Wilson Loaned to Dumbarton

[Courtyard Bear 41,357]

4 minutes ago, BridgeIsBlue said:

I’ve went from twist off top beer bottle and single malt, to same beer but I need a bottle opener. ?

[plumbGER 24,518]

6 hours ago, BridgeIsBlue said:

I think I get where you're coming from, though I'm too half cut to try and explain it

3/4 cut?

[plumbGER 24,518]

6 hours ago, Sportingintegritymyarse said:

Better prospect than Bates.

Wrong 100%

[onefootwillie 1,518]

It should be good for him , ideally he also plays in the games we have against the foreign youth teams. It will all depend on his ability and attitude if he progresses. As a few have said quite a lot of the youngsters who have done this have not improved. However I think this is down to either their attitude or lack of ability. I think it must help their development playing against experienced players at that age.

[Bluepeter9 5,167]

7 hours ago, K.A.I said:

good signing for Dumbarton but I’ve yet to be convinced what good these loan moves actually do for our players - id rather see them stay with the unders and play in the European programe 

everyone always says “good move” in every thread about a youth getting loaned out but it never actually turns out to be a good move at all 

Did Mcrorie and Bates no harm at all - helped develop Them - with a loan move you’re playing against adults - the development stuff against your own age group, and that makes a difference. Sometimes the Loan move helps the player develop - sometimes it shows them a level they can compete at.

 

[K.A.I 36,183]

2 minutes ago, Bluepeter9 said:

Did Mcrorie and Bates no harm at all - helped develop Them - with a loan move you’re playing against adults - the development stuff against your own age group, and that makes a difference. Sometimes the Loan move helps the player develop - sometimes it shows them a level they can compete at.

 

Who was Bates loaned out to?

i just need a lot more convincing its a good idea sending them out all the time when it doesn’t really benefit them imo - as said McCrorie was pretty woeful at Dumbarton but he swam rather than sunk when thrown in that night away to Thistle but in fairness he’s one of only two id been saying for years would make it from the unders Hardie being the other one but that looks unlikely now - what I’m trying to say is that McCrorie never needed that loan move as I always thought he’d make the step up the loan didn’t do him any good in my eyes if anything it could have regressed a top talent 

[The Dude 20,026]

7 hours ago, K.A.I said:

And he was awful for them by all accounts he’s not shone until he’s started playing in our first team in all honesty 

Everyone I spoke to at Dumbarton thought he done well. Certainly wasn’t “awful” for them. 

[Deanzmeanzheinz 4,312]

3 minutes ago, The Dude said:

Everyone I spoke to at Dumbarton thought he done well. Certainly wasn’t “awful” for them. 

Good or bad, it did him no harm. 

[K.A.I 36,183]

3 minutes ago, The Dude said:

Everyone I spoke to at Dumbarton thought he done well. Certainly wasn’t “awful” for them. 

Mate I know a lot more Dumbarton fans than yourself being from here and they thought he wasn’t upto much - very slow was the words used which was surprising to me as I thought he’d do well 

[GeeSS 512]

8 hours ago, NeoGeo7 said:

It’s a good move because he’s playing first team football with and against men rather than with younger men/boys.

its good experience and it’s good for players to gain as much and as varied experiences as they can to put them in good stead for their careers.

I agree it’s a bit like the old days when the seniors used to loan players out to the juniors to toughen them up 

[pcbear 10,913]

7 hours ago, K.A.I said:

I think the numbers/volume of players who don’t become Rangers players and/or drop out the game completely or end up playing lower league football is tangible proof enough that these moves aren’t good moves at all 

of course it’s a question of ability too but it the ability isn’t there, it doesn’t make it a good move either because it doesn’t make them better it just means they have a bit more experience In handling older players and playing competitive instead of unders football 

That's the same all over football, the EPL, have the pick of the stall from world football in both youths and the finished article, a couple of seasons ago only 30% of the players were eligible to play for England so 70 odd players will start an EPL game most from teams near the bottom of the table.

Chelsea with a massive squad sometimes start Cahill but they often field a non English team and they hoover up the cream of British talent at a young age with around 40 players on loan which is mental as they have good goalscorers out and Conte was trawling during the transfer window for Crouch,Carroll and various other stopgaps, that's just mad, but hey if you have the dough fuck taking a gamble on a youngster lets spunk 30/40/50m on someone that may or may not work.

Went off on a bit of a tangent there, Aidan Wilson imo getting first team football at any level will do him no harm, I have only seen clips of him here and there and he looks a decent player but you will never know how good until he is pitched in at the deep end re- McCrorie.

