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Out of contract players / furlough


BEE

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Richard Foster believes it is "morally shocking" that clubs like Ross County will not extend player contracts and use the government furlough scheme.

Foster is one of four senior players set to be released by the Dingwall side when their contracts expire.

The former Aberdeen and St Johnstone defender believes County had the capacity to offer financial assistance and decided not to. 

"Clubs just seem to be choosing to not use it," Foster told BBC Scotland. 

"I just find the whole issues around the furlough scheme ridiculous, and why clubs are choosing not to furlough their players when there is a scheme there in place. Which to me is morally shocking really."

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Lewis Spence, Sean Kelly and Declan McManus will all join Foster in exiting the Global Energy Stadium when their current contracts expire.

County have also announced 10 reserve team players will not have their contracts renewed.

While HMRC's scheme allows companies to extend fixed-term contracts or rehire employees who were recently made redundant, Ross County chairman Roy MacGregor said it would be "dishonest" to use the scheme to extend contracts for players that were already scheduled to leave the club.

Dundee, Raith Rovers and Ayr United are to keep out-of-contract players on furlough until the end of June.

Foster believes the government initiative was put in place to do exactly that and questioned MacGregor's decision.

"I'm not sure where he has got his advice," the defender said. "There are also the non-fixed term contracts that means you are allowed to rehire employees or furlough ones that you recently made redundant. 

"So it allows them, in these uncertain times, to continue earning a wage. So this scheme was put in place to help people.

Foster added: "What I heard him say was that he believes that it would be dishonest or that he believes that we would be defrauding HMRC, or however he wants to frame it, if we were to be put on furlough. 

"So it's essentially a binary thing. You either believe that players should be put on furlough and given the chance to earn money in the next couple of months or you just say: 'On you go, we don't want to furlough you, see you later' and that is what he's done."

Meanwhile, Ross County captain Marcus Fraser and Callum Morris have been offered new deals, and Tom Grivosti and Harry Paton have signed new contracts with the club.

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Really hope we’re offering to keep players on, particularly the youth. Easy to forget several will be struggling in these circumstances. Disgusted at chairmen refusing to do so.

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Who gives a fuck what he thinks? he's found his voice now when it concerns money but has no comment on celtic getting titles they've not won and the corruption around it.

I know some of the players he's referring to aren't millionaires like some others but they've still had a better living than the rest of us. A few months out the game won't hurt them or heaven forbid they get real jobs and step into the real world.

Fuck him.

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8 minutes ago, Bad Robot said:

I can see both sides to be honest.

I can’t see the chairmans side at all?

5 minutes ago, British_Empire said:

Who gives a fuck what he thinks? he's found his voice now when it concerns money but has no comment on celtic getting titles they've not won and the corruption around it.

I know some of the players he's referring to aren't millionaires like some others but they've still had a better living than the rest of us. A few months out the game won't hurt them or heaven forbid they get real jobs and step into the real world.

Fuck him.

They have next to no prospect of getting a new club or job in this climate, the ten reserve players will be on peanuts. Will be same position with our youths leaving.

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1 minute ago, BEE said:

I can’t see the chairmans side at all?

They have next to no prospect of getting a new club or job in this climate, the ten reserve players will be on peanuts. Will be same position with our youths leaving.

I have every sympathy with them but not Ricky Foster.

He’s a gobshite.

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He’s a yes voting prick so find it hard to have any sympathy for him. Maybe his yes voting cow of a mrs can throw another shite album out to keep them going 

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7 minutes ago, STEPPS BOY said:

I have every sympathy with them but not Ricky Foster.

He’s a gobshite.

Not his biggest fan but can’t disagree with what he’s saying.

Was rumours at the time that he was on £900 pw during second spell with us, if true then that’s mental.

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9 minutes ago, BEE said:

Not his biggest fan but can’t disagree with what he’s saying.

Was rumours at the time that he was on £900 pw during second spell with us, if true then that’s mental.

I see nothing wrong with that considering we were in the third tier of Scottish football at the time.

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16 minutes ago, BEE said:

I can’t see the chairmans side at all?

They have next to no prospect of getting a new club or job in this climate, the ten reserve players will be on peanuts. Will be same position with our youths leaving.

His contract was finished so there is a bit of dishonesty by reemploying him just because you can which is different from being paid off due to C-19, then an employer taking you back on.

It’s not free as we the tax payer is footing the bill but I can also see why using the furlough scheme for him can also be done due to the uncertainty of everything.

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It makes zero sense for a club to offer a contract to a player when they were not going to be renewed. 

Clubs don’t know how long the wage subsidy will last, they have no idea when football will resume and they have no idea when fans will be allowed in when football does resume.

Why would they offer a contract to a player when they could get stuck paying their wages when they don’t fit in their plans with no revenue coming in if the government ends the furlough scheme in October?

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10 minutes ago, DBBTB said:

I see nothing wrong with that considering we were in the third tier of Scottish football at the time.

From our side yes, just assume he’d be on more at the time.

9 minutes ago, Bad Robot said:

His contract was finished so there is a bit of dishonesty by reemploying him just because you can which is different from being paid off due to C-19, then an employer taking you back on.

It’s not free as we the tax payer is footing the bill but I can also see why using the furlough scheme for him can also be done due to the uncertainty of everything.

