Bristol City Targets Gerrard

[SeparateEntityMyArse 53,715]

28 minutes ago, BridgeIsBlue said:

We play them 4 times in a league campaign, you can't use the transfer budget argument as a crutch one way then dismiss it in another when we struggle against teams that are nowhere near our level. 

Talking about Defoe coming here because of Gerrard, did Dado Prso come to Rangers to play for Alex McLeish, or Laudrup and Gascoigne because of Walter? 

That'll be when strength in squad depth, consistency and ruthlessness are lacking, as I said.

[OhW 4,669]

7 minutes ago, King Jela said:

What the actual fuck does a game against them in March 2018 have to do with 3 officials robbing us in December 2019?

It shows that even with a man advantage you’re not guaranteed to win. 

[peter huistra 1,740]

48 minutes ago, BridgeIsBlue said:

We play them 4 times in a league campaign, you can't use the transfer budget argument as a crutch one way then dismiss it in another when we struggle against teams that are nowhere near our level. 

Talking about Defoe coming here because of Gerrard, did Dado Prso come to Rangers to play for Alex McLeish, or Laudrup and Gascoigne because of Walter? 

Walter was a big part in Gazza coming to Rangers , I'm sure he went to Gazza's house in Rome and chapped his door , plus he had met him the previous year on holiday so I'd say he most likely would have ended up in England had it not been for Walter Smith. 

[SeparateEntityMyArse 53,715]

1 hour ago, Rangers_no1 said:

The whole wage bill argument is nonsense, in my view.

Liverpool won a CL and nearly got 100 league points last year, might get over 100 this year and their wage bill AND transfer spending does not come close to United, Chelsea never mind the top team Man City.

I never heard those finance excuses being used for Mark Warburton or Pedro who's finances were much less than Gerrard's!

When you get to the level of paying 100s of millions of course its negated to an extent. Many of those players are world class after all.

But in most leagues, in most countries, the team that has the most valuable squad, pay more in wages, and spend more on transfer fees will more often than not win that league. And conversely the team who are the mirror image of that will typically finish low or bottom .

Pretty sure the same arguments existed during the tenure of both those managers. I certainly said if myself. For me its about the rate of progress versus the tipping point. Imo Gerrard has got us closer, wd and still progressing, bug unfortunately even with the punch above the weight argument 3 years is the cutting off point. Win the league or thanks for efforts but goodbye.

[SeparateEntityMyArse 53,715]

1 hour ago, Rangers_no1 said:

Gaps wider from us to the rest, than the scum to us, thats for sure.

As is the points tally.

[SeparateEntityMyArse 53,715]

1 hour ago, British_Empire said:

All fair comments mate, but there's an over-riding, massive brand name/PR aspect to the appointment. That was the ONLY advantage to his appointment at the time (you can then argue a case for or against him as a manager now depending on how you think he's done)

You may be right.

But it could also be argued it really was needed, a bit like another Souness moment.

[British_Empire 9,648]

5 minutes ago, SeparateEntityMyArse said:

You may be right.

But it could also be argued it really was needed, a big like another Souness moment.

Disagree mate. For me we needed a tried and tested manager with a track record of success.

I know folk keep harping on about Walter Smith but someone in that mould - no nonsense, knew the basics and got that extra 10% out of players.

Scottish football isn't rocket science and it doesn't need over-complicated.

We will never get a bigger name than Steven Gerrard as our manager, but we can (could of) get a better manager than Steven Gerrard.

That's why I stand by my point about the board in relation to this. They are devious bastards. They wanted the good PR and something that appeared like a coup, because, they should be (and should have been at the time) under immense pressure to deliver. This way, they can say we attracted a name on the world stage like Steven Gerrard and that's total justification, to some, regardless if he flops or fails and removes even more accountability from a bunch of amateurs who's track record of appointments and signings is nothing short of woeful. 

[Pure_Quality 3,295]

1 hour ago, Laudrupsleftfoot said:

You've some brass neck you mongo.

You made a whiny post the other day about cunts who have to make an extreme exaggeration to make their point yet you've no self awareness about you to realise you do the same all the fucking time.

The post I quoted of yours was of you essentially saying the board couldn't give a fuck about results on the park. Which is a fucking outrageously ridiculous statement to make.

He's got a big mongo forehead and is a bitch receptionist so don't let him bully you pal.

