tonto

You're at the wind-up now (or you're making yourself look very silly), but I'll bite anyway. Everyone already knows Rangers own the stadium and Murray Park. MIH own Rangers and consolidate their assets and liabilities in their accounts, including the stadium and Murray Park. I take it you have difficulty understanding the clear statement from MIH's accounts......... "acquired with the purchase" No. It's straightforward. When they purchased Rangers, they got the stadium and MP within that as they did everything else that Rangers own. It's not a difficult concept to understand. I'll refer you to the 2008 Rangers accounts - "The Stadium and Murray Park were valued by DM Hall LLP in accordance with the RICS Valuation Standards Sixth Edition during the year on a depreciated replacement cost basis." They can't be in the Rangers audited accounts if Rangers don't own them. You appear to be having further difficulty understanding that MIH own Rangers and everything accredited to them, that is why Rangers are in MIH audited accounts. But as you pointed out they can't be in MIH accounts because MIH don't own them. Rangers do. Role reversal has taken on a whole new meaning.

You're at the wind-up now (or you're making yourself look very silly), but I'll bite anyway. Everyone already knows Rangers own the stadium and Murray Park. MIH own Rangers and consolidate their assets and liabilities in their accounts, including the stadium and Murray Park. I take it you have difficulty understanding the clear statement from MIH's accounts......... "acquired with the purchase"

You will also find this statement within MIH accounts 2007. +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ The Ibrox Stadium and football training facilities, included within freehold land and buildings, acquired with the purchase of The Rangers Football Club plc are valued on a depreciated replacement cost basis. The directors determined the valuation of these properties on a depreciated replacement cost basis at 30 June 2006 based on a valuation received from Messrs. DM Hall, Chartered Surveyors. ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ So you now know who owns Ibrox and Murray park.

No they didn't have a captive market. Fans could buy from any number of sports shops. Plucking figures such as 33% out of the air and refusing to look at what Rangers made historically from retail may convince you, but I doubt anyone else is. If the figures say otherwise then feel free to find fault with mine. You are mistaken, it is slippery Daves department phlucking figures and projecting moonbeams, there again you probably swallow slippery Daves creative scenarios.

Facts and the intrepetation of financial figures are 2 separate things. Your intrepretation is questionable. You are using the 2005 turnover of £20.7m as the basis of your projections. This is not comparable because it is boosted by the manufacture of strips, something which we no longer do. You would see that the 2006 turnover was lower, for example. You also use the figure of a return of 33%. One wonders why JJB are in so much trouble if they are earning 33%? Could it be that actual returns happen to be a lot lower? Let's look at Rangers though.The last available profit on retail (excluding 2006) was 2004 where Rangers show that they were making under 20%. The 2006 accounts suggest that there was a £2m profit on a turnover of £17.7m. A return of 11%. Well under your 33%. So if we are to assume a 20% return, which may be optimistic, on an average turnover of £20m, which again is optimistic, you get a return of £40m over a 10 year period. However that £40m doesn't take account of the well publicised risks of falling prices of football strips and general economic problems. If we compare the £48m, including an upfront payment of £18m, over an optimistic £40m, then the deal looks good for Rangers even after accounting for closure costs. "You also use the figure of a return of 33%. One wonders why JJB are in so much trouble if they are earning 33%? Could it be that actual returns happen to be a lot lower?" It is what is known as a captive market, rangers had one. JJB never did. If you think it was a good deal that is your right, figures say otherwise.

Very good question. ++++++++++++++++++++++ Ticketing Ticketing income increased again this season on the previous year despite the loss of Champions League revenue. Demand for tickets continues to grow year on year and the number of season ticket holders again reached over 42,000 last season to continue to provide our largest source of income. We are set to break this record again with sales well up on this time last year. Indeed, demand for tickets is such that we are currently exploring opportunities to expand the Stadium's capacity, perhaps in conjunction with the introduction of a new product in our corporate hospitality portfolio.

