SeparateEntityMyArse 53,613 Posted March 15, 2020 Share Posted March 15, 2020 18 minutes ago, The Dude said: Champions aren't at the end of the comp but at the end of the Season. Board have discretion to end the Season early. Clubs shall play 38 games in a season is a standalone rule. From that you wish to focus on the definition of season, saying the Board have the discretion to end season early. That's ambiguous at best, and then doesnt transpose into the 38 game in a season ruling as it is contradictory. I think the reason its contradictory is wrong to be interpreted that way, simply put the correct rule is that the season is one where clubs shall play 38 games. The board have the discretion to affect the duration between the dates of the first (one) and last (38th) game. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barasa 802 Posted March 15, 2020 Share Posted March 15, 2020 If the plague had taken hold after 10 games, or 20, & the rest of the season lost, would there be talk of anything other than null & void? I don't think so. So what's the difference? None. If Gerrard would be content at Liverpool being gifted the title, then he is saying we couldn't have caught the paedo harbourers. Surrender monkey behaviour. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomatasauce 1,253 Posted March 15, 2020 Share Posted March 15, 2020 9 minutes ago, The Dude said: I believe UEFA will set a deadline for domestic associations to have their league and cup competitions ended by (probably July 31st). If they can't play games before that date, they'll be told to enforce whatever provisions they have in their rulebook or come up with a satisfactory resolution with their members. UEFA may even set up a special arbitration panel as a result for any disputes. If domestic cups aren't resolved, Euro places will go the the relevant team per each FAs rules and the various UEFA competitions for 19/20 will be scrapped with coefficient points frozen and unearned prize money distributed across FAs using some sort of formula to help them with the financial problems several months of no football has brought. In terms of scottish domestic cups, they'll be scrapped with no winner named. So, yeah, there will be no treble although existing league standing will be frozen and considered the final standings for 19/20. Let me ask you this, if they decided to give the tarriers the title but refused to relegate anybody do you think that’s fair and we should just accept it? Cos that’s what’s likely to happen imo, instead of doing it how they would in other non corrupt fair leagues by having no champions or relegation we will see a bit of half and half to appease the fenians, champions declared but relegation scrapped Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
evenstevens 890 Posted March 15, 2020 Share Posted March 15, 2020 The ramifications of simply deciding to award prizes and titles and relegations based on where we are now extend way beyond tainted titles that it won't be the decision taken. There is also no way to quantify what a "fair margin" when taking decisions would be either. If the Dude is correct then I'm pretty sure football as we know it is done, there's no coming back from such a stupid and utterly ridiculous decision like that and the courts will be jammed. Pun intended. I'd probably also lose interest in playing in our league as well tbh but thats personal to me. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeparateEntityMyArse 53,613 Posted March 15, 2020 Share Posted March 15, 2020 41 minutes ago, The Dude said: There may be scope to challenge it but from the folk I've spoken to, they don't think it would have any chance of success and would be clubs wasting money on legal fees at a time when clubs will be fighting for their lives. The biggest issue is Partick/QOTS at the bottom of he championship. Queens ahead with a game in hand but less than three clear. I've not heard anything on how they plan to resolve that one but if the season is ended now, that's the only situation that throws up any potential difficulties for them - A playoff between them may be the best option but there are still lots of things up in the air. The title/relegation stuff in the other divisions is relatively clear cut. The season will be based on the games played to this point. No average points, no hypotheticals, purely on what has happened to date and the result which are in the books. There had been suggestions of expanding the league to scrap relegation but it seems very unlikely as it would leave you needing to bring a number of clubs up from the lowland/highland league to fill the gaps left as they are very unlikely to just scrap league two completely. I've not been in any of the meetings with the SPFL and SFA so dont know everything that's been suggested but everything I've heard says this is what there position is just now. It could obviously change - and UEFA's meeting on Tuesday could really change a lot - but it seems there position is that there's less problems caused by ending the season a bit early than there is by declaring it null and void. Folk not wanting to challenge based on financial risks of doing so is entirely understandable. That absolutely does not make the decision they feel unable to challenge the correct one morally, legally or in a sporting integrity sense. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude 20,026 Posted March 15, 2020 Share Posted March 15, 2020 Just now, Howsitgoing said: Taking your argument as fact would celtic of been champions if the season ended directly after the last oldfirm game. They were top of the league by 1point but Rangers had a game in hand? No idea, totally different circumstances. Would there be any prospect of Rangers getting to play the game in hand? Would the season be able to be resumed in the near future? Was there a threat of withdrawal of labour from the players union if Rangers had to play the game in hand behind closed doors to get to a level number of games? As I've said repeatedly, I can only go on the circumstances as they are. I've absolutely no idea what the SPFL would choose to do - or could legally do - if some random hypothetical happened. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moody Blue Legend 61,387 Posted March 15, 2020 Share Posted March 15, 2020 If I take anything from this whole episode it’s that voided is a word. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude 20,026 Posted March 15, 2020 Share Posted March 15, 2020 2 minutes ago, evenstevens said: The ramifications of simply deciding to award prizes and titles and relegations based on where we are now extend way beyond tainted titles that it won't be the decision taken. There is also no way to quantify what a "fair margin" when taking decisions would be either. If the Dude is correct then I'm pretty sure football as we know it is done, there's no coming back from such a stupid and utterly ridiculous decision like that and the courts will be jammed. Pun intended. I'd probably also lose interest in playing in our league as well tbh but thats personal to me. Happened in Chile four months ago. Court cases raised - 0. Expected to be confirmed on Thursday that Liverpool are Premier League champions. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MurrayWilson 3,369 Posted March 15, 2020 Share Posted March 15, 2020 Just now, SeparateEntityMyArse said: Folk not wanting to challenge based on financial risks of doing so is entirely understandable. That absolutely does not make the decision they feel unable to challenge the correct one morally, legally or in a sporting integrity sense. Hearts will challenge it, most definitely. And they would win I reckon. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude 20,026 Posted March 15, 2020 Share Posted March 15, 2020 3 minutes ago, Tomatasauce said: Let me ask you this, if they decided to give the tarriers the title but refused to relegate anybody do you think that’s fair and we should just accept it? Cos that’s what’s likely to happen imo, instead of doing it how they would in other non corrupt fair leagues by having no champions or relegation we will see a bit of half and half to appease the fenians, champions declared but relegation scrapped It's not what's likely to happen. Reconstruction won't happen as Sky will almost certainly veto losing two Old Firm games each season. The Premier League are expected to confirm Liverpool as Champions on Thursday. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomatasauce 1,253 Posted March 15, 2020 Share Posted March 15, 2020 3 minutes ago, The Dude said: Happened in Chile four months ago. Court cases raised - 0. Expected to be confirmed on Thursday that Liverpool are Premier League champions. Aye because the other clubs agreed to it, well us and hearts won’t agree so not the same to bring this tarrier argument up Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude 20,026 Posted March 15, 2020 Share Posted March 15, 2020 Just now, Tomatasauce said: Aye because the other clubs agreed to it, we’ll us and hearts won’t agree so not the same to bring this tarrier argument up Karren Brady was out yesterday saying it should be null and void. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeparateEntityMyArse 53,613 Posted March 15, 2020 Share Posted March 15, 2020 2 minutes ago, The Dude said: Happened in Chile four months ago. Court cases raised - 0. Expected to be confirmed on Thursday that Liverpool are Premier League champions. Ah, Chile again 😁 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howsitgoing 4,281 Posted March 15, 2020 Share Posted March 15, 2020 3 minutes ago, The Dude said: No idea, totally different circumstances. Would there be any prospect of Rangers getting to play the game in hand? Would the season be able to be resumed in the near future? Was there a threat of withdrawal of labour from the players union if Rangers had to play the game in hand behind closed doors to get to a level number of games? As I've said repeatedly, I can only go on the circumstances as they are. I've absolutely no idea what the SPFL would choose to do - or could legally do - if some random hypothetical happened. So the rule you quote can only work in a certain circumstance say one where they want to gift a football team a title that they weren’t capable of getting. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude 20,026 Posted March 15, 2020 Share Posted March 15, 2020 Just now, SeparateEntityMyArse said: Ah, Chile again 😁 Yep. A FIFA sanctioned league which has ended its season early and awarded the trophies. and only just within the last few months. Certainly not a 'precedent' but this idea that giving titles out just to appease celtic because 'corruption' is fucking wild. Chile done it, the PL are expected to do the same. Nobody suggests corruption. Happens here and you've got cunts saying they'll be done with fitba etc. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Hedgehog 10,673 Posted March 15, 2020 Share Posted March 15, 2020 If the SPFL board need to meet to discuss what should happen next then there is no rule in place to declare any team champion after any amount of games prior to the season completion (38 games). If the rule existed that clearly stated a team is automatically champion if that team is top when the league is adandoned then it would be out there. The SPFL would already have made it clear. Not sat back and said nothing. The media and a particular club would already be pushing it as fact. BUT NO ONE IS. NO ONE. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomatasauce 1,253 Posted March 15, 2020 Share Posted March 15, 2020 3 minutes ago, The Dude said: Karren Brady was out yesterday saying it should be null and void. I was talking about the chile situation and you know I was, it’s the only thing that has actually happened that can be compared, the second part is as much guess work as what will happen in our league, although you seem to thing it’s clear cut and no argument necessary the chile scenario only happened because all clubs agreed it should happen so stop using this shite comparison like the daily rebel has Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude 20,026 Posted March 15, 2020 Share Posted March 15, 2020 1 minute ago, Howsitgoing said: So the rule you quote can only work in a certain circumstance say one where they want to gift a football team a title that they weren’t capable of getting. Not saying that at all. I'm saying that I've no idea if that's the path the SPFL would take. There are far too many variables to do so. I have bee told what they plan to do in these circumstances though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeparateEntityMyArse 53,613 Posted March 15, 2020 Share Posted March 15, 2020 1 minute ago, The Dude said: Yep. A FIFA sanctioned league which has ended its season early and awarded the trophies. and only just within the last few months. Certainly not a 'precedent' but this idea that giving titles out just to appease celtic because 'corruption' is fucking wild. Chile done it, the PL are expected to do the same. Nobody suggests corruption. Happens here and you've got cunts saying they'll be done with fitba etc. Not a precedent but relevant. That rings a bell from yesterday 🤔 Are you cherry picking which of my posts to reply to or just losing track? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
soulboy 2,518 Posted March 15, 2020 Share Posted March 15, 2020 30 minutes ago, The Dude said: Different league, different rule book. The SoSFL allows Colt teams. Should we cite that as precedent to get Colts into League Two? Different league but they did the right thing Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude 20,026 Posted March 15, 2020 Share Posted March 15, 2020 1 minute ago, Tomatasauce said: I was talking about the chile situation and you know I was, it’s the only thing that has actually happened that can be compared, the second part is as much guess work as what will happen in our league, although you seem to thing it’s clear cut and no argument necessary No, it wasn't clear which one you were talking about. The second part is what's been reported by various media. Never said once that it's clear cut and have said countless times that the SPFL's position will be open to challenge. The folk I've spoken to don't think it would have any success so I'm content to accept that. They're better placed to know than I am, and in the absence of knowing who is behind any of the pseudonyms on here, I give what they've told me more weight. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ritchieshearercaldow 22,123 Posted March 15, 2020 Share Posted March 15, 2020 If they decide to end the season as is, then no titles should be recorded, they can be recorded as league leaders at the time of cancellation and given the CL spot but not declared champions. How they handle the likes of Hearts I’ve no idea. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude 20,026 Posted March 15, 2020 Share Posted March 15, 2020 3 minutes ago, SeparateEntityMyArse said: Not a precedent but relevant. That rings a bell from yesterday 🤔 Are you cherry picking which of my posts to reply to or just losing track? Not cherry picking but probably not seeing them all. I'm getting a few notifications as five or six different folk all argue with me, and I'm working so easy to lose track. Still waiting for this mythical edited post though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluenoz 30,681 Posted March 15, 2020 Share Posted March 15, 2020 3 minutes ago, The Dude said: Not saying that at all. I'm saying that I've no idea if that's the path the SPFL would take. There are far too many variables to do so. I have bee told what they plan to do in these circumstances though. For the last time, it is out of the SPFL hands. UEFA will decide! Unless the SPFL are clairvoyant and already know the outcome of Tuesday mornings meeting. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sRcFoCt 7,639 Posted March 15, 2020 Share Posted March 15, 2020 Mmmmmmmmmmmm...................Chile Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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