Video Referee

[Blueofblood 158]

4 hours ago, Jack The Flipper said:

A lot of people might think this is silly, but I think the very flaws in football are what makes it what it is. If it was perfect then people wouldn't get angry, talk about it, or feel as emotional as what we do when it's not so perfect.

The Maradona hand of god is still talked about to this day, people remember it and there is still some pain and hatred left in there from it - it happened in 1986. It's a simple example but one I thought would amplify my point.

Fact is, if we are good enough and try to be the very best we can it's very unlikely for us to have any real loss of achievements from bad refereeing decisions. 

I think we lose an important flaw in football by removing all refereeing errors - strange as it sounds.

As much as he was an amazing footballer he was a cheating bastard, end of.  Hand of god my fucking arse.  Hand of a cheating cunt. 

[The Dude 20,026]

5 hours ago, Jack The Flipper said:

A lot of people might think this is silly, but I think the very flaws in football are what makes it what it is. If it was perfect then people wouldn't get angry, talk about it, or feel as emotional as what we do when it's not so perfect.

The Maradona hand of god is still talked about to this day, people remember it and there is still some pain and hatred left in there from it - it happened in 1986. It's a simple example but one I thought would amplify my point.

Fact is, if we are good enough and try to be the very best we can it's very unlikely for us to have any real loss of achievements from bad refereeing decisions. 

I think we lose an important flaw in football by removing all refereeing errors - strange as it sounds.

2

Can't agree more. As much as we hate shite referees, if they were perfect in every game and didn't get some stuff wrong, we'd lose a big part of what has made football what it is.

With the current desire to fill football with technology to eliminate it, goal-line tech is - arguably - as far as it should go but even that for me is one I can't make my mind up on.

Taking away human error makes the game almost a bit un-natural and they would be as well changing the way the game is refereed completely and have a guy in a booth making every decision to make sure they get 100% right or they accept that there will be mistakes sometimes.

 

[siddiqi_drinker 14,635]

5 hours ago, Bluepeter9 said:

It’s been used in English cups this season and it’s horrible - slows the game down - takes emotion out of it - waiting minutes to see if a goal is given. Refs are poor but this is not the way forward. 

Works well in rugger, why not football?  Posing my question as someone who has never seen it in action and is therefore not disagreeing with what you say.  Does the stop/start nature of rugby make it more conducive to this type of technology?

As long as the folks monitoring the VAR meet on the level, I find it quite acceptable. 

[Bluepeter9 5,167]

4 hours ago, The Dude said:

It's been used in a few different countries other than England (972 games worldwide used VAR during the pilot and 10 of them were in England).

The average time taken across all of the games to reach a decision is 55 seconds.

The biggest problem with the tiny number of games it has been used in down south is the way it has been implemented. Was introduced in MLS 12 months ago with an observer telling the referee there is something which should be reviewed and the match referee then views the replays himself and makes a final decision while in England the referees have had no sight of replays and have to rely on someone else's view to make a decision 'blind'

Which makes the English version pretty shit - we ( they) need to make sure we don’t take the spontaneity out of the game. There was one instance with Var in last weekend game that then debated if some thing was a foul or not for a while - one of those could be might not be things but the went back a long way in play to deny a penalty iirc. Not a fan - like goal line technology but this has issues  

[sandyinroyalblue 16,478]

1 hour ago, The Dude said:

Can't agree more. As much as we hate shite referees, if they were perfect in every game and didn't get some stuff wrong, we'd lose a big part of what has made football what it is.

With the current desire to fill football with technology to eliminate it, goal-line tech is - arguably - as far as it should go but even that for me is one I can't make my mind up on.

Taking away human error makes the game almost a bit un-natural and they would be as well changing the way the game is refereed completely and have a guy in a booth making every decision to make sure they get 100% right or they accept that there will be mistakes sometimes.

 

I think we all hate shit referees but I think they do need help at times with some of the line calls which can be really hard to call but overall I think we need to concentrate on having better referees first before we introduce any form of VAR.

[Leeds_Bear 8,110]

Pish. Utter fucking pish. Sanitises the game. Goodbye to the game as we know if.

Why is it Football associations voting on this? Should be the fans deciding.

Says it all when “law makers” made the final call; of course their obstructive, black and white view on the world was going to agree with this. How about asking the people who pour their hard earned cash into the game or even the players for that matter, many of whom don’t seem to agree with this shite. 

Imagine the next time we score a 90th minute winner against the filth and then we have to wait one minute to work out whether it’s a goal or not?

Passion and enjoyment being sucked out the game by the pound (£)

[The Dude 20,026]

39 minutes ago, Bluepeter9 said:

Which makes the English version pretty shit - we ( they) need to make sure we don’t take the spontaneity out of the game. There was one instance with Var in last weekend game that then debated if some thing was a foul or not for a while - one of those could be might not be things but the went back a long way in play to deny a penalty iirc. Not a fan - like goal line technology but this has issues  

Yeah there needs to be a better way pulling it back. There are some serious potential issues (ref misses penalty shout, other team gets possession and goes straight up the park and scores or a player commits a foul resulting in an injury requiring a sub and materially changing the game). 