This statement hidden away in note 10 of the accounts, basically assures us that nothing will happen until the health of MIH is assessed. ++++++++++++++ 30. ULTIMATE HOLDING COMPANY The Directors consider that the ultimate holding company is Murray International Holdings Ltd. (reg. no. SC 192523). As D. E. Murray has a controlling interest in the share capital of the ultimate holding company he is considered to be the ultimate controlling related party. The largest and smallest group in which the results of the Company are consolidated is that headed by the ultimate holding company whose registered office is at 9 Charlotte Square, Edinburgh, EH2 4DR.

Facts are fine, but you need to look at more than one fact to get the full picture. It's correct that they needed the creditors to APPROVE the CVA, but it's also correct that the CVA itself only affected payments to landlords so there would be no reason for other creditors, including Rangers, not to approve it as it didn't affect them other than to improve JJB's situation in allowing them to make full payment to its unsecured creditors. Rangers are an unsecured creditor. However it is obvious that you do not wish to face facts, which in our situation is the worst possible avenue. Here are the last figures for Rangers retailing arm, if you can get them to a fair value of circa 48 mill even over a flat 10 year period at the same figures annually, a figure which would account to approx £207 mill how giving that away for a known figure of £48 mill makes sense is the stuff of incompetence or desperation. +++++++++++++++++++++ Retail Sales of £20.7m this season increased the retail and wholesale division's turnover 10% from the previous year, making 2004/05 our most successful season to date. This was a significant achievement for the Club driven largely by our strong 'Buy Direct' message, our extremely loyal fan base and our continued policy of manufacturing and distributing our own replica kit. This season's new kit is currently outstripping all previous years’ sales figures over a similar period and we are expecting to increase that figure for the coming year. The Club has also signed a four-year sponsorship deal with UK based sports brand, Umbro, which will see us use their logo on all replica playing and training wear over this period. This deal will also increase our distribution network and exposure overseas via their existing networks. Chief Executive’s Report (continued) The Rangers Football Club plc 7 Our complement of shops has also increased, with new stores opening in Braehead and at the Glasgow Fort. We have also opened a number of temporary stores outwith Glasgow and the Central Belt. Dundee, Dumfries and particularly Irvine have been well received and some of these temporary units may translate into permanent sites. We have also exploited opportunities in franchising and have opened a store in Hamilton via this business model, which we are confident will provide a sound basis for further expansion. Sales from our Internet store have seen a staggering 143% increase in the last year and continued development in this area is one of the key features of our business plan going forward. The Club continues to protect the Rangers brand and ensure our rights and the interests of our supporters are properly protected and we will carry on working with the relevant enforcement agencies to this effect. In the last year alone, £5m worth of counterfeit Rangers goods have been seized. +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ On the simple flat figure of £207 mill any retail company would expect a return on profit of about a third or there abouts or about £69 mill here, the figures work out to approx £ 6.5 mill -7.5 mill per annum so if Dodgy Dave was giving slippery Dave £3 mill per annim plus the original £14.5 mill, Dodgy Dave gets £4.5 mill- 3.5 mill per annum for no risk, from the projected flat £7 mill profit per annum. Stevie Wonder could see who got the best of that deal. Staff costs, rates, rents or leasing payments,running costs are the reason high streets are full of empty properties because it is more and more difficult to trade profitably. The JJB deal was a good deal for the club; money upfront and guaranteed reward without retail risk. If you know of anyone else selling circa £70 mill for £48 mill put me down for some of that, or perhaps that should really be in the long term for nothing, because if we had kept the retail arm we would have earned the £48 mill anyway plus the other £22 mill, and all of the benefits keeping the projected turnover in house would have had for the club, you are right it was a good deal for Dodgy Dave.