[GeeSS 512]

1 hour ago, K.A.I said:

Who was Bates loaned out to?

i just need a lot more convincing its a good idea sending them out all the time when it doesn’t really benefit them imo - as said McCrorie was pretty woeful at Dumbarton but he swam rather than sunk when thrown in that night away to Thistle but in fairness he’s one of only two id been saying for years would make it from the unders Hardie being the other one but that looks unlikely now - what I’m trying to say is that McCrorie never needed that loan move as I always thought he’d make the step up the loan didn’t do him any good in my eyes if anything it could have regressed a top talent 

Bates never went on loan anywhere??? McCrorrie however did and was outstanding for Ayr playing in midfield too so wasn’t a Murty brainwave I saw him on 4 occasions and he stood out i take your point though he is the exception to the rule generally our loans don’t achieve much and seem to be a waste of time 

[trueblueal 2,117]

8 hours ago, K.A.I said:

And he was awful for them by all accounts he’s not shone until he’s started playing in our first team in all honesty 

Guess only the coaches and player could tell you but maybe he ironed out a lot of his flaws quietly at a lower level, toughened up, realised how he needed to improve physically. A tough spell can do players good if they have the right attitude

[The Dude 20,026]

32 minutes ago, K.A.I said:

Mate I know a lot more Dumbarton fans than yourself being from here and they thought he wasn’t upto much - very slow was the words used which was surprising to me as I thought he’d do well 

I'm not disputing who knows the most Dumbarton fans The handful I spoke to and the guys on their playing and coaching staff were all impressed with him.

[Bluepeter9 5,167]

2 hours ago, K.A.I said:

Who was Bates loaned out to?

i just need a lot more convincing its a good idea sending them out all the time when it doesn’t really benefit them imo - as said McCrorie was pretty woeful at Dumbarton but he swam rather than sunk when thrown in that night away to Thistle but in fairness he’s one of only two id been saying for years would make it from the unders Hardie being the other one but that looks unlikely now - what I’m trying to say is that McCrorie never needed that loan move as I always thought he’d make the step up the loan didn’t do him any good in my eyes if anything it could have regressed a top talent 

Bates was at both Brechin and Raith - as I said games against adults are a step up from youth set ups so in the main a good idea 

[The Dude 20,026]

2 hours ago, K.A.I said:

Who was Bates loaned out to?

i just need a lot more convincing its a good idea sending them out all the time when it doesn’t really benefit them imo - as said McCrorie was pretty woeful at Dumbarton but he swam rather than sunk when thrown in that night away to Thistle but in fairness he’s one of only two id been saying for years would make it from the unders Hardie being the other one but that looks unlikely now - what I’m trying to say is that McCrorie never needed that loan move as I always thought he’d make the step up the loan didn’t do him any good in my eyes if anything it could have regressed a top talent 

 

He had loan stints at Brechin and East Stirling before joining us on loan.

I think pretty much everyone involved would disagree the loan to Dumbarton didn't do him any good. Ross himself even says it helped him.

[Negri's lovechild 13,829]

7 minutes ago, Bluepeter9 said:

Bates was at both Brechin and Raith - as I said games against adults are a step up from youth set ups so in the main a good idea 

Higher intensity as well, especially at that level. You have to graft for everything. Good move for the lad.

[The Dude 20,026]

3 minutes ago, Negri's lovechild said:

Higher intensity as well, especially at that level. You have to graft for everything. Good move for the lad.

Competitive football will always trump youth games where nothing is at stake

[PRW. 5,631]

1 hour ago, K.A.I said:

Mate I know a lot more Dumbarton fans than yourself being from here and they thought he wasn’t upto much - very slow was the words used which was surprising to me as I thought he’d do well 

Probably says a lot more about the Dumbarton fans if they think he is very slow.  

Was highly praised by their manager. 

[PRW. 5,631]

Of course playing first team football against pros is a better expierence than playing youth players, all part of the learning curve.

Its the reason we want a colt team in the 3rd division, and the same reason why Ajax, Barca and Real have the same.

[The Dude 20,026]

1 hour ago, GeeSS said:

Bates never went on loan anywhere??? McCrorrie however did and was outstanding for Ayr playing in midfield too so wasn’t a Murty brainwave I saw him on 4 occasions and he stood out i take your point though he is the exception to the rule generally our loans don’t achieve much and seem to be a waste of time 

1

Except Brechin, East Stirlingshire and Rangers.

[K.A.I 36,183]

2 minutes ago, PRW. said:

Of course playing first team football against pros is a better expierence than playing youth players, all part of the learning curve.

Its the reason we want a colt team in the 3rd division, and the same reason why Ajax, Barca and Real have the same.

I’m still not convinced (at the Scottish lower league level anyway) id rather develop them in-house than send them to lower league teams in Scotland there might be an argument to say they regress even taking into account the fact it’s competive football 

my point is everyone always says good move every time someone’s loaned out like it’s a default line and isn’t always the case it’s a good move as they don’t do anything in the game ... just a “meh move” 

[The Dude 20,026]

1 minute ago, K.A.I said:

I’m still not convinced (at the Scottish lower league level anyway) id rather develop them in-house than send them to lower league teams in Scotland there might be an argument to say they regress even taking into account the fact it’s competive football 

my point is everyone always says good move every time someone’s loaned out like it’s a default line and isn’t always the case it’s a good move as they don’t do anything in the game ... just a “meh move” 

1

So what is the argument that they regress?

[K.A.I 36,183]

I wouldn’t use Bates as an example tbh he’s very limited 

[K.A.I 36,183]

Just now, The Dude said:

So what is the argument that they regress?

The fact they’ve got promise but don’t do much in the game after they come back their loans that people think have done them the world of good 

the proof is literally in the pudding - people can pretend these loan moves are great if they really want to but they’re deluding themselves 

as I said earlier I don’t have a raft of great alternatives but let’s not pretend it’s great moves for them either