Corruption in the game?

[Colin Traive 22,754]

We all know that we are refereed to a different set of rules but the Griffiths stamp is a watershed moment for me.

If there is no retrospective punishment for him, then we really would be as well chucking it.

Whst is also certain is that it is not our place to comment directly on it, no matter how much we feel that it confirms our belief of bias and corruption.

The other aspect of this incident is the self-outing of Rangers haters. Most of them have years of previous but there are people trying to convince anyone that will listen to them that Griffiths’ stamp was not worthy of a red. Anyone trying to sell that nonsense has a clear agenda and it has nothing to do with fair play.

[RS4_wul 4,115]

10 hours ago, magic8ball said:

Goldson booked for daring to highlight the amount of fouls 

Exactly bud, it's a fuckin joke. Booked for daring to point out the multiple fouls by the big clogger bastard.

In the last 2 games versus us he must have committed at least  15 fouls, one of which was a straight leg over the ball studs up tackle in to Davis' ankle long after the ball had gone (should have been a straight red, didn't even get a yellow for it ) .

And I believe he also kicked the ball away at Ibrox on Saturday without getting a yellow for it. 

Total combined cards in both games? 1 yellow. 

 

[coopsleftboot 5,512]

21 minutes ago, Colin Traive said:

We all know that we are refereed to a different set of rules but the Griffiths stamp is a watershed moment for me.

If there is no retrospective punishment for him, then we really would be as well chucking it.

Whst is also certain is that it is not our place to comment directly on it, no matter how much we feel that it confirms our belief of bias and corruption.

The other aspect of this incident is the self-outing of Rangers haters. Most of them have years of previous but there are people trying to convince anyone that will listen to them that Griffiths’ stamp was not worthy of a red. Anyone trying to sell that nonsense has a clear agenda and it has nothing to do with fair play.

See, that's what normal people (us) would say in normal circumstances.  But they cited all sorts of stuff that they saw as "equivalent" misdemeanours that had gone unpunished as they tried to get Christie off with his  ban, including referring back to the OF game a whole year previously.  And guess what...they weren't censured for doing so.  So there is precedent there for us to speak out without fear.  

[eejay the dj 31,964]

14 hours ago, Terry Hurlock Loyal said:

I don't think there is deliberate bias, but in the back of the mind of a referee they know the consequences of giving a key decision against them.

It starts with Lennon and his players screaming at them on the park constantly, then the MSM aftermath interview and the subsequent campaign in the MSM outlets for a full week. Call for inquiries and the ref to be banned from celtic games etc.. Added that this whips up the mutant support, putting the referee, his property and family at risk.

It's been a regular cycle over the past few seasons, so many refs will only give a decision if it's an absolute stonewall - and even then many have avoided it.  I'll say that for them, they have played the refs like a fiddle.

I genuinely can't believe any Rangers fan ,that witnesses the Rangers games .Does not think there is deliberate  bias going on here 

[quabba 440]

17 minutes ago, eejay the dj said:

I genuinely can't believe any Rangers fan ,that witnesses the Rangers games .Does not think there is deliberate  bias going on here 

exactly

[quabba 440]

1 hour ago, Colin Traive said:

We all know that we are refereed to a different set of rules but the Griffiths stamp is a watershed moment for me.

If there is no retrospective punishment for him, then we really would be as well chucking it.

Whst is also certain is that it is not our place to comment directly on it, no matter how much we feel that it confirms our belief of bias and corruption.

The other aspect of this incident is the self-outing of Rangers haters. Most of them have years of previous but there are people trying to convince anyone that will listen to them that Griffiths’ stamp was not worthy of a red. Anyone trying to sell that nonsense has a clear agenda and it has nothing to do with fair play.

Really like your posts mate and that sums it up to a tee for me.

[Falcoholic 1,348]

Rangers need to lead this. The Club needs to stand up and make the challenge, bring it out in the open, call it out for what it is and then maybe other clubs might follow.

But, we are Rangers.

The end.