[Leeds_Bear 8,110]

Also, does anybody know anyone down the Hall who is a dab hand with VAR? Need to get that ASAP if not.

[Bluepeter9 5,167]

2 hours ago, siddiqi_drinker said:

Works well in rugger, why not football?  Posing my question as someone who has never seen it in action and is therefore not disagreeing with what you say.  Does the stop/start nature of rugby make it more conducive to this type of technology?

As long as the folks monitoring the VAR meet on the level, I find it quite acceptable. 

Well Rugby has more stoppages - plus I quite like the way a referee can keep play going until next breakdown if he spits an infringement - so it works there . Last week the spurs - Rochdale game was laughable the way Var was implemented. ( imho) 

[Bluepeter9 5,167]

36 minutes ago, The Dude said:

Yeah there needs to be a better way pulling it back. There are some serious potential issues (ref misses penalty shout, other team gets possession and goes straight up the park and scores or a player commits a foul resulting in an injury requiring a sub and materially changing the game). 

Yep - it’s that spontinaity that might go missing 

[Negri's lovechild 13,988]

I like var. Think its a way that if used correctly can be a benefit to the game. I watch a lot of Italian football, and the way they use it seems to work more often than not. They have made a right pigs ear of it in england though, although how much of that is down to the referees not having a few games to get used to it and get the flow of things.

Maybe outing a mic on the ref would clarify things, and the speed of decision making would get quicker with more practice. As others have said, it won't come in up here, but its a system that with tweaking and clarification its a good system. 

[Barasa 802]

I think if you can be a bit fly & get away with it, well it's a skill, & part of the game.

Attempts to sanitise what is an intense spectacle, will ruin the game, & so is doomed to fail. As a silver lining, it will make the Scottish game draw viewers, because we'll never have it.

I have my suspicions that this is an American sponsored conspiracy, to fit in more adverts!

[feda16 136]

Will work wonders for the game, lotta guys going on about referees being human etc and that is exactly the case but put it like this. These billionaire investors don't want to leave their investments on the hands to a small team of referees on a match day. They want technology to back them up. They don't want an "offside" goal given that can potentially cost their teams a place in the next round or even a cup/league. Ultimately fans are their own worst enemy when it comes to these things, they want all the money, glitz and glamour of players but their will always be followup from that. FIFA trialed this in over 1000 games, here in Australia its accepted for what it is. IMO the next move we will see is a "stop the clock". Added time should change massively next season, the standard "1" minute in the first half and "3"  minutes at end of second half will be extended massively. 

[devref 201]

sheep away 7.45ko game over 9,40 at latest unless a serious injury has taken place. with the added stoppage time adding approx. 5min in the 1st half then in the 2nd you have the standard 3/4mins plus what could be anything up to 5mins again best part of 10pm before your out the stadium. ok its only an extra 10/15mins but that makes a lot of difference to the time you get back. can see the last 10mins played to an empty stadium. alternative brig the ko forward but think this will affect the crowd on the night so a money loss to the clubs. and at home subway loyal would be away at the normal time meaning the stadium looks empty longer.it will come I have no doubt and it will change the crowds costing clubs money 

[Jack The Flipper 5,936]

6 hours ago, Blueofblood said:

As much as he was an amazing footballer he was a cheating bastard, end of.  Hand of god my fucking arse.  Hand of a cheating cunt. 

You make my point... kinda 

[Blueofblood 158]

1 hour ago, Jack The Flipper said:

You make my point... kinda 

I know what you’re saying but the flip side is the cheating bastards won’t get away with it now.  Take the St Johnstone game the other night, young Bates getting pulled to the ground by the defender, amazingly, free kick is given against him and a perfectly good goal is disallowed.  

Now imagine if there was var, either play would’ve stopped, penalty given and booking for defender or goal would’ve stood.  So nae luck to the cheating bastard defender.   

As for hand of god, he was a cheating oompah loompah cunt same as Thierry Henry, but that was against the international paedos so that was ok! :-)

[big blue Fin 3,724]

20 hours ago, Bluepeter9 said:

It’s been used in English cups this season and it’s horrible - slows the game down - takes emotion out of it - waiting minutes to see if a goal is given. Refs are poor but this is not the way forward. 

Ballocks.

It's used successfully in American Football and Rugby but in our British leagues the bosses don't seem to want to implement it properly. Think how often this season it mightbhave meant different results in our league. The bitter hivee bastards would have a few players sent off, the bheasts from the east dembele(500,000,000 d$) would have been picked up diving into the box, broonaldo would see red every couple of weeks.

VAR is a good thing but we're years late in bringing it into football because of dinosaurs who claim it'll slow things down or cut the emotion. Just ask anyone who follows the NFL or Scotland in the Rugby if it slows the game down or reduces the excitement.

[Bluepeter9 5,167]

3 hours ago, big blue Fin said:

Ballocks.

