jcb

We don't need to get into Europe anyway via the league cup, so why use that as an arguement for it being meaningless? Can't understand the mentality why people aren't bothered about it. I'm not saying its meaningless but domestically its the lesser of the three competitions and ideal to blood a few youngsters Whose to say a team containing 4 or 5 younger players couldn't win it anyway? Me, beacuse they're mince. Your right, of course its the lesser of the three. That doesn't mean we should be lacklusture with it tho. Disagree that a team with Wilson, Fleck, Ness & Wylde couldn't win or get to the final next season. Look at our opponents. Celtic, Hibernian, Hearts. Not as if its Inter, Barca or Munich we're up againgst!. The only two I rate is Wilson and Wylde and there's no assurances that Wylde will even be here next season. Regarding our opponents - Dundee would have knocked us out at Dens if it wasn't for a couple of own goals and a stonewall penalty they were denied and Dundee United knocked us out of the Scottish Cup. Both starting line up's had a good percentage of kids and fringe players. Personally feel that Fleck & Ness will prove themselves to be the better players in the future. Alexander, Whittaker, Bougherra, Wilson, Wylde, Thomson, Ness, Davis, Fleck ,Miller, Lafferty. Put that side out and in my opinion they would defeat most teams. Just my opinion though.

We both agree that in John Fleck we have a very special talent on our hands who under the current/future management will never be played in his most effective position. Sad but all too predictable. If only we could employ a modern thinking ,well respected european manager with a proven track record who has a reputation of playing fast attacking football built around a team with a mix of youth and experience. . we had one and treated him like an enemy an ambitious manager would do me, someone who can change a game with decisions on the touchline, someone who is not afraid to attack better teams, someone who doesnt play punt n rush football, someone who trusts our young players and someone who does not play players out of position or play players due to their alleged reputations! that would do me sadly we all know whats coming up after Walter, Super Ally Why do we make every thing look so hard? Football is such an easy game, is there anything easier than passing a ball 5/10/20 yards? we make it look impossible!

We both agree that in John Fleck we have a very special talent on our hands who under the current/future management will never be played in his most effective position. Sad but all too predictable. If only we could employ a modern thinking ,well respected european manager with a proven track record who has a reputation of playing fast attacking football built around a team with a mix of youth and experience. .

Smith's youth policy was not playing the youths. Hope McCoist has fresh ideas but wouldn't bet on it.

I think a team like that would have a good balance of youth and experience and would do well against most teams in that competition. Not sure if we'll ever see it or if there are better players in the youth ranks or not but these are the games where we could see them! And as I said, if these guys impress, they can push for a regular first team spot.

Personally i've never understood the part-exchange aspect in transfers unless the other club involved have a player we were initially targeting. Obtain the maximum amount of money rather than a bit-part player (Lee Miller) lowering the fee received and taking a wage out the club.

We don't need to get into Europe anyway via the league cup, so why use that as an arguement for it being meaningless? Can't understand the mentality why people aren't bothered about it. I'm not saying its meaningless but domestically its the lesser of the three competitions and ideal to blood a few youngsters Whose to say a team containing 4 or 5 younger players couldn't win it anyway? Me, beacuse they're mince. Your right, of course its the lesser of the three. That doesn't mean we should be lacklusture with it tho. Disagree that a team with Wilson, Fleck, Ness & Wylde couldn't win or get to the final next season. Look at our opponents. Celtic, Hibernian, Hearts. Not as if its Inter, Barca or Munich we're up againgst!.

Attitude is the MAIN problem with Scottish players.

At the very least we should competing with the majority of our opponents and not being continually shown up to be tactically naive and unable or unwilling to react to what is happening in front of your eyes like WS seems to be. Last season Dan Petrescu changed the way Unirea Urziceni were set-up after 20 minutes WS stood on the touchline listening to a cascade of boos from the stands watching it unravel without reacting. Says it all really.

Always said the chairman should have backed Paul Le Guen and shown the clique the front door. Instead we had to watch as our captain went looking to his media buddies (The Sun &Radio Clyde) for a positive spin (for him)to be put on the story therfore ensuring hostility towards PLG. Nae Barry Ferguson nae Rangers indeed Shameful decision by David Murray

We don't need to get into Europe anyway via the league cup, so why use that as an arguement for it being meaningless? Can't understand the mentality why people aren't bothered about it. I'm not saying its meaningless but domestically its the lesser of the three competitions and ideal to blood a few youngsters Whose to say a team containing 4 or 5 younger players couldn't win it anyway?