[coopsleftboot 5,512]

39 minutes ago, eejay the dj said:

I genuinely can't believe any Rangers fan ,that witnesses the Rangers games .Does not think there is deliberate  bias going on here 

I don't. 

What I do think  is there's a climate of fear built up that makes match officials act instinctively (unconscious bias) because the culture they work in means there is likely to be consequences of decisions they make.  Look how aggressively celtic go after those who they perceive are unjust against them.  Look how at how rabid the press placements are when perceived injustices happen, look at how often officials are threatened by their fans, as they and their homes become targets.  All this creates a working climate that influences their decision making, whether they realise it's happening or not.

With respect to the organisation that's responsible for referees, I do believe they believe they're above all this and acting professionally and with  impartiality.  But they too are subject to the effects of the same climate....with the pressure often causing them to be too weak because some have to much power.  That's not just me saying that, that's a couple of dearly departed fellow SPFL chairmen who were so feart to be honest when they could have had effected change....such is the power and influence they felt was there.

Bottom line is it's being driven by Lawwell and his friends (Mulraney etc.) and all within the rules....but the influence and pressure (club, press, fans) brought to bare depending on who's broken what rule (once an incident is taken off the pitch) is where there is the potential for bias claim to be really levied.  Problem is the weakness of the SFA.  Criticism and pressure by celtic, their fans and press placements is an entirely different beast to pressure placed by anyone else, especially us...ours fizzles out and goes away...they don't.  It really needs US to take the lead and to be persistent, and if that means taking out of the football world, and this country (e.g. CAS) then that's what must happen.

The poisonous climate that's been cultivated, where an official can make an error of judgement that doesn't benefit one club and results in disproportionate scrutiny and criticism, can have a real impact on an officials professional and personal life and needs to be reversed for the good of the game.  Only way this will change is if there's a real shake up at Hampden, and the people with the "disproportionate power and influence" that only look out for their own (or those they prefer) are removed.  It's the only way a change to a fairer sport can be achieved.

[eejay the dj 31,964]

35 minutes ago, coopsleftboot said:

I don't. 

What I do think  is there's a climate of fear built up that makes match officials act instinctively (unconscious bias) because the culture they work in means there is likely to be consequences of decisions they make.  Look how aggressively celtic go after those who they perceive are unjust against them.  Look how at how rabid the press placements are when perceived injustices happen, look at how often officials are threatened by their fans, as they and their homes become targets.  All this creates a working climate that influences their decision making, whether they realise it's happening or not.

With respect to the organisation that's responsible for referees, I do believe they believe they're above all this and acting professionally and with  impartiality.  But they too are subject to the effects of the same climate....with the pressure often causing them to be too weak because some have to much power.  That's not just me saying that, that's a couple of dearly departed fellow SPFL chairmen who were so feart to be honest when they could have had effected change....such is the power and influence they felt was there.

Bottom line is it's being driven by Lawwell and his friends (Mulraney etc.) and all within the rules....but the influence and pressure (club, press, fans) brought to bare depending on who's broken what rule (once an incident is taken off the pitch) is where there is the potential for bias claim to be really levied.  Problem is the weakness of the SFA.  Criticism and pressure by celtic, their fans and press placements is an entirely different beast to pressure placed by anyone else, especially us...ours fizzles out and goes away...they don't.  It really needs US to take the lead and to be persistent, and if that means taking out of the football world, and this country (e.g. CAS) then that's what must happen.

The poisonous climate that's been cultivated, where an official can make an error of judgement that doesn't benefit one club and results in disproportionate scrutiny and criticism, can have a real impact on an officials professional and personal life and needs to be reversed for the good of the game.  Only way this will change is if there's a real shake up at Hampden, and the people with the "disproportionate power and influence" that only look out for their own (or those they prefer) are removed.  It's the only way a change to a fairer sport can be achieved.

A bit to complex for me mate

Nowadays ,I honestly do think it's premeditated cheating .And it's driven from the top 100% 

[Colin Traive 22,754]

59 minutes ago, coopsleftboot said:

I don't. 

