Courtyard Bear 41,357 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 Just now, Ger_onimo said: It’s pretty straightforward, but here’s his post again: Same rules apply to managers as players, they’re all employees. Got it now? So you have no idea what happened then. If Miller lost it and threw a punch at Murty he should be sacked but your comparing Smith giving Durrant a slap on the back to the same thing. Same applies if Murty felt he was being threatened. If Murty had thrown a punch at Miller (no laughing at the back) same applies. The problem really starts because this time it’s a player against the manager, Roberts went for throwing a punch at Souness Feguson also got pulled over the coals at Man U for hitting Beckham in the face with the boot, so again what’s your point. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
markem 7,251 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 14 minutes ago, The Dude said: You don't need to be dismissed to claim constructive dismissal. If you can argue they are trying to force you out the door then that's enough. If there is a "manufactured storm" then that could easily land us in the shit. By making it a formal disciplinary issue it becomes a whole different thing than telling them to go away for a day or two until it calms down then trying to move them (like O'Halloran) Correct. Forced to leave due to working conditions ‘constructive dismissal’ I just genuinely do not understand some of the goings on at our club, it strikes me that even if we are going down the whole HR (typically more aligned with corporate than sporting) type of policies we don’t do that right either. Leave ourselves wide open and I’d guess Barton walked away with plenty cash despite us suspending him. Thats before even considering why on earth are we going down that route. Total embarrassment. FFS Millers contract is almost up, train him with the youths. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
K.A.I 36,183 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 2 minutes ago, starofdavid said: I believe an investor is out there,45K ST holders ,worldwide fan base.....future investors will not invest whilst king is in charge,or even at the club,his business dealing leave a lot to be desired,investors invest to make money,not automatically lose it...we will have to wait and see We had guys lined up before. Absolutely no idea if they would have been good or not but the fans wouldn't allow it - Yankee go home banners etc, threats to the Malaysian and he pulled out live on a SKY interview with Jim White ... their preference before KIng surfaced was Blue Knights and Souness and his Hibs supporting mate but neither seemed to want to put up 250k to enter into the exclusivity agreement and couldn't proceed. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Courtyard Bear 41,357 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 4 minutes ago, jackrfc95 said: 4 lads had a dream saying they had to be held back by other players. If that’s true then they are gone, football or not you can’t be going after the manager of the club(shit or not) and not get sacked. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Specky Forum Organiser 64,428 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 17 minutes ago, Courtyard Bear said: None of us know who far it went, so until we do we don’t know what is acceptable or not. I don't care how far it went mate it would have been justified imo Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ibroxholm 2,274 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 38 minutes ago, blueretro said: I wasn't playing and I'm still caught up in the emotion of the game! I'm as angry now as I was watching that inept display on Sunday. Players are not fans, they have to be able control their emotions, It is part of their job to do so. There are threads on here slagging of Morelos and Docherty for not controlling their emotions on the park. These were two young players caught up in the action on the park, not two experienced campaigners sitting watching on the touchline. I would have expected more responsibility from them given that the dressing room was already reportedly a war zone. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
K.A.I 36,183 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 3 minutes ago, markem said: Correct. Forced to leave due to working conditions ‘constructive dismissal’ I just genuinely do not understand some of the goings on at our club, it strikes me that even if we are going down the whole HR (typically more aligned with corporate than sporting) type of policies we don’t do that right either. Leave ourselves wide open and I’d guess Barton walked away with plenty cash despite us suspending him. Thats before even considering why on earth are we going down that route. Total embarrassment. FFS Millers contract is almost up, train him with the youths. Yes but I'm not saying you are making him be forced to leave though - I know what constructive dismissal is but I think the board would honestly be happy paying Wallace in full but telling him to stay away. As I said if you drop a player and tell him to stay away from training - he would just claim constructive dismissal and get paid in full and be free to join a new club and get another wage? why isn't everyone that's been dropped doing that then? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ger_onimo 20,488 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 5 minutes ago, Courtyard Bear said: So you have no idea what happened then. If Miller lost it and threw a punch at Murty he should be sacked but your comparing Smith giving Durrant a slap on the back to the same thing. Same applies if Murty felt he was being threatened. If Murty had thrown a punch at Miller (no laughing at the back) same applies. The problem really starts because this time it’s a player against the manager, Roberts went for throwing a punch at Souness Feguson also got pulled over the coals at Man U for hitting Beckham in the face with the boot, so again what’s your point. Nope, wasn’t claiming to, and nor do you. I was responding directly to this post though: 56 minutes ago, Blue Avenger said: Players are employees in a place of work and are bound by Employment law and the Health and Safety at Work Act. They CANNOT vent anger. They can express dispeasure, disagreement but they cannot show anger in doing so. Disciplinary if they do. Venting anger can and does cause fear and is intimidating, both of which are not allowed in the workplace. It falls under bullying and stress at work. You can and will get hammered for it and rightly so. Even just raising your voice in disagreement can get you into bother. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
eskbankloyal 19,446 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 17 minutes ago, K.A.I said: The paid-hands for the board out in force then, the PR machine rolling. They've just put out a blog having a pop at the board and setting out a list of demands from them to be fair. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Courtyard Bear 41,357 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 1 minute ago, Goosetav said: I don't care how far it went mate it would have been justified imo Then they take the consequences, did they square go the entire team and the coaches because tactics apart not one of them gave even 10% in that game. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
billscott 2,463 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 4 minutes ago, Courtyard Bear said: If that’s true then they are gone, football or not you can’t be going after the manager of the club(shit or not) and not get sacked. if i had been in murty vicinity on sunday afternoon i would have had a go at him as well shambles of a manager Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prso's headband 35,340 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 So get pumped 5-1 from celtic at parkhead joey Barton tells them it's not gd enough gets suspended fast forward to now get pumped 4-0 from celtic in a semi final Miller and wallace tell them it's not gd enough both get suspended see a pattern here? The board accept this standard. Just seen that on twitter, probably sums it up Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
