STEPPS BOY 73,141 Posted February 24, 2020 Share Posted February 24, 2020 10 minutes ago, DBBTB said: The lack of threat from these areas is what is killing us IMO. They cunts have Forrest, Christie and McGrgeor who all contribute a decent number of goals and assists (28 goals, 30 assists between them in the league) and we have Kent, Aribo and Jack ( 13 goals and 11 assists between them in the league) We need to give our midfielders more freedom to play (Jack should be our deepest midfielder) and stop having them be so rigid and slow in possession. You play 4-3-3 if you’ve got the players to do it. if playing 4-3-3 you need a 25-30 goal striker, 15-20 goals from each wide attacker, 20 goals from CAM and other two mids chipping in with say 12 between them. Bar Alfie, we simply dont have those players. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueSuedeSambas 53,548 Posted February 24, 2020 Share Posted February 24, 2020 8 minutes ago, BlueKnight87 said: 3 at the back is something we should look at. We only ever really tried it once vs Motherwell away and it was scrapped. I think the only thing stopping us trying it is that Kent cost us so much money (shouldn’t be an excuse but I think it is) but with the way Gerrard instructs him to come inside so much anyway he could easily play through the middle too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimfanciesthedude 24,358 Posted February 24, 2020 Share Posted February 24, 2020 11 minutes ago, STEPPS BOY said: You play 4-3-3 if you’ve got the players to do it. if playing 4-3-3 you need a 25-30 goal striker, 15-20 goals from each wide attacker, 20 goals from CAM and other two mids chipping in with say 12 between them. Bar Alfie, we simply dont have those players. Our 433 doesnt use wide attackers, they are number tens so they dont get up in the box as much Imo a 433 has to wide wingers essentially, with support from their fullbacks, and in scotland we could still have 2 number tens against all bar the tarriers as everyone sits so deep With the players we have id play Tav, goldson, katic or Edmundson , barisic Jack Hagi, arfield as number tens Aribo and kent as wide attackers Morelos or kamberi up top But right now i fucking hate the 433 so much id play anything to get shot of it Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
johanhentze 14,019 Posted February 24, 2020 Share Posted February 24, 2020 On 23/02/2020 at 15:30, Sket said: 10 points dropped this year isnt individual error. We have had a lot of individual errors that have lead directly to goals against. Add to that a striker that doesnt put his chances away then you end up losing those points. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
johanhentze 14,019 Posted February 24, 2020 Share Posted February 24, 2020 17 minutes ago, STEPPS BOY said: You play 4-3-3 if you’ve got the players to do it. if playing 4-3-3 you need a 25-30 goal striker, 15-20 goals from each wide attacker, 20 goals from CAM and other two mids chipping in with say 12 between them. Bar Alfie, we simply dont have those players. And Alfie isnt scoring these days. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammer93 15,024 Posted February 24, 2020 Share Posted February 24, 2020 20 minutes ago, STEPPS BOY said: You play 4-3-3 if you’ve got the players to do it. if playing 4-3-3 you need a 25-30 goal striker, 15-20 goals from each wide attacker, 20 goals from CAM and other two mids chipping in with say 12 between them. Bar Alfie, we simply dont have those players. You need to have players of the ilk of Gazza, Albertz, De Boer and Laudrup for those sort of figures, as you say we are a far cry from that level of player 👍 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
STEPPS BOY 73,141 Posted February 24, 2020 Share Posted February 24, 2020 11 minutes ago, Jimbeamjunior said: Our 433 doesnt use wide attackers, they are number tens so they dont get up in the box as much Imo a 433 has to wide wingers essentially, with support from their fullbacks, and in scotland we could still have 2 number tens against all bar the tarriers as everyone sits so deep With the players we have id play Tav, goldson, katic or Edmundson , barisic Jack Hagi, arfield as number tens Aribo and kent as wide attackers Morelos or kamberi up top But right now i fucking hate the 433 so much id play anything to get shot of it It looks to me recently that we’ve went back to the wingers. Kent has been back on left wing more. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
beararse 6,324 Posted February 24, 2020 Share Posted February 24, 2020 30 minutes ago, Jimbeamjunior said: Consistency thing is bollocks, if our guys were inconsistent we wouldnt have been 2 behind with a game in hand at new year, we wouldnt have went unbeaten from the tarrier home game until after the winter break What it is, is that teams have came up eitha way to stifle gerrards one way of playing, and were snookered without a new way Consistently performing over the entire season is what I meant. We clearly can’t sustain a challenge, so they are inconsistent, as they were well up till Xmas. Similarly, we have just beaten a team which has beaten the 3 best teams in Portugal and was unbeaten in 9 yet we can’t keep a 2-1 lead v St Johnstone 3 days later what’s not inconsistent about that? