The coronavirus and the sfa

[mitre_mouldmaster 21,509]

1 minute ago, Howsitgoing said:

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2881682-aleksander-ceferin-fake-news-uefa-will-advise-leagues-to-finish-early
 

This article elaborates his thoughts better, the SFA/SPFL have no chance to gift their team the title,

I dont think it does.

its just the same quote. The author of the article has just put a bit more of a spin on it.

[The Dude 20,026]

2 minutes ago, Howsitgoing said:

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2881682-aleksander-ceferin-fake-news-uefa-will-advise-leagues-to-finish-early
 

This article elaborates his thoughts better, the SFA/SPFL have no chance to gift their team the title,

Its literally the exact same quotes. 

[Howsitgoing 4,281]

1 minute ago, mitre_mouldmaster said:

I dont think it does.

its just the same quote. The author of the article has just put a bit more of a spin on it.

 

1 minute ago, The Dude said:

Its literally the exact same quotes. 

Yes ok I give up, what you can’t argue against is SPFL waiting for UEFA to make the decision for them isn’t going to happen. Argumentatively their rule book doesn’t allow for anything other than null and void. 

[The Dude 20,026]

5 minutes ago, mitre_mouldmaster said:

Still highlights how absurd the whole situation is.

Ajax could be declared Champions, being level on points at the top of the league, and Liverpool could be denied the championship even though they are miles in the lead. All down to the discretion of their governing bodies and their interpretation of the rules.

From some leagues, you could have teams earning champions league spaces based on their current standing, other leagues, teams getting champions league spaces based on previous years standings.

Uefa should be coming to the front lines here and unifying the approach as the next European competitions are going to be a joke.

It does, the whole thing is destined to end in a massive shit show. 

Striclty speaking, that's the same every year with European qualifiers, theres always FA discretion there, but it could see situations exactly as suggested depending on individual rulebooks. 

One of the issues I've seen with the PL is they don't appear to have the 'board discretion' language in their season definition/rules yet use a near identical one to SPFL (date of first-last game) which could pose a problem of its own. 

At a guess, UEFA don't want to make a precedent by stepping in over domestic leagues and mandating something which is a domestic matter. They may not even have legal authority. Can they overrule the leagues rules on it without THAT also being challenged by someone who loses out? 

 

[mitre_mouldmaster 21,509]

3 minutes ago, The Dude said:

It does, the whole thing is destined to end in a massive shit show. 

Striclty speaking, that's the same every year with European qualifiers, theres always FA discretion there, but it could see situations exactly as suggested depending on individual rulebooks. 

One of the issues I've seen with the PL is they don't appear to have the 'board discretion' language in their season definition/rules yet use a near identical one to SPFL (date of first-last game) which could pose a problem of its own. 

At a guess, UEFA don't want to make a precedent by stepping in over domestic leagues and mandating something which is a domestic matter. They may not even have legal authority. Can they overrule the leagues rules on it without THAT also being challenged by someone who loses out? 

 

To be honest, I genuinely think there is being too much put on the 'board discretion' part of the SPFL rules. They legally wont have total discretion, as this would mean  a choice they have, has tangible effects on the earnings of clubs. They would have to show why their choice is the most fair, otherwise they would lose a legal fight.

I have come round to thinking that the SPFL have more chance of being able to do what you say they want to do. At the same time, I feel like they are now less likely to actually do it than I did at the start of this argument. 

[The Dude 20,026]

6 minutes ago, mitre_mouldmaster said:

To be honest, I genuinely think there is being too much put on the 'board discretion' part of the SPFL rules. They legally wont have total discretion, as this would mean  a choice they have, has tangible effects on the earnings of clubs. They would have to show why their choice is the most fair, otherwise they would lose a legal fight.

I have come round to thinking that the SPFL have more chance of being able to do what you say they want to do. At the same time, I feel like they are now less likely to actually do it than I did at the start of this argument. 

It would be the other way I think, clubs would need to show why other options were fairer than the one they took.