piperpete 3,186 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 1 hour ago, Blue Avenger said: Who the fuck said he was ya moron? Miller and Wallace are a pair of spineless, odious malcontent cunts who knew exactly what they were doing. They were in the wrong, no matter how incompetent Murty is. They targetted our manager. They disgraced our badge. The only rodent cunt I know is hoopy Miller, but heh don't let that stop you kissing his ring piece. Now go enjoy life on Pluto. Did they though I haven’t read anywhere they went face to face with Murty, ifva Captain and Vice Captain are not allowed to rip their team mates apart while the manager was doing his press duties then the games a bogie. Millers rant was supposed to be done and Murty wasn’t there but was told about it after the event. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SIRB_72 3,986 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 1 hour ago, Ibroxholm said: Sorry, I have a great deal of issue with what Miller and Wallace did. Neither were playing so they shouldn’t have been too caught up in the emotion of the game. Although it’s not really their job to do so, if they wanted to tell the manager a few of their home-spun truths, they should have shown a bit of class and done it in private, not in front of the full team to undermine the manager. I take your point but they are watching, they feel apart of it just like me or you and they have the influence in the dressing room to point out issues. Miller despite not being the same player is the only winner in that dressing room and Lee Wallace has given more than most players would give to this club. It isn't good enough and it needs to expressed. It was behind closed doors. The rest of the squad are big boys and can handle it and if they really wanted to stand up for the manager they could and would. For me the manager lost it before Miller and Wallace got involved and if anything the attitude of Halliday, Candeias, Docherty and Morelos is more of an issue as that was all public and undermined the managers control more than anything Miller & Wallace said. I'm happy to agree to disagree though and let's be honest all three men involved will not be at the club for much longer whatever happens! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
K.A.I 36,183 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 Just now, eskbankloyal said: They've just put out a blog having a pop at the board and setting out a list of demands from them to be fair. Doesn't wash, seems like nice timing and a bit of a double bluff or even insincere to passify people who maybe are accusing them or are onto them for their propaganda. That said, I'd like to see it anyway, do you have a link? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Specky Forum Organiser 64,428 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 Just now, Courtyard Bear said: Then they take the consequences, did they square go the entire team and the coaches because tactics apart not one of them gave even 10% in that game. Don't disagree with that but if Murty really told them he wasn't going to say anything to them incase it caused confrontation he would have deserved a slap. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
markem 7,251 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 10 minutes ago, Goosetav said: I don't care how far it went mate it would have been justified imo I think you are justified if youve earned it. Don’t be swanning around the pitch like a utter, incompetent, shite bag then start flying at the Manager when he has something to say about it. Total speculation on my part but it’s hard to imagine how any of them could be blaming anyone but themselves. Murty can carry much of the blame but them being genuinely scared of that mob is on them as individuals. Been a long time since any of our players were held back from going after one of that lot. (Granted Wallace didn’t play for some time) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Specky Forum Organiser 64,428 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 Just now, K.A.I said: Doesn't wash, seems like nice timing and a bit of a double bluff or even insincere to passify people who maybe are accusing them or are onto them for their propaganda. That said, I'd like to see it anyway, do you have a link? It's on the previous page Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don81 2,837 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 20 minutes ago, ForeverAndEver said: Numan told a story of Ferguson going absolutely fucking nuts after the 5-1 in the dressing room Load of shite If it comes out that Wallace never refused to play then he should sue TRO Guessing he wasn't going nuts at Advocat though which could well be the difference here. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
the goal machine 7,791 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 Murty can't continue like this. If a guy he worked with in the under 20s and the most professional player we've had the last few years are done with him like this he's fucked. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
K.A.I 36,183 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 Just now, Goosetav said: It's on the previous page link me bitch I'm too lazy to go back the way, forwards forever backwards never Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Specky Forum Organiser 64,428 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 1 minute ago, markem said: I think you are justified if youve earned it. Don’t be swanning around the pitch like a utter, incompetent, shite bag then start flying at the Manager when he has something to say about it. Total speculation on my part but it’s hard to imagine how any of them could be blaming anyone but themselves. Murty can carry much of the blame but them being genuinely scared of that mob is on them as individuals. Been a long time since any of our players were held back from going after one of that lot. (Granted Wallace didn’t play) Murty saying he wasn't prepared to have it out with them as it would lead to confrontation makes him fair game imo Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewasp 7 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 Just now, K.A.I said: link me bitch I'm too lazy to go back the way, forwards forever backwards never https://fourladshadadream.wordpress.com/2018/04/17/wallace-miller-and-another-shambles/amp/?__twitter_impression=true Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bighouse 1,012 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 As much as Murty should resign, it's been abundantly clear to me for a long time that Miller is a locker room cancer Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
markem 7,251 Posted April 17, 2018 Share Posted April 17, 2018 4 minutes ago, K.A.I said: Yes but I'm not saying you are making him be forced to leave though - I know what constructive dismissal is but I think the board would honestly be happy paying Wallace in full but telling him to stay away. As I said if you drop a player and tell him to stay away from training - he would just claim constructive dismissal and get paid in full and be free to join a new club and get another wage? why isn't everyone that's been dropped doing that then? Didn’t read the chain back properly Kai, I agree with that, we feel you need rest or train with youths whatever, within rights to that. We are making it a formal issue (circus) when we don’t have to. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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