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue Avenger 22,567 Posted February 24, 2020 Share Posted February 24, 2020 3 minutes ago, johanhentze said: We have had a lot of individual errors that have lead directly to goals against. Add to that a striker that doesnt put his chances away then you end up losing those points. Ohh ffs. You are nothing if not persistent! No apologies, but you do understand that even Messi makes mistakes? You do understand that pretty much all players make mistakes in every game? It's called being human. What makes teams consistent is how they are set up. The basic building block of a football team ffs.. Setting up the pattern of play. Get that wrong your pushing boulders up hill. The team develops a playing style, but in training tries out different formations to plan for different scenarios that they might come across in the different oppo they have to face.. Now jump over to the scum. When Eduard isn't scoring, the thumb does, . Then it's Christie, then it's Forrest and all also contributing in many assists. You see a pattern emerging? Bearing absolutely no resemblence to ours.. You see how they are set up? They are set up to attack the opposition in this shitehole as they are piss poor. You do also notice that TLB changes the system to suit the oppo he is playing when it comes to Europe? He even went two up to demolish the dross we play in this shitehole. What do we do? Persist with a tried and failed set up, that every cunt has sussed and now making a cunt of us and leaving us a mile behind the scum. Our midfield can't break up shite because they are over ran with three in there, that and their limited ability. Constantly playing the ball in our own half, every fucking game. We are being set up to play like that. Is it any wonder our defence are under pressure and forced into mistakes? Then there is our mid to front play. I've seen paint dry quicker, so every cunt is closed down. We are set up to play like that. So the lesson is get plan A right, but if it turns to shite for whatever reason, then have a well honed plan B in reserve. If your plan A consistently turn to shite, then you have the wrong plan A., so you either change it to something better, or get to fuck out of the job as you're an imposter! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
johanhentze 14,019 Posted February 24, 2020 Share Posted February 24, 2020 Just now, Blue Avenger said: Ohh ffs. You are nothing if not persistent! No apologies, but you do understand that even Messi makes mistakes? You do understand that pretty much all players make mistakes in every game? It's called being human. What makes teams consistent is how they are set up. The basic building block of a football team ffs.. Setting up the pattern of play. Get that wrong your pushing boulders up hill. The team develops a playing style, but in training tries out different formations to plan for different scenarios that they might come across in the different oppo they have to face.. Now jump over to the scum. When Eduard isn't scoring, the thumb does, . Then it's Christie, then it's Forrest and all also contributing in many assists. You see a pattern emerging? Bearing absolutely no resemblence to ours.. You see how they are set up? They are set up to attack the opposition in this shitehole as they are piss poor. You do also notice that TLB changes the system to suit the oppo he is playing when it comes to Europe? He even went two up to demolish the dross we play in this shitehole. What do we do? Persist with a tried and failed set up, that every cunt has sussed and now making a cunt of us and leaving us a mile behind the scum. Our midfield can't break up shite because they are over ran with three in there, that and their limited ability. Constantly playing the ball in our own half, every fucking game. We are being set up to play like that. Is it any wonder our defence are under pressure and forced into mistakes? Then there is our mid to front play. I've seen paint dry quicker, so every cunt is closed down. We are set up to play like that. So the lesson is get plan A right, but if it turns to shite for whatever reason, then have a well honed plan B in reserve. If your plan A consistently turn to shite, then you have the wrong plan A., so you either change it to something better, or get to fuck out of the job as you're an imposter! Same can be said about yourself. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rusty117 123 Posted February 24, 2020 Share Posted February 24, 2020 If he doesnt start trying a new system with whats left of the season he has to go. He is far too cautious. Aribo, hagi, kent, alf and kamberi should all be starting and told to unleash fucking hell. Let jack and the defenders take care of what comes the other way. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammer93 15,024 Posted February 24, 2020 Share Posted February 24, 2020 1 minute ago, Rusty117 said: If he doesnt start trying a new system with whats left of the season he has to go. He is far too cautious. Aribo, hagi, kent, alf and kamberi should all be starting and told to unleash fucking hell. Let jack and the defenders take care of what comes the other way. The problem is the defender aren't taking care what's coming at them at the other end Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rusty117 123 Posted February 24, 2020 Share Posted February 24, 2020 If were battering teams like we should then the fuck ups become less of an issue. Plus most teams give up when 2 down. Were getting 1 up and gerrard wants to hold out. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammer93 15,024 Posted February 24, 2020 Share Posted February 24, 2020 16 minutes ago, johanhentze said: Same can be said about yourself. Forget it bud, the fact that a centre half giving away 2 goals in a 2-2 draw is lost on him, hark all day about systems, tactics, subs etc etc but if we are giving cheap goals away we will win fuck all....simples Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rusty117 123 Posted February 24, 2020 Share Posted February 24, 2020 3 minutes ago, hammer93 said: Forget it bud, the fact that a centre half giving away 2 goals in a 2-2 draw is lost on him, hark all day about systems, tactics, subs etc etc but if we are giving cheap goals away we will win fuck all....simples But players will always make mistakes. No manager would ever be sacked if we just said the player fucked up. