Muir

[kerzzo 4]

We are all living in speculation here.

No-one knows exactly what is happening with regards this buy-over especially the mhedia (that goes the same for all those bragging my source said this, a fart more than most tales were true recently)

What we all want is our club not to go back to the state we were back in the 80s before being bought over.

[Northampton_Loyalist 2]

I didn't know Boss to have deleted anything? He is actually one of the most fair-minded and biggest champions of open discussion there is on the site, other than myself of course...

Fair enough, I was merely responding to Gunslinger. I have no idea of Boss's (or your) fair mindedness or otherwise.

[Guest therabbitt]

Bring some clarity? Do AJ's comments not kind prove that the last thing the articles brought was clarity and that they infact served to provide the exact and polar opposite?

whatever your opinion on protests, you must surely agree that they are, if peaceful and directed, at the very least legitimate? that those who DO see them as an option have every right to go forward?

The article published here came a day before a planned protest in which Muir was to be mentioned as a secondary target. The article, by admission of the author, came directly after a meeting between him and Muir. Now, please forgive my cynicism, but I would like to hear the comments of the author.

I appreciate that this will come over as arguementative but you yourself will have seen some of the absolute bullshit I had to persoanlly contend with during that bleak period. Further, you will have seen yourself some of the absolute bullshit I personally had to contend with as a direct result of the article in question. I feel my questions are valid and I hope you agree that I have asked them in a civil and respectful manner.

The last paragraph of your post is something we could argue about all night (in a perfectly civil manner of course ) but I would rather do that on an appropriate thread.

In fairness, I do think that all 'parties' put up with a lot of bullshit as a result of both the articles and the proposed protest.

Remember though, that you are talking about individuals' opinions on matters and that these should not be misconstrued as being the opinions of the 'site' or of 'us' as the folk that look after RangersMedia. We try to be a place to talk about everything, good or bad and as 'editor' (read, geezer who puts up the articles) I would publish any article about any subject that is close to the hearts of Rangers supporters anywhere in the world. Had you written a rebuttal article, I would have carried that and we could have discussed the content of that too.

On whether protesting is an answer, personally I'm of the opinion that it doesn't achieve anything and if we had a unified supporters voice then that is the perfect vehicle for making our feelings known. Fractured groups and organisations makes this impossible and diminishes credibility of the different voices that often have differing opinions.

If we're honest here, all of this comes from us not being told by the club exactly what was/is going on. It raises tensions and forces people to have to guess and rely on 'sources' which will of course be coming loaded with agendas.

[spangles 7]

When it is our Chairman being directly quoted, is that not as good as a statement on the official site? Unless of course he challenges on misrepresentation of what he said...

He was directly quoted in the London times article of last year saying the exact opposite, so which one is it, or as usual are we supposed to read between non existent lines.

[gunslinger 270]

If we're honest here, all of this comes from us not being told by the club exactly what was/is going on. It raises tensions and forces people to have to guess and rely on 'sources' which will of course be coming loaded with agendas.

those articles were presented as fact. the real truth, anyone who said otherwise was called a taig and shouted down.

trust me on that.

[Guest therabbitt]

He was directly quoted in the London times article of last year saying the exact opposite, so which one is it, or as usual are we supposed to read between non existent lines.

Not got a clue. Perhaps, as with the press conference talk of 'out of business', we will see a counter story tomorrow denying these quotes or their context?

[Guest therabbitt]

those articles were presented as fact. the real truth, anyone who said otherwise was called a taig and shouted down.

trust me on that.

I was meaning in general. The whole ongoing takeover, tax case, financial situation brouhaha within the support is because we don't know what is happening.

I'm sure that those two articles were written as they were believed to be fact at the time of writing to the authors?

[Northampton_Loyalist 2]

In fairness, I do think that all 'parties' put up with a lot of bullshit as a result of both the articles and the proposed protest.

Remember though, that you are talking about individuals' opinions on matters and that these should not be misconstrued as being the opinions of the 'site' or of 'us' as the folk that look after RangersMedia. We try to be a place to talk about everything, good or bad and as 'editor' (read, geezer who puts up the articles) I would publish any article about any subject that is close to the hearts of Rangers supporters anywhere in the world. Had you written a rebuttal article, I would have carried that and we could have discussed the content of that too.

On whether protesting is an answer, personally I'm of the opinion that it doesn't achieve anything and if we had a unified supporters voice then that is the perfect vehicle for making our feelings known. Fractured groups and organisations makes this impossible and diminishes credibility of the different voices that often have differing opinions.

If we're honest here, all of this comes from us not being told by the club exactly what was/is going on. It raises tensions and forces people to have to guess and rely on 'sources' which will of course be coming loaded with agendas.