What I do think  is there's a climate of fear built up that makes match officials act instinctively (unconscious bias) because the culture they work in means there is likely to be consequences of decisions they make.  Look how aggressively celtic go after those who they perceive are unjust against them.  Look how at how rabid the press placements are when perceived injustices happen, look at how often officials are threatened by their fans, as they and their homes become targets.  All this creates a working climate that influences their decision making, whether they realise it's happening or not.

With respect to the organisation that's responsible for referees, I do believe they believe they're above all this and acting professionally and with  impartiality.  But they too are subject to the effects of the same climate....with the pressure often causing them to be too weak because some have to much power.  That's not just me saying that, that's a couple of dearly departed fellow SPFL chairmen who were so feart to be honest when they could have had effected change....such is the power and influence they felt was there.

Bottom line is it's being driven by Lawwell and his friends (Mulraney etc.) and all within the rules....but the influence and pressure (club, press, fans) brought to bare depending on who's broken what rule (once an incident is taken off the pitch) is where there is the potential for bias claim to be really levied.  Problem is the weakness of the SFA.  Criticism and pressure by celtic, their fans and press placements is an entirely different beast to pressure placed by anyone else, especially us...ours fizzles out and goes away...they don't.  It really needs US to take the lead and to be persistent, and if that means taking out of the football world, and this country (e.g. CAS) then that's what must happen.

The poisonous climate that's been cultivated, where an official can make an error of judgement that doesn't benefit one club and results in disproportionate scrutiny and criticism, can have a real impact on an officials professional and personal life and needs to be reversed for the good of the game.  Only way this will change is if there's a real shake up at Hampden, and the people with the "disproportionate power and influence" that only look out for their own (or those they prefer) are removed.  It's the only way a change to a fairer sport can be achieved.

I have some magic beans for sale, mate.

[Lets go 55 2,136]

Intimidation. 

[eejay the dj 31,964]

18 hours ago, doc holliday said:

Refs are far more punitive in calls against Rangers players  than celtic players.

 

When the evidence is there for all to see why try to  delude,deflect and deny.

 

There has to be a tipping point in all of this.

 

If it was the other way around Liewell ,Lennon and celtic fc would be screaming foul and demanding action .

They did this at our weakest point 

And got Dallas and McDonald hounded out of the game in Scotland .Both reffed wins for us at Bheastville 

They got a referees strike and all sorts of changes ,completely  for their benefit 

Including a Complance officer ,that has been a bheast lover since its inception 

[eejay the dj 31,964]

Does anyone know the name of the cunt that now runs the ref ?

The previous one died before Christmas 

[SeparateEntityMyArse 53,720]

1 hour ago, coopsleftboot said:

I don't. 

What I do think  is there's a climate of fear built up that makes match officials act instinctively (unconscious bias) because the culture they work in means there is likely to be consequences of decisions they make.  Look how aggressively celtic go after those who they perceive are unjust against them.  Look how at how rabid the press placements are when perceived injustices happen, look at how often officials are threatened by their fans, as they and their homes become targets.  All this creates a working climate that influences their decision making, whether they realise it's happening or not.

With respect to the organisation that's responsible for referees, I do believe they believe they're above all this and acting professionally and with  impartiality.  But they too are subject to the effects of the same climate....with the pressure often causing them to be too weak because some have to much power.  That's not just me saying that, that's a couple of dearly departed fellow SPFL chairmen who were so feart to be honest when they could have had effected change....such is the power and influence they felt was there.

Bottom line is it's being driven by Lawwell and his friends (Mulraney etc.) and all within the rules....but the influence and pressure (club, press, fans) brought to bare depending on who's broken what rule (once an incident is taken off the pitch) is where there is the potential for bias claim to be really levied.  Problem is the weakness of the SFA.  Criticism and pressure by celtic, their fans and press placements is an entirely different beast to pressure placed by anyone else, especially us...ours fizzles out and goes away...they don't.  It really needs US to take the lead and to be persistent, and if that means taking out of the football world, and this country (e.g. CAS) then that's what must happen.