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammer93 15,024 Posted February 24, 2020 Share Posted February 24, 2020 1 minute ago, Rusty117 said: If were battering teams like we should then the fuck ups become less of an issue. Plus most teams give up when 2 down. Were getting 1 up and gerrard wants to hold out. Fuck ups are an issue even if you win the game, it becomes apparent who you can trust when the going gets tough like yesterday, on a day like yesterday where we created 22 chances and only scored 2 then you need to rely on your rearguard to do a professional job and give fuck all away, what we got was amateur defending from the start from both Goldson & Katic Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammer93 15,024 Posted February 24, 2020 Share Posted February 24, 2020 1 minute ago, Rusty117 said: But players will always make mistakes. No manager would ever be sacked if we just said the player fucked up. Of course players make mistakes, it just so happens the mistakes we are making are leading to goals which have been proved as game changing moments Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rusty117 123 Posted February 24, 2020 Share Posted February 24, 2020 Just now, hammer93 said: Fuck ups are an issue even if you win the game, it becomes apparent who you can trust when the going gets tough like yesterday, on a day like yesterday where we created 22 chances and only scored 2 then you need to rely on your rearguard to do a professional job and give fuck all away, what we got was amateur defending from the start from both Goldson & Katic We were pinning them in and swamping them when he made the change at ht. Took the lead and instead of putting boot to throat and getting that 3rd, killing the game. He reverted back to what wasnt working and allowed them to gain momentum. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
crazy bob swollenbaws 1,857 Posted February 24, 2020 Share Posted February 24, 2020 1 minute ago, hammer93 said: Of course players make mistakes, it just so happens the mistakes we are making are leading to goals which have been proved as game changing moments Was it the defences fault we could only draw with aberdeen? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rusty117 123 Posted February 24, 2020 Share Posted February 24, 2020 1 minute ago, hammer93 said: Of course players make mistakes, it just so happens the mistakes we are making are leading to goals which have been proved as game changing moments Most goals are caused by mistakes by someone though. So at what point does the manager get blamed for poor results. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue Avenger 22,567 Posted February 24, 2020 Share Posted February 24, 2020 3 minutes ago, hammer93 said: Forget it bud, the fact that a centre half giving away 2 goals in a 2-2 draw is lost on him, hark all day about systems, tactics, subs etc etc but if we are giving cheap goals away we will win fuck all....simples Wrong. It's not lost on me and yes as I've previously stated mistakes do cost goals, but they need not cost you games. However, if you are not better overall than the oppo, you will not win games, far less a title. If you cannot see that the way this team is set up and the way we play is dug shite, then you are Stevie Wonder. Stick to braille. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leeds_Bear 8,062 Posted February 24, 2020 Share Posted February 24, 2020 5 hours ago, Gaffbear said: You're being a bit harsh for not topping our europa league group .. gerard has been in the job proper for 18 months and it's his first job. Were all fuckin raging and want to topple they cunts but constant change of manager isn't the answer . Maybe someone of experience in as a help. Souness in the boardroom maybe ? My point was we bottle it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rusty117 123 Posted February 24, 2020 Share Posted February 24, 2020 2 minutes ago, Blue Avenger said: Wrong. It's not lost on me and yes as I've previously stated mistakes do cost goals, but they need not cost you games. However, if you are not better overall than the oppo, you will not win games, far less a title. If you cannot see that the way this team is set up and the way we play is dug shite, then you are Stevie Wonder. Stick to braille. What i always find amusing is under gerrards style having 3 cm who mainly provide cover for the centre backs, in his playing days he'd prob not fit into our style. He roamed way too much. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueKnight87 17,242 Posted February 24, 2020 Share Posted February 24, 2020 1 hour ago, DBBTB said: I think the only thing stopping us trying it is that Kent cost us so much money (shouldn’t be an excuse but I think it is) but with the way Gerrard instructs him to come inside so much anyway he could easily play through the middle too. I think it's possible to do it with Kent in the side as a winger. It does mean dropping Barasic. McGregor Edmundson Katic Goldson Tav Jack Aribo Kent Hagi Morelos Kamberi It's very much an emphasis on attack. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammer93 15,024 Posted February 24, 2020 Share Posted February 24, 2020 16 minutes ago, Rusty117 said: We were pinning them in and swamping them when he made the change at ht. Took the lead and instead of putting boot to throat and getting that 3rd, killing the game. He reverted back to what wasnt working and allowed them to gain momentum. What momentum a punt up the park that the centre halfs failed to deal with, Morelos had a great chance to kill the game off but missed it.....Morelos has looked a shadow of the player and rightly deserved hooked as did kent, I suppose the naivety that Gerrard showed was believing that at 2-1 up he could rely on that defense to see the game out, big mistake that was Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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