[SeparateEntityMyArse 53,715]

4 minutes ago, British_Empire said:

Disagree mate. For me we needed a tried and tested manager with a track record of success.

I know folk keep harping on about Walter Smith but someone in that mould - no nonsense, knew the basics and got that extra 10% out of players.

Scottish football isn't rocket science and it doesn't need over-complicated.

We will never get a bigger name than Steven Gerrard as our manager, but we can (could of) get a better manager than Steven Gerrard.

That's why I stand by my point about the board in relation to this. They are devious bastards. They wanted the good PR and something that appeared like a coup, because, they should be (and should have been at the time) under immense pressure to deliver. This way, they can say we attracted a name on the world stage like Steven Gerrard and that's total justification, to some, regardless if he flops or fails and removes even more accountability from a bunch of amateurs who's track record of appointments and signings is nothing short of woeful. 

Maybe so. But as I've said whilst the salary would be appealing, the bigger picture might not be so great for a career.

Puting your career against beating a stable team of internationalists and repeat league winners, managed by a credible manager in Rodgers, who has a better squad who are paid more, and with a bigger transfer budget.

Who were these winner type  managers experienced in the scottish game who fancied going from successful career to gambling on taking on the overwhelming favourites with little comparative backing. McInnes was the man of the moment. Who else realistically fancied that challenge and was the fit we needed?

We can talk about what we needed. Maybe no-one of the calibre needed was, rightly, foolish enough to put their credability on the line. 

[British_Empire 9,648]

1 minute ago, SeparateEntityMyArse said:

Maybe so. But as I've said whilst the salary would be appealing, the bigger picture might not be so great for a career.

Puting your career against beating a stable team of internationalists and repeat league winners, managed by a credible manager in Rodgers, who has a better squad who are paid more, and with a bigger transfer budget.

Who were these winner type  managers experienced in the scottish game who fancied going from successful career to gambling on taking on the overwhelming favourites with little comparative backing. McInnes was the man of the moment. Who else realistically fancied that challenge and was the fit we needed?

We can talk about what we needed. Maybe no-one of the calibre needed was, rightly, foolish enough to put their credability on the line. 

I think we seriously under-play the draw and size of our club when it comes the attraction it has for a lot of good managers, in the quest to make excuses for Gerrard and the board.

Not talking about you, as I know you're playing Devil's advocate there.

[Swally 6,289]

19 hours ago, British_Empire said:

Gattuso is an awful manager IMO. He'd lose the plot in this environment as a Rangers manager too.

Wouldn’t mind as long as he kicked the shit out of TLB during an old firm

[SeparateEntityMyArse 53,715]

5 minutes ago, British_Empire said:

I think we seriously under-play the draw and size of our club when it comes the attraction it has for a lot of good managers, in the quest to make excuses for Gerrard and the board.

Not talking about you, as I know you're playing Devil's advocate there.

I too think the draw is huge. But we're still looking for a manager to come in and learn the game here whilst beating a financially stronger and more asset rich squad. I dont think theres been an obvious manager since Walter who has had our job written all over them. Its a huge draw, but as I said previously current circumstances make it a poisoned chalice unless the individual has a key edge (organisation, man management, lure ofpkayersto workforce him, eyw for bargains etc).

[British_Empire 9,648]

Just now, SeparateEntityMyArse said:

I too think the draw is huge. But we're still looking for a manager to come in and learn the game here whilst beating a finanxially stronger and more asset rich squad. I dont think theres been an obvious manager since Walter who has had our job written all over them. Its a huge draw, but as I said previously current circumstances make it a poisoned challenge unless the individual has a key edge (organisation, man management, lure ofpkayersto workforce him, eyw for bargains etc).

I know celtic's resources blow us out the water - but for everything they've got, they aren't that great.

A semi-competent manager, we could have won the league last season and this. I truly believe that.

[King Jela 20,361]

1 hour ago, OhW said:

It shows that even with a man advantage you’re not guaranteed to win. 

Where did I say we WOULD have won? 

[SeparateEntityMyArse 53,715]

6 minutes ago, British_Empire said:

I know celtic's resources blow us out the water - but for everything they've got, they aren't that great.

A semi-competent manager, we could have won the league last season and this. I truly believe that.

They're not. We can beat them. But we lack the strength in depth, consistency and ruthlessness to beat everyone over the season.