The poisonous climate that's been cultivated, where an official can make an error of judgement that doesn't benefit one club and results in disproportionate scrutiny and criticism, can have a real impact on an officials professional and personal life and needs to be reversed for the good of the game.  Only way this will change is if there's a real shake up at Hampden, and the people with the "disproportionate power and influence" that only look out for their own (or those they prefer) are removed.  It's the only way a change to a fairer sport can be achieved.

I get what you're saying about unconscious bias. But refs and their supervisors review decisions and performances.

If you're saying they get them wrong, but dont correct the reason for it then it must become conscious for them that external factors are influencing decisions which over a period of time can only make it conscious bias.

You cant keep making wrong decisions and not take into account and resolve the influencing factors. If you do, its cheating.

[Flatcap 489]

As much as VAR is villified down South, Griffiths would be on a red if we had it up here.

[quabba 440]

30 minutes ago, SeparateEntityMyArse said:

I get what you're saying about unconscious bias. But refs and their supervisors review decisions and performances.

If you're saying they get them wrong, but dont correct the reason for it then it must become conscious for them that external factors are influencing decisions which over a period of time can only make it conscious bias.

You cant keep making wrong decisions and not take into account and resolve the influencing factors. If you do, its cheating.

that's my way of thinking about it as well mate. Got to come to a point when they actively know they are doing wrong and therefor cheating

[Lets go 55 2,136]

Taken from FF.

"This is fairly long winded however it’s only due to the amount of cheating that has occurred since the start of December.

Night of Aberdeen away - Cosgrove let off with a red card and 3 yellow card offences in the first 5 minutes. Rangers denied a stonewall penalty late in the game with the score at 2-2. On the same night, celtic allowed to commit 2 blatant fouls in the build up to their last minute winner at home to Hamilton.

LC final - celtic win the cup with a goal in which 3 players were offside. Rangers denied a second blatant penalty. Forster allowed to come at least a yard off his line to save the penalty we did get.

Weekend of Motherwell away - Morelos sent off for celebrating a goal after having missiles launched at him and receiving racist abuse.

Weekend of Hibs away - Rangers charged for misconduct of staff. Cosgrove sent off against celtic for a foul less severe than his over the ball studs showing tackle on Davis that he didn’t even get booked for 2 weeks earlier. Griffiths allowed to stamp on an Aberdeen player without any card or follow up citation.

Weekend of Old Firm - celtic allowed to equalise with a handball. celtic awarded a penalty for shirt pulling. Rangers denied 2 penalties for shirt pulling. Julien awarded a free kick for pulling down Morelos who was last man. Julien, Christie and Bolongoli not sent off for blatant bookable offences whilst on a yellow. Morelos sent off for diving. Rangers charged for misconduct of staff.

Night of St Mirren at home - Simonuvic allowed to elbow an opponent in the face away at Kilmarnock. Mickey Johnson allowed to dive. Griffiths allowed to goad a pundit and throw objects at opposition supporters without any booking or follow up citation.

Weekend of Hearts away - celtic awarded a penalty at home to Ross County for Mickey Johnson diving whilst celtic were struggling with the score at 0-0.

Weekend of Aberdeen at home - Cosgrove and Logan allowed to kick and wrestle their way through the game without even getting booked. Goldson booked for questioning it. Griffiths again allowed to stay on the park after stamping on an opponent. Griffiths allowed to dive without receiving a second yellow. Taylor allowed to commit a last man foul whilst on a yellow.

The above is just in 2 fûcking months. It’s absolutely staggering that our club just sit in silence whilst officials are cheating us on an almost weekly basis. It’s quite literally costing us trophies now.

Our entire game is run for the benefit of one team and the most tragic part is that the rest of Scottish football don’t give a fûck as long as they have a chance of taking points off of us."

Since December, Corruption,Intimidation and out and out cheating. And there are plenty more examples.refeerees are incompetent, bad at their job and we should be better these are the excuses for all these honest mistakes that have cost us a cup and countless points.

They know exactly what their doing and are excellent at their job ,the dignified silence has led us down this road.