Facts are fine, but you need to look at more than one fact to get the full picture. It's correct that they needed the creditors to APPROVE the CVA, but it's also correct that the CVA itself only affected payments to landlords so there would be no reason for other creditors, including Rangers, not to approve it as it didn't affect them other than to improve JJB's situation in allowing them to make full payment to its unsecured creditors. Rangers are an unsecured creditor. However it is obvious that you do not wish to face facts, which in our situation is the worst possible avenue. Here are the last figures for Rangers retailing arm, if you can get them to a fair value of circa 48 mill even over a flat 10 year period at the same figures annually, a figure which would account to approx £207 mill how giving that away for a known figure of £48 mill makes sense is the stuff of incompetence or desperation. +++++++++++++++++++++ Retail Sales of £20.7m this season increased the retail and wholesale division's turnover 10% from the previous year, making 2004/05 our most successful season to date. This was a significant achievement for the Club driven largely by our strong 'Buy Direct' message, our extremely loyal fan base and our continued policy of manufacturing and distributing our own replica kit. This season's new kit is currently outstripping all previous years’ sales figures over a similar period and we are expecting to increase that figure for the coming year. The Club has also signed a four-year sponsorship deal with UK based sports brand, Umbro, which will see us use their logo on all replica playing and training wear over this period. This deal will also increase our distribution network and exposure overseas via their existing networks. Chief Executive’s Report (continued) The Rangers Football Club plc 7 Our complement of shops has also increased, with new stores opening in Braehead and at the Glasgow Fort. We have also opened a number of temporary stores outwith Glasgow and the Central Belt. Dundee, Dumfries and particularly Irvine have been well received and some of these temporary units may translate into permanent sites. We have also exploited opportunities in franchising and have opened a store in Hamilton via this business model, which we are confident will provide a sound basis for further expansion. Sales from our Internet store have seen a staggering 143% increase in the last year and continued development in this area is one of the key features of our business plan going forward. The Club continues to protect the Rangers brand and ensure our rights and the interests of our supporters are properly protected and we will carry on working with the relevant enforcement agencies to this effect. In the last year alone, £5m worth of counterfeit Rangers goods have been seized. +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ On the simple flat figure of £207 mill any retail company would expect a return on profit of about a third or there abouts or about £69 mill here, the figures work out to approx £ 6.5 mill -7.5 mill per annum so if Dodgy Dave was giving slippery Dave £3 mill per annim plus the original £14.5 mill, Dodgy Dave gets £4.5 mill- 3.5 mill per annum for no risk, from the projected flat £7 mill profit per annum. Stevie Wonder could see who got the best of that deal.

Obviously you do not like facts, perhaps you got your diploma from the same shop as slippery Dave. ++++++++++++++++ JJB shares leapt 41 percent to 25.75 pence after creditors approved plans to change the terms of leases. A rejection would have pushed the company into administration. JJB needed three-quarters of its unsecured creditors, mainly trade suppliers and landlords, to approve the company voluntary arrangement (CVA) first proposed on April 7.

He was brought back to stableize the club and he got to the uefa cup final then won us the league. It would have been the perfect time to leave at the end of last season and go out on a high for him again i thought. The longer we keep playing like this week in week out the fans will turn more and more on him IMO. It is not about fans turning on anyone, the fans have the right to expect that their club will be run in a proper fashion, and any problems in any department addressed speedily, not allowed to go beyond the point of no return.

I think Walter was brought back because no one of any substance would touch the job after the PLG tenure.

You are correct, ours just appears to grow.

Aye okay, you win. I know nothing about finances. You've outed me. You confuse me with someone who gives a flying. You obviously did as you went to the trouble of questioning Boss's credentials. Too late to back-track now. I don't believe I questioned anything, I just don't give much credence to people who blow their own trumpet, as for backing anything up I think 30 million of reported debt shows a lack of secured debt on our side, however if you wish to believe it is all a bad dream and slippery Dave is really Santa Claus be my guest. ETA. Just to be sure you understand what a company CVA is. ++++++++++++++++++ To enter a CVA a company must be considered insolvent or already be in liquidation. If it is clear that the business could survive if debt repayments were reduced then a CVA could be the way forward. It is a legal arrangement between the company and its creditors and must be arranged and supervised by a Licensed Insolvency Practitioner. ++++++++++++++++++++++++ As they owed money to Rangers I would consider Rangers a creditor, perhaps you do not.

He's fat, he's slow Thank fuck the prick will go Krissy Boyd krissy Boyd Thats a cheeky wee song for you to sing along with Mcboyd Thats pretty sad to be honest. Extremely sad and uncalled for.