I actually agree with your last sentence there. I do get the feeling clubs are a little bit more emboldened over the last few days but I think they'll still try and fudge something rather than a full reset.

From speaking to my guy yesterday, and a couple other bits and pieces Ive since seen and heard, it looks like there are basically three options

Standings as is. titles etc..

Some form of reconstruction (literally no idea what would happen in terms of titles in that scenario)

UEFA intervenes.

I don't think the third one is a real possibility for the reasons I said a post or two ago. The second one could happen but it I'm far from convinced the Premiership clubs would back it as none have really shown any interest other than Budge - and that's more about self-preservation imo. If the smaller clubs can somehow drive the push for reconstruction towards being a realistic option then it's anybody's guess what concessions are made and by whom - and what happens to the titles etc.

[Dave Hedgehog 10,673]

3 months to go of no actual football but plenty bickering, indecision and passing the buck.

Its going to be a long 3 months 👍

[mitre_mouldmaster 21,509]

1 minute ago, The Dude said:

It would be the other way I think, clubs would need to show why other options were fairer than the one they took.

I actually agree with your last sentence there. I do get the feeling clubs are a little bit more emboldened over the last few days but I think they'll still try and fudge something rather than a full reset.

From speaking to my guy yesterday, and a couple other bits and pieces Ive since seen and heard, it looks like there are basically three options

Standings as is. titles etc..

Some form of reconstruction (literally no idea what would happen in terms of titles in that scenario)

UEFA intervenes.

I don't think the third one is a real possibility for the reasons I said a post or two ago. The second one could happen but it I'm far from convinced the Premiership clubs would back it as none have really shown any interest other than Budge - and that's more about self-preservation imo. If the smaller clubs can somehow drive the push for reconstruction towards being a realistic option then it's anybody's guess what concessions are made and by whom - and what happens to the titles etc.

I think it would be possible to show why keeping the leagues as they are now would be more unfair.

If the league is voided, then everyone is treated equally unfairly.

If the leagues were called now, as they stand, everyone would be treated equally unfairly, except for teams who had played less games, who would be more unfairly punished than anyone. If all teams had played the same number of games, then it would probably have been on par with voiding the leagues.

[Sweetheart 8,458]

I think the big-boss-man FIFA will instruct that a panel will be formed consisting of the 6 main football federations; UEFA, CONCACAF, CONMEBOL, AFC, CAF & OFC.  as each federation runs its own competition for both its national sides and its clubs.  I think each league will be sorted on a case by case hearing where ALL clubs within the league have a voice. leaving CAS as a final option.

The announcement the other day buys them time to set up a panel of this sort, as they must realise no club will be able to finish their fixtures will the pandemic.

 

[The Dude 20,026]

Just now, mitre_mouldmaster said:

I think it would be possible to show why keeping the leagues as they are now would be more unfair.

If the league is voided, then everyone is treated equally unfairly.

If the leagues were called now, as they stand, everyone would be treated equally unfairly, except for teams who had played less games, who would be more unfairly punished than anyone. If all teams had played the same number of games, then it would probably have been on par with voiding the leagues.

But there's still questions over whether null and void would affect commercial contracts etc, something in the telegraph (i think) yesterday saying the PL believe it would and could cost them hundreds of millions - hence the desperation to get games finished

[eejay the dj 31,964]

1 hour ago, Jimbeamjunior said:

 

So it will apply here too 😂😂😂😂

[eejay the dj 31,964]

Someone is sheepishly backtracking on here 

no names 😄😄let you guess 

 

[mitre_mouldmaster 21,509]

1 minute ago, The Dude said:

But there's still questions over whether null and void would affect commercial contracts etc, something in the telegraph (i think) yesterday saying the PL believe it would and could cost them hundreds of millions - hence the desperation to get games finished

Sporting integrity must come first IMO.

They have ripped up commercial contracts in the past which seen the league suffer to ensure that Rangers were punished.