 

[Courtyard Bear 41,357]

1 hour ago, coopsleftboot said:

I don't. 

What I do think  is there's a climate of fear built up that makes match officials act instinctively (unconscious bias) because the culture they work in means there is likely to be consequences of decisions they make.  Look how aggressively celtic go after those who they perceive are unjust against them.  Look how at how rabid the press placements are when perceived injustices happen, look at how often officials are threatened by their fans, as they and their homes become targets.  All this creates a working climate that influences their decision making, whether they realise it's happening or not.

With respect to the organisation that's responsible for referees, I do believe they believe they're above all this and acting professionally and with  impartiality.  But they too are subject to the effects of the same climate....with the pressure often causing them to be too weak because some have to much power.  That's not just me saying that, that's a couple of dearly departed fellow SPFL chairmen who were so feart to be honest when they could have had effected change....such is the power and influence they felt was there.

Bottom line is it's being driven by Lawwell and his friends (Mulraney etc.) and all within the rules....but the influence and pressure (club, press, fans) brought to bare depending on who's broken what rule (once an incident is taken off the pitch) is where there is the potential for bias claim to be really levied.  Problem is the weakness of the SFA.  Criticism and pressure by celtic, their fans and press placements is an entirely different beast to pressure placed by anyone else, especially us...ours fizzles out and goes away...they don't.  It really needs US to take the lead and to be persistent, and if that means taking out of the football world, and this country (e.g. CAS) then that's what must happen.

The poisonous climate that's been cultivated, where an official can make an error of judgement that doesn't benefit one club and results in disproportionate scrutiny and criticism, can have a real impact on an officials professional and personal life and needs to be reversed for the good of the game.  Only way this will change is if there's a real shake up at Hampden, and the people with the "disproportionate power and influence" that only look out for their own (or those they prefer) are removed.  It's the only way a change to a fairer sport can be achieved.

Great post mate and I agree with every part except the unconscious bias. 
For me they know exactly what they are doing, for some it’s simply so they and their family don’t get subjected to the usual threats and violence from the Fenians for others it’s simply they no longer have to hide behind a mask, no one is going to pull them up for giving Rangers a raw deal so they are free to do as they wish. 

[Courtyard Bear 41,357]

6 minutes ago, Flatcap said:

As much as VAR is villified down South, Griffiths would be on a red if we had it up here.

He would be in the stands long ago. 

[Lets go 55 2,136]

6 minutes ago, Flatcap said:

As much as VAR is villified down South, Griffiths would be on a red if we had it up here.

No he wouldn't a prick like Stewart ,Sutton or one of the honest refs would interpret it as a coming together. 

[Courtyard Bear 41,357]

12 minutes ago, Flatcap said:

As much as VAR is villified down South, Griffiths would be on a red if we had it up here.

Of course VAR is only as good as the folk in the bunker that rule on the video evidence. 
Do any of us have any faith in the SFA having impartial folk doing that job. 

[RS4_wul 4,115]

10 minutes ago, Lets go 55 said:

Taken from FF.

"This is fairly long winded however it’s only due to the amount of cheating that has occurred since the start of December.

Night of Aberdeen away - Cosgrove let off with a red card and 3 yellow card offences in the first 5 minutes. Rangers denied a stonewall penalty late in the game with the score at 2-2. On the same night, celtic allowed to commit 2 blatant fouls in the build up to their last minute winner at home to Hamilton.

LC final - celtic win the cup with a goal in which 3 players were offside. Rangers denied a second blatant penalty. Forster allowed to come at least a yard off his line to save the penalty we did get.

Weekend of Motherwell away - Morelos sent off for celebrating a goal after having missiles launched at him and receiving racist abuse.

Weekend of Hibs away - Rangers charged for misconduct of staff. Cosgrove sent off against celtic for a foul less severe than his over the ball studs showing tackle on Davis that he didn’t even get booked for 2 weeks earlier. Griffiths allowed to stamp on an Aberdeen player without any card or follow up citation.

