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BlueKnight87

Squad Ins and Outs Discussion

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3 minutes ago, STEPPS BOY said:

We have a clause agreement in place for Gilmour.

We do? Well, that is good news. I did not know that. Barcelona for 100M in three years time 🙂

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23 minutes ago, shaka said:

I'm not saying we are already at Ajax levels for youth development.  I'm raising that as the ideal.  It should be what we aspire for, rather than constantly wasting money on average players who are never good enough to be anything other than squad players.

I do agree with this even tho I don't think we can throw the kids in at the moment. Historically, there's got to have been youth players who would be able to come in and contribute a hell of a lot more than the likes of Halliday, Holt, O'Halloran, Dodoo, McAuley, Ojo, Sodiq, Sean Goss, Russell Martin, Jordan Rossiter, Barker etc

That's with a partial element of hindsight tho, because the majority of us were saying no no no when we signed most of them.

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20 minutes ago, Broxi said:

Ajax have produced Alderweireld (Tottenham), Blind (Man Utd/Ajax), Heitinga (Everton), Nigel de Jong (Man City, AC Milan), Sneidjer (Inter Milan), Van der Vaart (Real Madrid, Tottenham), Vermaelan (Arsenal), Vertonghen (Tottenham), Van der Beek (insert big name here), Eriksen (Tottenham, Inter Milan), Frenkie de Jong (Barcelona) and de Ligt (Juventus) for god knows how many millions through their first team

We have produced Jamie Ness (Dundee), Rhys McCabe (Brechin City), Lewis MacLeod (Wigan) and Barrie McKay (Fleetwood Town)

Stunning array of players. But Ajax fans get used to peaks and troughs and must accept that developing and selling top players is their strategy.

Imagine us selling our top players every summer, folk would still expect us to win the league each season and scream for the manager to be sacked as a failure when we dont.

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17 minutes ago, SeparateEntityMyArse said:

Stunning array of players. But Ajax fans get used to peaks and troughs and must accept that developing and selling top players is their strategy.

Imagine us selling our top players every summer, folk would still expect us to win the league each season and scream for the manager to be sacked as a failure when we dont.

We already expect to sell our top players.  No one realistically expects us to keep Morelos and he's our best forward.

As long as we keep bringing in young players, improving them and selling them for a suitably high price we will continue to be successful in Scotland.

We won't have the same level of competition Ajax have as we only really have to compete with the scum and they already operate a similar system.  We just need to make sure our scouting for young players is better than them and then actually give those players an opportunity in the first team.

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I heard we are linked with Ivan Toney. Peterborough fans sing a song about the size of his tadger.  I wonder what FARE would think of that? Ha!

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49 minutes ago, shaka said:

I'm not saying we are already at Ajax levels for youth development.  I'm raising that as the ideal.  It should be what we aspire for, rather than constantly wasting money on average players who are never good enough to be anything other than squad players.

Agree the ajax model is what we should be aiming for long term.

Short term next season but we can't really afford to blood young players.

We will need a squad of players that can at minimum hit 7/10 performances every week to challenge.

We already have issues in the first team doing that and need better quality players ready made for the first team to improve it.   

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4 minutes ago, BlueKnight87 said:

Agree the ajax model is what we should be aiming for long term.

Short term next season but we can't really afford to blood young players.

We will need a squad of players that can at minimum that can hit 7/10 performances every week to challenge.

We already have issues in the first team doing that and need better quality players ready made for the first team to improve it.   

I fear our young players are going to suffer this year as it is a must we stop 10.

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14 minutes ago, bluenoz said:

I heard we are linked with Ivan Toney. Peterborough fans sing a song about the size of his tadger.  I wonder what FARE would think of that? Ha!

Stats and video check out

Would seem like a good alternative to Morelos depending on cost

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14 minutes ago, shaka said:

We already expect to sell our top players.  No one realistically expects us to keep Morelos and he's our best forward.

As long as we keep bringing in young players, improving them and selling them for a suitably high price we will continue to be successful in Scotland.

We won't have the same level of competition Ajax have as we only really have to compete with the scum and they already operate a similar system.  We just need to make sure our scouting for young players is better than them and then actually give those players an opportunity in the first team.

We dont really. We talk about building teams around them. Only recently have we relented a bit, and that's as much due to Morelos letting it be known he's  got bigger leagues in his sights and his disciplinary record.

Weve not brought through many young players of quality in recent years, but if we introduced and played the next Billy Gilmour folk will be rioting if we sold him. 

It'll take years, and continued success, for our mentality to get used to accepting such a strategy. Which is the right strategy btw 

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47 minutes ago, British_Empire said:

Is that that St Mirren keeper? did he say players as in more than one? 

Yes to keeper and I believe he did say player(s)

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We haven’t been great at producing young players (considering all that has happened at the club in the lat ten years is it any wonder) but it’s an area we simply have to improve in.

All the bigger clubs in the smaller leagues are already operating with one hand tied behind their back and most of them develop players of their own because it’s one of the best ways to give themselves their best chance of generating income.

We simply need to improve the pathway to the first team, we need to find a way to  find a bridge that allows us to have players continue to progress once they reach a certain age because at the moment we seem to be strongly represented by players in the Scotland under teams and it isn’t translating to more first team players and we need to pick and choose what teams players go out on loan to better as well.