They cannot and should not use the argument that sporting integrity is now secondary to finance in a decision that would see celtic awarded a league title.

There is a certain amount of vindictiveness in this from me, but you could not argue it is unfair. Sporting integrity was a bullshit excuse used to excessively punish us, but they have introduced it as the be-all and end-all of things. They cant change that now.

[The Dude 20,026]

Just now, eejay the dj said:

Someone is sheepishly backtracking on here 

no names 😄😄let you guess 

 

Not at all.

The SPFLs plan is what it is. There's literally nothing from Ceferin which says that leagues will be null and void if not completed by June 30th.

I fully expect that come June 30th, leagues that aren't completed by June 30th will be left to domestic FA's and leagues to find a solution.

I've heard nothing from anyone that suggests the SPFL have changed tact and afaik are still intending to declare the season over if games can't be completed (they cant)

[MurrayWilson 3,373]

16 minutes ago, Dave Hedgehog said:

3 months to go of no actual football but plenty bickering, indecision and passing the buck.

Its going to be a long 3 months 👍

Exactly the same as when the football is on then!

[Bears r us 30,771]

3 hours ago, B1872 said:

Still can't believe Jim Duffy rattled Kirsty Gallacher man.

[Dave Hedgehog 10,673]

4 minutes ago, MurrayWilson said:

Exactly the same as when the football is on then!

😂😂👍

[Redwhiteandblue 3,330]

7 hours ago, dummiesoot said:

@The Dude has some stamina to keep on here arguing with folk beneath him almost full time 

That's the thing with sociopaths. 

[sausagetrunks 6,016]

36 minutes ago, eejay the dj said:

Someone is sheepishly backtracking on here 

no names 😄😄let you guess 

 

looks like a Declan and acts like a Declan  ?

[Dave Hedgehog 10,673]

In 1961 Manchester City we’re pumping Luton Town 6-2 with Denis Law scoring all 6.

The match was abandoned in the 69th minute.

The game was played again 4 days later and Man City lost 3-1.

Now I know the circumstances are different for obvious reasons but the premise that the match wasn’t won when cancelled despite the score line must be the be all and end all of the sports integrity.

The integrity of the game must be upheld. 

You either replay or finish. Nothing else can change that.

[MurrayWilson 3,373]

Hearts have asked their players to go on half pay, that's before they try and relegate them. That's why they will have to fight that proposal all the way as hard as they can.

[writingranger 1,412]

2 hours ago, mitre_mouldmaster said:

Still highlights how absurd the whole situation is.

Ajax could be declared Champions, being level on points at the top of the league, and Liverpool could be denied the championship even though they are miles in the lead. All down to the discretion of their governing bodies and their interpretation of the rules.

From some leagues, you could have teams earning champions league spaces based on their current standing, other leagues, teams getting champions league spaces based on previous years standings.

Uefa should be coming to the front lines here and unifying the approach as the next European competitions are going to be a joke.

I assume that the spfl could schedule some games but not old firm games making sure we can't overtake them.

[Howsitgoing 4,281]

4 minutes ago, MurrayWilson said:

Hearts have asked their players to go on half pay, that's before they try and relegate them. That's why they will have to fight that proposal all the way as hard as they can.

If spfl/sfa doesn’t stop concentrating on how they can manipulate rules to gift their club a league title some clubs are going to fold. Apparently they can use their insurance policy but it can only be done when the league has been regarded as finished. 
They have admitted that UEFA’s deadline is not possible, end this farce.

[eejay the dj 31,964]

32 minutes ago, writingranger said:

I assume that the spfl could schedule some games but not old firm games making sure we can't overtake them.

That’s what will happen most likely 

Corruption will still be on high alert with these bastards 

It’s a pity that Liverpool have their situation .The bheasts will just ride in on their coattails   .All the Liverpool explayers and fans in a panic now .Pushing for all games to be played .Fuck next season 😄

[Sweetheart 8,458]

C1872  statement