10-15 years ago i would have chosen winning the treble but we have to look at the bigger picture.if the league cup is the lesser of the three trophies we can win then would giving the youngsters much needed experience thus benefiting us long term not be a price worth paying In terms of finance & prestige the league cup offers us little and while i appreciate some fans will disagree i think it is something we should consider particularly as these players could in 12 months time make up the nucleus of the first team squad.

Walter would rather move a experienced player into a unfamiliar position thus upsetting the whole balance of the team rather than show faith in a youngster Broadfoot or McMillan/ Wylde McCulloch or Perry/Ness Velicka or Hemmings/Loy I think we all know the answers

Like Flecky1 i too made a decision a few years ago not to invest money into a regime i had no faith in(Proved correct)so instead started taking in youth games(would recommend it to anyone)and spent time with like minded individuals who all care passionately about our club,doesn't make me less of a fan but what alternatives do we have to ensure those in charge pay more than lip service to the best and most loyal support in football.

For a club who have guaranteed European competition year after year our performances particularly under the stewardship of Murray & Smith have been nothing short of shameful.How many times have we watched as we are out-thought tacticaly off the park,out-played on the park by so-called inferior teams. The only time I thought we looked as if we belonged there was under Dick Advocaat where we played in a style more in keeping with modern football.

I;m confused-despite the manager showing a complete lack of faith in him(JMM would have been 18 when WS returned) by not giving him any game time then why award a contract extension?.Could it be AMC rates him and has started planning for next season already?. If Smith had complete faith in him why wasn't he used last season? As I said earlier in the thread he gave Loy the same contract last summer and he didn't kick a ball last season before being loaned out to St Mirren As I stated earlier WS has no faith in the player so therfore it can only be AMC who has taken this decision

In the long run possibly McMillan who has agreed to a new deal. Rather than Jordan McMillan I would prefer to see Jamie Ness in Thomson's position should he be sold. Forgot about Ness in all honesty, hope to see more of him this season. Similar to Thomson in many aspects of his game.Feel this will be a big season for him if he can stay injury free. I really hope that a lot of those on the fringes are used more in the League Cup competition to give them some experience. Amen to that.how do we expect the youngsters to gain experience and progress if they never get the opportunity

Sadly ticket pricing and not being a box office team could have been two reasons for the low turnout. i agree about ticketing, but i do think sevilla are box office, some fantastic players I agree with you mate but the majority of fans have a limited knowledge of Spanish football unless it involves Barcelona or Real Madrid ,How many could for instance name players from Valencia,Athletico Madrid or Villareal.

I;m confused-despite the manager showing a complete lack of faith in him(JMM would have been 18 when WS returned) by not giving him any game time then why award a contract extension?.Could it be AMC rates him and has started planning for next season already?.

In the long run possibly McMillan who has agreed to a new deal. Rather than Jordan McMillan I would prefer to see Jamie Ness in Thomson's position should he be sold. Forgot about Ness in all honesty, hope to see more of him this season. Similar to Thomson in many aspects of his game.Feel this will be a big season for him if he can stay injury free.

In the long run possibly McMillan who has agreed to a new deal. Rather than Jordan McMillan I would prefer to see Jamie Ness in Thomson's position should he be sold.

Sadly ticket pricing and not being a box office team could have been two reasons for the low turnout.

not at all mate, under Walter my European ambitions are minimal Mine are'nt that high.

If you're asking will we win it-I have my doubts.

spot on. it is their way of saying that we will not attract any "big" names. Who wants a big name? Boogie and King Carlos were hardly big names but have done a good job and were value for money. I cannot for the life of me understand why we don't have a look at some decent German and Dutch players. At least we'll know they can trap a ball and pass it which is more than can be said for the average British player. Sadly i think even the £2-3 million players like Cuellar & Bougherra are now outwith our price range but would agree we should be looking overseas for younger,ambitious players rather than the vastly over-inflated Brittish market. I think there are three players on our doorstep who would drastically improve the team - Margaro Gomis, Craig Conway and Anthony Stokes. Craft in the middle of the park, pace out wide, and goals up front. I agree that you can find good value with overseas players, but every club is looking for value, even the ones with lots of money. We've got players in Scotland who we know can adapt to scottish football and we could get them relatively cheaply. Would agree that the three players you mention would improve the team although Im still not convinced we have the transfer budget required to purchase even two of them without first selling.