It's used successfully in American Football and Rugby but in our British leagues the bosses don't seem to want to implement it properly. Think how often this season it mightbhave meant different results in our league. The bitter hivee bastards would have a few players sent off, the bheasts from the east dembele(500,000,000 d$) would have been picked up diving into the box, broonaldo would see red every couple of weeks.

VAR is a good thing but we're years late in bringing it into football because of dinosaurs who claim it'll slow things down or cut the emotion. Just ask anyone who follows the NFL or Scotland in the Rugby if it slows the game down or reduces the excitement.

American football and Rugby are different games with a lot more natural breaks and stops - it’s seldom in either of those games that possession changes without a break in play whereas that’s part and parcel of football - I think var would change football for the worse. 

[big blue Fin 3,724]

12 minutes ago, Bluepeter9 said:

American football and Rugby are different games with a lot more natural breaks and stops - it’s seldom in either of those games that possession changes without a break in play whereas that’s part and parcel of football - I think var would change football for the worse. 

I respectfully see your point and disagree, because I'm sick to fucking death of all the dirty underhanded cheating that goes on in football. 

Remember Rivaldo's disgraceful dive at the corner flag?

How about ira lover stokes unpunished assault against us earlier in the season?

So if it means a football game lasts ten more minutes fine, of course you're in the eighty minute loyal then you're fucked.

 

[Bluenose88 132]

It works in many other major sports. However, those sports have clearly defined timeout options in their games that coaches can use to implement tactics or rest players.  These coaches are then allowed a set amount of challenges against referee decisions. Get a challenge wrong and you lose a timeout. 

Not quite sure how it works effectively in our games and I’ve not personally seen it used in the FA cup games.

I also just read the SFA are applauding the move.  Maybe they should first worry about having professional referees and spending more time educating them on actual rules before an considering a expensive belt and braces move to overturn the multitude of errors their refs make every game.  

[Bluepeter9 5,167]

6 hours ago, big blue Fin said:

I respectfully see your point and disagree, because I'm sick to fucking death of all the dirty underhanded cheating that goes on in football. 

Remember Rivaldo's disgraceful dive at the corner flag?

How about ira lover stokes unpunished assault against us earlier in the season?

So if it means a football game lasts ten more minutes fine, of course you're in the eighty minute loyal then you're fucked.

 

... for me it’s the flow of the game - blatant cheating needs stamped out but ( say) all the pushing and shoving that goes on at a corner - someone scores - does theVAR go back and look at every shove? Award a penalty? Foul? Goal stands? 

[Negri's lovechild 13,988]

6 hours ago, Bluenose88 said:

It works in many other major sports. However, those sports have clearly defined timeout options in their games that coaches can use to implement tactics or rest players.  These coaches are then allowed a set amount of challenges against referee decisions. Get a challenge wrong and you lose a timeout. 

Not quite sure how it works effectively in our games and I’ve not personally seen it used in the FA cup games.

I also just read the SFA are applauding the move.  Maybe they should first worry about having professional referees and spending more time educating them on actual rules before an considering a expensive belt and braces move to overturn the multitude of errors their refs make every game.  

Yeah just read that they are looking at it. As I've stated previously, I'm a fan of var but why the hell would they try and implement a system here if the refs aren't even full time? Its a surefire recipe for failure, but full time referees first please, proper training and then var. 

[Negri's lovechild 13,988]

17 minutes ago, Bluepeter9 said:

... for me it’s the flow of the game - blatant cheating needs stamped out but ( say) all the pushing and shoving that goes on at a corner - someone scores - does theVAR go back and look at every shove? Award a penalty? Foul? Goal stands? 

Var is monitored constantly, and the ref only needs to look at it if he is told he may want to check it. Its only really meant for the really contentious decisions, and there would be some bedding in time for refs to get used to the system. One off cup ties really aren't enough. 

I get what you mean about the flow of the game, and that's the bit that needs to get slicker and smoother but the best way to trial it is the same way as some of the European leagues - over a season. We as fans would get used to it as well,and might even add a layer of drama

[Bluepeter9 5,167]

36 minutes ago, Negri's lovechild said:

Var is monitored constantly, and the ref only needs to look at it if he is told he may want to check it. Its only really meant for the really contentious decisions, and there would be some bedding in time for refs to get used to the system. One off cup ties really aren't enough. 

I get what you mean about the flow of the game, and that's the bit that needs to get slicker and smoother but the best way to trial it is the same way as some of the European leagues - over a season. We as fans would get used to it as well,and might even add a layer of drama

Just basing my reaction on English cup games and it’s been aweful ( imho) and nothing I saw would say it warranted a seasons trial. 

[Negri's lovechild 13,988]

38 minutes ago, Bluepeter9 said:

Just basing my reaction on English cup games and it’s been aweful ( imho) and nothing I saw would say it warranted a seasons trial. 

The trial in england has been terrible. They just haven't got it right, whether or not that's to do with training or a lack of clarity I'm not sure, but the European trials have gone a lot smoother and that's made me think its not a bad idea