Nothing dishonest at all, here’s the guidance:

”If you’re on a fixed term contract

If you were on a fixed term contract your employer can re-employ, furlough and claim for you if your contract expired on or after either:

28 February 2020 and an RTI payment submission for you was notified to HMRC on or before 28 February 2020

19 March 2020 and an RTI payment submission for you was notified to HMRC on or before 19 March 2020

If your fixed term contract has not already expired, your employer can extend or renew it. Your employer can claim for you if an RTI payment submission for you was notified to HMRC on or before 19 March 2020.

If you started and ended the same contract between 28 February 2020 and 19 March 2020 you will not qualify for this scheme. This is not specific to employees on fixed-term contracts, the same would apply to employees on all other contracts.”

6 minutes ago, McEwan's Lager said:

It makes zero sense for a club to offer a contract to a player when they were not going to be renewed. 

Clubs don’t know how long the wage subsidy will last, they have no idea when football will resume and they have no idea when fans will be allowed in when football does resume.

Why would they offer a contract to a player when they could get stuck paying their wages when they don’t fit in their plans with no revenue coming in if the government ends the furlough scheme in October?

My understanding is the majority of clubs are doing it, County are one of the exceptions. I’m not suggesting they offer a year contract etc but I don’t see an issue with extending contracts on a month by month basis in line with the above depending on how the furlough scheme continues.

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15 minutes ago, BEE said:

From our side yes, just assume he’d be on more at the time.

Nothing dishonest at all, here’s the guidance:

”If you’re on a fixed term contract

If you were on a fixed term contract your employer can re-employ, furlough and claim for you if your contract expired on or after either:

28 February 2020 and an RTI payment submission for you was notified to HMRC on or before 28 February 2020

19 March 2020 and an RTI payment submission for you was notified to HMRC on or before 19 March 2020

If your fixed term contract has not already expired, your employer can extend or renew it. Your employer can claim for you if an RTI payment submission for you was notified to HMRC on or before 19 March 2020.

If you started and ended the same contract between 28 February 2020 and 19 March 2020 you will not qualify for this scheme. This is not specific to employees on fixed-term contracts, the same would apply to employees on all other contracts.”

My understanding is the majority of clubs are doing it, County are one of the exceptions. I’m not suggesting they offer a year contract etc but I don’t see an issue with extending contracts on a month by month basis in line with the above depending on how the furlough scheme continues.

To me it’s different if an employer has intention of giving you further work whereas no further contracts were going to be giving to RF by RC so I see the chairman’s view.

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23 minutes ago, Marky. said:

Will never forget Valencia at home. Wank.

He was brilliant in that game. One of the best fullback performances I've seen from a Rangers player. 

Spooky.

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I think extending the contract solely to place them on furlough was something Frasier Wishart was spouting to all the players and clubs when all this kicked off. As above, it just seems a bit disingenuous for a club to do so if they have no intention of keeping that player on - all they're doing is getting the UK public to pay said player at a higher wage than they will be on benefits (as is the only choice for other people in a similar situation outside of the playing football world who has their contract come to an end right now).

 

 

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Just now, Bad Robot said:

To me it’s different if an employer has intention of giving you further work whereas no further contracts were going to be giving to RF by RC so I see the chairman’s view.

I can understand somewhat now but I still totally disagree, the furlough grant is there to support those affected by the current situation - these guys will be unable to get alternative work. If the eligibility criteria asked the employer to consider the likelihood of contract extension etc then I’d agree with their decision but it doesn’t so they’re making a moral decision when they’re not being asked to. At the end of the day it’s the employers decision but if I was a player at the club with a long contract I don’t think I’d be eager to stay given the actions of the chairman.

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2 minutes ago, frenv said:

I think extending the contract solely to place them on furlough was something Frasier Wishart was spouting to all the players and clubs when all this kicked off. As above, it just seems a bit disingenuous for a club to do so if they have no intention of keeping that player on - all they're doing is getting the UK public to pay said player at a higher wage than they will be on benefits (as is the only choice for other people in a similar situation outside of the playing football world who has their contract come to an end right now).

 

 

15 players per club, on the maximum amount claimable (£2,500 per month, in reality would be much lower) = £37.5k per month

IMO that amount is minuscule compared to the overall cost but could be life changing to those 15 guys but I can see it from both sides.

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2 hours ago, frenv said:

I think extending the contract solely to place them on furlough was something Frasier Wishart was spouting to all the players and clubs when all this kicked off. As above, it just seems a bit disingenuous for a club to do so if they have no intention of keeping that player on - all they're doing is getting the UK public to pay said player at a higher wage than they will be on benefits (as is the only choice for other people in a similar situation outside of the playing football world who has their contract come to an end right now).

 

 

Not necessarily so ,A mate of mine changed jobs in early March ,he had a run in with a boss at the turn of the year and they tried to sack him through disciplinary process ,They made a cunt of it though ,His line manager had a word in his ear and advised that he should look for another job but would be kept on in the meantime 

Anyway he started early March and kept working through till 2nd weeks of April ,work started to get quiet so he was made redundant and wasn’t able to be furloughed ,His previous employer then took him back on and put him on furlough ,so rather than being on universal credit he’s at least earning a decent enough wage to keep him going ,As of yet he’s unsure if he will be kept on a full contract by this company 

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