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People on FF are talking about Tapia from Feyenoord being linked. Something about his agent mentioning us and the manks being interested. 

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1 minute ago, Broxi said:

People on FF are talking about Tapia from Feyenoord being linked. Something about his agent mentioning us and the manks being interested. 

He would be good but I would rather have Leroy Fer.

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23 minutes ago, bluenoz said:

I heard we are linked with Ivan Toney. Peterborough fans sing a song about the size of his tadger.  I wonder what FARE would think of that? Ha!

Could always use to get a few inches advantage over   defenders 🤔😉

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1 hour ago, Broxi said:

He is the closest we've came. And coming from someone who was a fan of McKay, most people weren't devastated to see him go. He was also just on loan to Fleetwood and has amassed 1 Scotland cap. 

The whole thing this has stemmed from is... do you want to have a third of our current first team squad made up of youth players? And if the answer isn't no then your judgement is worrying.

Like it or not we have not had the level of successes of Tierney, Forrest or McGregor at Rangers where we have produced key first team players.

I would accept McKay, because the argument is inclusive of sub players too and I think McKay would still make our first 11 or at least the bench just now. But other than him there is nobody. 

I think partly those three would have made it there anyway but also partly that they hugely benefited from us being down the divisions and so the same pressure wasn't at celtic to win all games at all costs.

Mckay pisses me off, I don't know if the boy just doesn't care or if it's because he doesn't believe in himself and lacks that arrogance that's needed to be a top player but ability wise and all the attributes he has in terms of pace, touch, vision, passing range he should be an EPL player. No doubt those who don't rate him (of which there are plenty) will be out in force to say he's shite etc. but ask Krancjar or anyone else who played with him.

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26 minutes ago, bluenoz said:

I fear our young players are going to suffer this year as it is a must we stop 10.

I agree sadly. Past couple of years we've had a right good wee group, some go and the ones replacing them seem to be just as good or better for that level.

It's just a shame for them that this is probably our biggest ever season since our own 9IAR (the one we actually won) and we can't afford to experiment too much.

Right group of players,
Right set-up and personell.
Wrong time.

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It’s getting more and more difficult to develop and get to first team.

Anyone good enough is in danger of being prized away by English or Foreign teams for decent money.

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32 minutes ago, bluenoz said:

I fear our young players are going to suffer this year as it is a must we stop 10.

Dapo, Kai Kennedy etc will get loaned out.

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3 minutes ago, British_Empire said:

I agree sadly. Past couple of years we've had a right good wee group, some go and the ones replacing them seem to be just as good or better for that level.

It's just a shame for them that this is probably our biggest ever season since our own 9IAR (the one we actually won) and we can't afford to experiment too much.

Right group of players,
Right set-up and personell.
Wrong time.

i.e. Kelly going back to Ayr would be a step backwards for the lad but there is no chance we can afford to have him find his feet in our midfield next season.

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2 minutes ago, bluenoz said:

i.e. Kelly going back to Ayr would be a step backwards for the lad but there is no chance we can afford to have him find his feet in our midfield next season.

Yeah defo a step backwards.

I see the attraction in them teams for them to toughen them up and get a taste of competitive first team football, but part of me often things too is it really worth it? they rarely seem to come back from these teams Rangers first team ready (with a couple of exceptions in Adam and McGregor) but that's 15 or so years ago too. 

I just don't know the solution tbh. I really don't.

I've got a fucking opinion on just about everything :lol: but not one on how to bridge this gap between the talented youngsters and easing them into the first team and being ready for it.

If there was a coach on earth that could do that, chances are he wouldn't be working for us either tbh.

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If any of them are to become as good as we need, and if they generally be good enough to warrant a place on our bench in most seasons, they should be able to play regularly on loan at most SPL teams this coming year, hopefully doing us the odd favour whilst there in terms of scrapping for points.

Loan them all out - if they succeed, the prize is playing for us the year after.

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15 minutes ago, STEPPS BOY said:

It’s getting more and more difficult to develop and get to first team.

Anyone good enough is in danger of being prized away by English or Foreign teams for decent money.

I think that's definitely part of the problem. Anyone on the level of a Barry Ferguson or Gilmour will probably be taken off our hands long before they get the chance to play for our first team.

Mcpake is the pick of the current bunch for me albeit from only seeing him in a few of those youth cup games and the odd Scotland youth game, but he's not currently anywhere near good enough at first team level to shift anyone out of the team.

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20 minutes ago, STEPPS BOY said:

It’s getting more and more difficult to develop and get to first team.

Anyone good enough is in danger of being prized away by English or Foreign teams for decent money.

Decent money? What did we get  for Gilmour £600K,  peanuts in today's game IMO

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4 minutes ago, Laudrupsleftfoot said:

I think that's definitely part of the problem. Anyone on the level of a Barry Ferguson or Gilmour will probably be taken off our hands long before they get the chance to play for our first team.

Mcpake is the pick of the current bunch for me albeit from only seeing him in a few of those youth cup games and the odd Scotland youth game, but he's not currently anywhere near good enough at first team level to shift anyone out of the team.

Mcpake has fell away mate.

Patterson, Dapo, Kai Kennedy and the young boy King

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