I strongly reject ANY suggestion that the people involved in the protests (on any level above vocal support) gave abuse (which we recieved) or bullshit (which we recieved) to ANYONE who was against them. I approached you and Boss privately and discussed publicising the protests (which despite your obvious disaproval?, and to your credit, you agreed to allow free reign to advertise) and from that moment everyone was in full on courtesy mode. We all knew that fighting would do nothing except push potential helpers away and so avoided getting drawn into anything other than the most civil chats on the subject and even they were rare.

I have not asked you to explain your editorial perogative becuase I understand fully that you merely allow others a platform. As an oft published writer of very little repute I have often had work in print that Suck/MDC strongly disagree with, it is just how it works. I have not actually asked you or Boss anything. I have politely and civily asked the author for nothing more than comments on AJ's statement and with regards to his article. if you like, his personal opinion on his previous personal opinions based on a meeting with Muir and in the face of AJ's statements.

We will agree to disagree on the protests, although you are clearly right in pointing out that the support being fractured is an issue. The lunacy that has overtaken the support as a whole is the single most pathetic story in the history of the club and I fervantly hope that each and every person who has had even a small part in it is thouroughly ashamed of themselves. I have played the tiniest of tiny, tiny, tiny parts and I feel ashamed, hence the retiral of this name until tonight.

the club's part is pathetic too, but we cant simply hide behind it to cover our own blushes.

[gunslinger 270]

I was meaning in general. The whole ongoing takeover, tax case, financial situation brouhaha within the support is because we don't know what is happening.

I'm sure that those two articles were written as they were believed to be fact at the time of writing to the authors?

you know what i think they knew fine well they werent true when they were written and i said as much at the time.

they were just murray esqu moonbeams pure smoke and mirrors.

just more fantasys that never came true.

they were at odds with every other piece of information coming out of rangers and simply never came true.

indeed contacts one was so bad darrell king called it lies on radio clyde several weeks ago.

[Guest therabbitt]

I strongly reject ANY suggestion that the people involved in the protests (on any level above vocal support) gave abuse (which we recieved) or bullshit (which we recieved) to ANYONE who was against them. I approached you and Boss privately and discussed publicising the protests (which despite your obvious disaproval?, and to your credit, you agreed to allow free reign to advertise) and from that moment everyone was in full on courtesy mode. We all knew that fighting would do nothing except push potential helpers away and so avoided getting drawn into anything other than the most civil chats on the subject and even they were rare.

I have not asked you to explain your editorial perogative becuase I understand fully that you merely allow others a platform. As an oft published writer of very little repute I have often had work in print that Suck/MDC strongly disagree with, it is just how it works. I have not actually asked you or Boss anything. I have politely and civily asked the author for nothing more than comments on AJ's statement and with regards to his article. if you like, his personal opinion on his previous personal opinions based on a meeting with Muir and in the face of AJ's statements.

We will agree to disagree on the protests, although you are clearly right in pointing out that the support being fractured is an issue. The lunacy that has overtaken the support as a whole is the single most pathetic story in the history of the club and I fervantly hope that each and every person who has had even a small part in it is thouroughly ashamed of themselves. I have played the tiniest of tiny, tiny, tiny parts and I feel ashamed, hence the retiral of this name until tonight.

the club's part is pathetic too, but we cant simply hide behind it to cover our own blushes.

Sorry, I think you've misinterpreted me or I wasn't clear.

I wasn't insinuating that you had gave abuse or bullshit. What I was meaning was that in the same way you would have been questioned and had to listen to shit from people that didn't agree with you, others will have received shit themselves about whatever stance they took on the issue. It wasn't as though Boss or contacts' articles were met with unanimous post after post of agreement and celebration - those were debated and torn apart too.

In terms of the actual protest arrangements etc. I do remember you coming to me and also approaching Boss separately. I said fire on with whatever you are doing and if you want me to publish something then fire it over to me and I'd do so. At the same time you were also talking to Frankie I believe who became a bit more involved in helping you or at least further indepth in terms of discussions. Frankie, who whilst also having Gersnet, is a moderator here, is a fantastic voice of the supporters and I had every faith in his judgement. I do disagree with protests personally, but what is my opinion over anyone elses, nothing, hence why despite me not agreeing I wanted to make sure you could still have your say and get your message over to people that wanted to listen - much the same courtesy which was afforded to Boss and contacts with their articles.

For the record, I don't feel ashamed. I'm all for open discussion and debate and that's exactly what I think we allowed for.

[Guest therabbitt]

you know what i think they knew fine well they werent true when they were written and i said as much at the time.

they were just murray esqu moonbeams pure smoke and mirrors.

just more fantasys that never came true.

they were at odds with every other piece of information coming out of rangers and simply never came true.

indeed contacts one was so bad darrell king called it lies on radio clyde several weeks ago.

Did he aye? Weird. In what context did he call it lies on the radio?

I can't vouch for or comment on the validity of anyone elses articles, so I'll leave that open to them to come back to you on or not to discuss further.