The scum have the msm onside who support them get 25m for Tierney, 20m for Dembele, up to 10m for numerous others. They quite simply have the muscle we aspire to.

I don't think we're far away despite all that tbh.  But if every manager only gets a year or two overcome it then we'll be having similar conversations in a decade from now.

[British_Empire 9,648]

Just now, SeparateEntityMyArse said:

They're not. We can beat them. But we lack the strength in depth, consistency and ruthlessness to beat everyone over the season.

The scum have the msm onside who suppirg them get 25m for Tierney, 20m for Dembele, up to 10m for numerous others. They quite simply have the muscle we aspire to.

I don't think we're far away despite all that tbh.  But if every manager o ly gets a year or to overcome it then we'll be having similar conversations in a decade from now.

I don't disagree with that, but that's why I said that an experienced, competent manager who get's that extra 10% from players, then that irons out those inconsistencies against the weaker teams who set up stubborn. That's why we lost the leagues, not the games against celtic. They take care of themselves (which is an improvement in itself considering we were getting pumped regular before)

[pcbear 10,913]

Might not be everyones opinion but mine is that Brown is the glue that bonds that team, once he goes imo they will crumble.

[SeparateEntityMyArse 53,715]

Just now, British_Empire said:

I don't disagree with that, but that's why I said that an experienced, competent manager who get's that extra 10% from players, then that irons out those inconsistencies against the weaker teams who set up stubborn. That's why we lost the leagues, not the games against celtic. They take care of themselves (which is an improvement in itself considering we were getting pumped regular before)

If that type manager had come in, I'd not have complained.  But is it a mythical / hypothetical figure, or did you have a name then / now?

[SeparateEntityMyArse 53,715]

3 minutes ago, pcbear said:

Might not be everyones opinion but mine is that Brown is the glue that bonds that team, once he goes imo they will crumble.

Griffiths is the glue man. Allegedly. 

[British_Empire 9,648]

5 minutes ago, SeparateEntityMyArse said:

If that type manager had come in, I'd not have complained.  But is it a mythical / hypothetical figure, or did you have a name then / now?

Specific names, can't remember from the top of my head, but I just always liked managers in the mould of Walter Smith, Terry Veneables, Howard Wilkinson for the sort of job we need up here in Scotland.

I'm not saying them 3, I'm just saying those types of managers. 

Someone like a Guus Hiddink or Dick Advocaat. 

I'll tell you what, though, those 2 as our DOF (current and before) give me their time, resources, wage and contact list and I'd come back to you with a good list in a week or two with names who might be interested and/or available. I don't think your average fan can possibly know these things tbh. A fans opinion, when asked on the spot isn't really valid or realistic no matter who they say.

[SeparateEntityMyArse 53,715]

1 minute ago, British_Empire said:

Specific names, can't remember from the top of my head, but I just always liked managers in the mould of Walter Smith, Terry Veneables, Howard Wilkinson for the sort of job we need up here in Scotland.

I'm not saying them 3, I'm just saying those types of managers. 

Someone like a Guus Hiddink or Dick Advocaat. 

I'll tell you what, though, those 2 as our DOF (current and before) give me their time, resources, wage and contact list and I'd come back to you with a good list in a week or two with names who might be interested and/or available. I don't think your average fan can possibly know these things tbh. A fans opinion, when asked on the spot isn't really valid or realistic no matter who they say.

I think that's part of the problem tbh. Mcinnes was probably the best of the managers available who knew scotland. Others were even bigger gambles. Was it van preud homme or something linked?   Warnock? There wasn't a banker bet we as a support mostly agreed on. Polls at the time topped 20% for a candidate. No-one overwhelmingly stood out.

We couldn't agree as a support. Yet Gerrard at the time of his appearance at trackside actually had 95% of us behind the appointment. I doubt any other would have came close to almost universal backing. And I say that as one of the last to buy into it all.

[British_Empire 9,648]

4 minutes ago, SeparateEntityMyArse said:

I think that's part of the problem tbh. Mcinnes was probably the best of the managers available who knew scotland. Others were even bigger gambles. Was it van preud homme or something linked?   Warnock? There wasn't a banker bet we as a support mostly agreed on. Polls at the time topped 20% for a candidate. No-one overwhelmingly stood out.

We couldn't agree as a support. Yet Gerrard at the time of his appearance at trackside actually had 95% of us behind the appointment. I doubt any other would have came close to almost universal backing. And I say that as one of the last to buy into it all.