Weekend of Old Firm - celtic allowed to equalise with a handball. celtic awarded a penalty for shirt pulling. Rangers denied 2 penalties for shirt pulling. Julien awarded a free kick for pulling down Morelos who was last man. Julien, Christie and Bolongoli not sent off for blatant bookable offences whilst on a yellow. Morelos sent off for diving. Rangers charged for misconduct of staff.

Night of St Mirren at home - Simonuvic allowed to elbow an opponent in the face away at Kilmarnock. Mickey Johnson allowed to dive. Griffiths allowed to goad a pundit and throw objects at opposition supporters without any booking or follow up citation.

Weekend of Hearts away - celtic awarded a penalty at home to Ross County for Mickey Johnson diving whilst celtic were struggling with the score at 0-0.

Weekend of Aberdeen at home - Cosgrove and Logan allowed to kick and wrestle their way through the game without even getting booked. Goldson booked for questioning it. Griffiths again allowed to stay on the park after stamping on an opponent. Griffiths allowed to dive without receiving a second yellow. Taylor allowed to commit a last man foul whilst on a yellow.

The above is just in 2 fûcking months. It’s absolutely staggering that our club just sit in silence whilst officials are cheating us on an almost weekly basis. It’s quite literally costing us trophies now.

Our entire game is run for the benefit of one team and the most tragic part is that the rest of Scottish football don’t give a fûck as long as they have a chance of taking points off of us."

Since December, Corruption,Intimidation and out and out cheating. And there are plenty more examples.refeerees are incompetent, bad at their job and we should be better these are the excuses for all these honest mistakes that have cost us a cup and countless points.

They know exactly what their doing and are excellent at their job ,the dignified silence has led us down this road.

 

Fucking unreal when you see it in black and white and the bit in bold sums up this tin pot league.......as long as it fucks over Rangers, fans of all other clubs will accept it.

[Flatcap 489]

2 minutes ago, Courtyard Bear said:

Of course VAR is only as good as the folk in the bunker that rule on the video evidence. 
Do any of us have any faith in the SFA having impartial folk doing that job. 

mmmm, fair point. Not saying they are any better but maybe it could be contracted out to the EPL as they have the experience. To be honest, i'm not sure i want to see VAR up here but for every bad decision they make, they also make some good ones and they are able to focus on the 'off the ball' stuff too. For all the howling down South, it seems the reaction to it is as across the board and apart from ludicrous claims that Liverpool are favoured (as if they need the help) it is generally accepted now that it is here to stay.

[RS4_wul 4,115]

After seeing cosgrove and numerous other cloggers constantly getting off with booting fuck out of/blocking with no attempt to play the ball/pulling our players back by the jersey/elbowing etc. all with no punishment whatsoever...........What odds on Morelos getting a yellow for his second or third niggley foul tomorrow night?

Rhetorical question. 

[coopsleftboot 5,512]

1 hour ago, eejay the dj said:

A bit to complex for me mate

Nowadays ,I honestly do think it's premeditated cheating .And it's driven from the top 100% 

I don't think it's premeditated, but more reactionary because of the environment they're working in.  However, it could quite easily get to premeditated if the culture of doing so protects their livelihood and family.

 

1 hour ago, Colin Traive said:

I have some magic beans for sale, mate.

You think it's fanciful?  To me it's been brewing for ages, and you can see their emboldened recently with their recent attacks on officialdom over Christie. Griffiths and Griffiths again....free to set the narrative which creates the culture and whips the hordes up.  

 

51 minutes ago, SeparateEntityMyArse said:

I get what you're saying about unconscious bias. But refs and their supervisors review decisions and performances.

If you're saying they get them wrong, but dont correct the reason for it then it must become conscious for them that external factors are influencing decisions which over a period of time can only make it conscious bias.

You cant keep making wrong decisions and not take into account and resolve the influencing factors. If you do, its cheating.

Despite the rush to call this cheating, I don't think it's there yet.  Undue influence and pressure is playing a greater part imv, and only changing the culture by changing the people in charge would start to even things out.