's Brown. Paranoid ? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimfanciesthedude 24,507 Posted September 24, 2017 Share Posted September 24, 2017 1 hour ago, thegambler said: Our being in 5th isn't down to refs, that's for sure. It's down to our inability to win games consistently. Too many excuses being peddled to justify the teams' own shortcomings. Shortcomings maybe, decisions going against us, definitely Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LaudrupsPatrickBoots 13,510 Posted September 24, 2017 Share Posted September 24, 2017 Just now, Sportingintegritymyarse said: Paranoid ? Am I wrong? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
WeirFleckNRothen 1,789 Posted September 24, 2017 Share Posted September 24, 2017 21 minutes ago, Jimbeamjunior said: Okay then so why didnt brown get any punishment for kicking tge Hamilton player in the face? He should have been sent-off, 100%. If you're asking me why Brown didn't get sent-off for it, then I'm assuming it's because the referee missed it. Identical circumstances to Morelos' kick, in that sense. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeparateEntityMyArse 53,626 Posted September 24, 2017 Share Posted September 24, 2017 26 minutes ago, LaudrupsPatrickBoots said: Am I wrong? No. I just like having you in our para gang now. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimfanciesthedude 24,507 Posted September 24, 2017 Share Posted September 24, 2017 28 minutes ago, WeirFleckNRothen said: He should have been sent-off, 100%. If you're asking me why Brown didn't get sent-off for it, then I'm assuming it's because the referee missed it. Identical circumstances to Morelos' kick, in that sense. Ref missed it, compliance officer must have got a report for it, so either he deemed it non violent, or he didn't want brown to miss the OF game, Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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