[Guest therabbitt]

I wouldn't ever claim to have sources or the inside track or even an agenda, so I just call it as I see it at the time based on the information that I have in front of me

[Northampton_Loyalist 2]

For the record, I don't feel ashamed. I'm all for open discussion and debate and that's exactly what I think we allowed for.

With the greatest of respect, people engaging in debate/fighting generally are in a position to look after themselves and if they are not, they shouldnt be there. The articles may have been 'torn apart' but I seriously doubt Boss recieved personal abuse over it, and if he did he could at least ban the perpetrators.

That all aside, there is little more for me to say. I have asked for comments from the author and when/if they come, we will see if there needs to be a reply from me.

As for the last part, if you (as in the royal 'you', not you Rabbit personally) have not contributed to the fractures and general lunacy within our support, you have nothing to be ashamed of. If you have, you do.

[Guest therabbitt]

With the greatest of respect, people engaging in debate/fighting generally are in a position to look after themselves and if they are not, they shouldnt be there. The articles may have been 'torn apart' but I seriously doubt Boss recieved personal abuse over it, and if he did he could at least ban the perpetrators.

That all aside, there is little more for me to say. I have asked for comments from the author and when/if they come, we will see if there needs to be a reply from me.

As for the last part, if you (as in the royal 'you', not you Rabbit personally) have not contributed to the fractures and general lunacy within our support, you have nothing to be ashamed of. If you have, you do.

My conscience is clear.

With that I'll bid you adieu for the evening and we'll see what the morning will bring. Hopefully, we'll have a new owner and a clean start - exactly what our club needs.

[Northampton_Loyalist 2]

My conscience is clear.

With that I'll bid you adieu for the evening and we'll see what the morning will bring. Hopefully, we'll have a new owner and a clean start - exactly what our club needs.

Amen

[spangles 7]

The biggest and most culpable contributors to fractures and lunacy, are a piss poor inept board, whom the majority have presided over many of Murray's moonbeam moments. They have allowed the press and media to traduce the club and support without a murmur, every last one should be fucked straight out the door.

And today at the eleventh hour, they still lack leadership and direction, the denial issued through plus markets worked a treat, every ffucker and their granny are still printing all sorts of truth according to them, oh for a man of the calibre of David Holmes.

[bluenose48 951]

At last we have it from the horses mouth and it is as most of us suspected. Donald Muir was a bank stooge, there to make sure we weren't doing anything to the detriment of the banks interest.

There are people on here saying he was doing a good job, possibly, but for whom and it certainly was not RFC, maybe the bank, maybe SDM but certainly not RFC.

Throughout this whole saga it has been obvious that this was a very tangled web and Rangers debt of 27 mill was not the problem but MIH's financial woes were. We were the big stick the bank were threatening Murray with because their threat to throw us to the wolves financially was one that they knew SDM could never allow to happen.

[gunslinger 270]

Did he aye? Weird. In what context did he call it lies on the radio?

I can't vouch for or comment on the validity of anyone elses articles, so I'll leave that open to them to come back to you on or not to discuss further.

he was talking about all the lies the rangers fans had been told and listed among them the fact that if we made the cl there would be money to spend on players as on of them.

[Guest therabbitt]

he was talking about all the lies the rangers fans had been told and listed among them the fact that if we made the cl there would be money to spend on players as on of them.

We did make the Champions League and we did spend money on players did we not though?

[gunslinger 270]

We did make the Champions League and we did spend money on players did we not though?

but once we had sold player yes.

and unless i am mistaken we had to borrow the jelavic money from another source other than lloyds. though boss is the man to clarify that.

its hard to be sure as we dont have all the details but its possible we took in more money in the summer than we spent. regardless it will likley be pretty much a wash and if we did spend cl money on players it was very very minimal.

[Guest therabbitt]

but once we had sold player yes.

and unless i am mistaken we had to borrow the jelavic money from another source other than lloyds. though boss is the man to clarify that.

its hard to be sure as we dont have all the details but its possible we took in more money in the summer than we spent. regardless it will likley be pretty much a wash and if we did spend cl money on players it was very very minimal.

We're getting to levels that are above my station, but I assume you are talking about the short term loan from future ticket sales? Was amortisation not a factor in our last accounts and paying off existing player fees and part payments?

[gunslinger 270]

We're getting to levels that are above my station, but I assume you are talking about the short term loan from future ticket sales? Was amortisation not a factor in our last accounts and paying off existing player fees and part payments?

yes.

thats what i was talking about.

i was somewhat interested in the need for it if we have an overdfaft from the bank.

yes we payed of 7 million is in previous purchases in our last set of books.

anyway i would contest that what we did with players this summer was a version of 3 card monte and something the yahoos fall for every window.

[thebooler 4,509]

I am a bit of a dick to be fair

Av jist clicked oan that wee box doon in the right hand corner.......................................................................