Again, all fair points mate - but the bits in bold, I think there's a distinction to be had in that the fans were happy to cheer a name like Gerrard rolling up walking around the track in a Rangers tie and give him the world class welcome, but if you asked them, truly, if they think he was the right appointment and do you honestly think he'd be a success, then the responses will look totally different to the picture the scene appears to paint. I just think there's a difference.

I never went to Ibrox, plenty of my mates did and I can't talk for them all but most of them if asked, would respond the way I've said above. 

Plus too, Rangers fans are notorious (in my opinion/what I see) to becoming conditioned. You could go back and read the posts on here when the rumours started that Gerrard was considered to be our manager and the tone wasn't very overwhelming. I remember it quite vividly. Then, as you say, it's party time at Ibrox when he's appointed and fans online, especially here, buy into the idea a lot more when the penny drops it's happening. There's little consistency and I mean the other side of the coin to that too because the way we are as a support, it's party time when Gerrards getting shown off at Ibrox, then a couple of sluggish games against Schupki and a draw at Pittodrie a lot of folk then got hysterical.

Seen it myself on Facebook, some folk calling him a scouse cunt etc. 

The Rangers support for all I love most of them, have so many faults - too many idiots, too many hysterical ones who can't think straight and far, far, far too many too conditioned to accept any pish the club feeds them.

[SeparateEntityMyArse 53,715]

3 minutes ago, British_Empire said:

Again, all fair points mate - but the bits in bold, I think there's a distinction to be had in that the fans were happy to cheer a name like Gerrard rolling up walking around the track in a Rangers tie and give him the world class welcome, but if you asked them, truly, if they think he was the right appointment and do you honestly think he'd be a success, then the responses will look totally different to the picture the scene appears to paint. I just think there's a difference.

I never went to Ibrox, plenty of my mates did and I can't talk for them all but most of them if asked, would respond the way I've said above. 

Plus too, Rangers fans are notorious (in my opinion/what I see) to becoming conditioned. You could go back and read the posts on here when the rumours started that Gerrard was considered to be our manager and the tone wasn't very overwhelming. I remember it quite vividly. Then, as you say, it's party time at Ibrox when he's appointed and fans online, especially here, buy into the idea a lot more when the penny drops it's happening. There's little consistency and I mean the other side of the coin to that too because the way we are as a support, it's party time when Gerrards getting shown off at Ibrox, then a couple of sluggish games against Schupki and a draw at Pittodrie a lot of folk then got hysterical.

Seen it myself on Facebook, some folk calling him a scouse cunt etc. 

The Rangers support for all I love most of them, have so many faults - too many idiots, too many hysterical ones who can't think straight and far, far, far too many too conditioned to accept any pish the club feeds them.

Some fair points there.

Worst for me is the "we're the Rangers so we deserve" type outlook.  History is wonderful to look back on, but thats all it'll be if you dont achieve similar today and tomorrow. Weve no divine right to success, we need to earn it.

And again, when we're struggling to overcome a financially stronger competitor routinely winning titles then id rather loon at what is needed and overcoming hurdles than saying we're the Rangers with some sense of entitlement but no objectivity to the true difficulties to becoming league winners again.

 

 Btw. Enjoyable having a debate, seemed recently like thats been a no no on here 😂

 

[BridgeIsBlue 66,606]

36 minutes ago, pcbear said:

Might not be everyones opinion but mine is that Brown is the glue that bonds that team, once he goes imo they will crumble.

Or we can just build a team capable of winning it instead of waiting for that clown to retire. 

And btw they were going to crumble when Deila left, then when Rodgers left, then when we beat them in December etc. 

[British_Empire 9,648]

4 minutes ago, SeparateEntityMyArse said:

Some fair points there.

Worst for me is the "we're the Rangers so we deserve" type outlook.  History is wonderful to look back on, but thats all it'll be if you dont achieve similar today and tomorrow. Weve no divine right to success, we need to earn it.

And again, when we're struggling to overcome a financially stronger competitor routinely winning titles then id rather loon at what is needed and overcoming hurdles than saying we're the Rangers with some sense of entitlement but no objectivity to the true difficulties to becoming league winners again.

 

 Btw. Enjoyable having a debate, seemed recently like thats been a no no on here 😂

 

Was thinking the same there btw. A proper, intelligent debate.