Getstiffed 8,863 Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 This thread sure has drawn out Declan hasn't it.We either win or we lose. Its that simple. None of this, some payments were administered properly and some were not shite. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
WATP-FOREVER 5,231 Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 This thread sure has drawn out Declan hasn't it.We either win or we lose. Its that simple. None of this, some payments were administered properly and some were not shite.They're all over mate - their entire support has two computers, one for saville row, and one permanently focused on the GERS. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude 20,026 Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 This thread sure has drawn out Declan hasn't it.We either win or we lose. Its that simple. None of this, some payments were administered properly and some were not shite.Do you know, as a matter of indisputable fact, that each and every payment made in relation to EBTs was administered in an identical manner? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spectre 1,663 Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 If you know that much, then what was the final outcome mate.I don't know, I work closely with one of the people on the panel , he's actually in the same building as me just now but he's made it abundantly clear he won't be telling me although it is equally clear that others here have received information and there's only one likely source for that. I may try again if I can catch him before he leaves Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
johanhentze 14,089 Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 Which is now liquidated? Oldco no longer exists. They won't get any money out of it unless they individually pursue Murray.Which is now liquidated? Oldco no longer exists. They won't get any money out of it unless they individually pursue Murray.This is a myth that has been peddled by the media.. really pisses me off! They have said it enough times, it seems, that people actually believe it!!!! Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude 20,026 Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 http://www.rangers.co.uk/news/headlines/item/2431-administration-statementPAUL CLARK, of Duff and Phelps, joint administrator of RFC 2012 P.L.C (formerly The Rangers Football Club plc), issued the following statement today:"Creditors have today given their approval for the Administrators to bring the administration process to an end and to place the company into liquidation."As a result, we as Administrators have instructed our legal team to prepare the necessary application for lodging in The Court of Session as a matter of urgency."Should the application be approved, then Malcolm Cohen and James Bernard Stephen of BDO will be appointed liquidators of RFC 2012 plc, and will undertake the process of liquidation of the 'oldco' company and the continued recovery of funds for creditors."This will not affect the current operations of The Rangers Football Club in any way as it is a completely separate entity."At this point, we would like to thank the many people, mainly the staff of Rangers Football Club, for their co-operation during a very difficult time for the Club."If it were not for them it would have been impossible for the club to continue functioning."As Administrators, our primary statutory function was to ensure Rangers continued as a business and this was achieved."Secondly, we were tasked to secure a buyer for the Club and this too was achieved. We are delighted that plans for the revitalisation of Rangers are now continuing with the new owners' intention to float the club on the AIM market."There has been widespread comment on the administration process but in reality the period 'oldco' Rangers has been in administration has been comparatively short."Our conduct of the Rangers administration has been the subject of intense public scrutiny and we are wholly satisfied it has been carried out the highest professional standards."We have co-operated fully with inquiries into our appointment by Lord Hodge at the Court of Session and the Insolvency Practitioners' Association."Posted 17/10/12 @ 13.48.So can we now put the myth we have been liquidated or are nearly there to bed. The process is only just beginning and as yet BDO have yet to recieve approval from the court of session to act as liquidators of the oldco. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RFC55 108,843 Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 I really do believe the old holding company will "win" the BTC Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
77amurai 258 Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 Why the sad face? It has no relevance to us now.It is relevant to us. If the company that owned us for years loses the appeal then you can bet your arse that any titles etc won during that time will be looked at. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricky_ 893 Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 I really do believe the old holding company will "win" the BTClike i said before, i dont think that its as clear cut as a simple win or lose. it would seem, from what ive read, that these 3 judges will go over thousands of payments & linking paperwork, then decide fi that payment was legit, or not, if not, how much tax should have been, and add that to a bill.from that point of view, what do we consider to be a 'win'? Every payment being koshur and theo ldco not owing hmrc a penny? That would be glorious and then we could begin to unravel why HMRC did what they did to our club.or would be consider a relatively small bill, say £4m, a win? I probably would, our club was sunk by a bill of £50m and a those at hmrc unwilling to even deal on that by allowing us to pay over 10 years. If it transpires the bill is around £4m, again, we should look to see who & why pursued us in such a way that caused the oldco to go bust. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Getstiffed 8,863 Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 Do you know, as a matter of indisputable fact, that each and every payment made in relation to EBTs was administered in an identical manner?Do you know they were not? They don't have to have been identical to be above board. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaz92 966 Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 My bad then. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Carpintero 546 Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 It is relevant to us. If the company that owned us for years loses the appeal then you can bet your arse that any titles etc won during that time will be looked at. Yer arse. You wish. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude 20,026 Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 Do you know they were not? They don't have to have been identical to be above board.No, but I'm not stating my opinion as fact. Its not as simple as 'win or lose' no matter how much you want it to be. Each individual payment will be subject to different levels of taxation. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM1872 3,708 Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 Honestly? I have a feeling the oldco will not be liable for a penny, and if it is it won't be anywhere near the minimum or maximum total's being spouted. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude 20,026 Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 Honestly? I have a feeling the oldco will not be liable for a penny, and if it is it won't be anywhere near the minimum or maximum total's being spouted.I'd be stunned if it was a 100% award in HMRCs favour. Original tax figure was £19m? So I'd have a completely uneducated guess at no more than 30m. HMRC will be luck to see ten per cent of that. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MisterC 12,270 Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 My guess is somewhere in the middle, whereby there are elements of each side's claims being upheld and others aren't so although we know the worst case scenario is £75m, my guess (and hope) is that it will be much less, would be surprised if over £50m put it that way Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sergio 1,199 Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 The decision will be made on the 24th of October. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
54andcounting 627 Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 The decision will be made on the 24th of October.This year? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bear78 96 Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 Why the sad face? It has no relevance to us now.True to an extent but it will be used by all and sundry as justification of our terrible treatment even though it was supposedly not related. To win would make a difference imo as to how our club is perceived by lots of people and would show our detracters up for the bitter and hateful bastards that they are. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mor3los_1 3,672 Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 This year?Probably the year 2055 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bear78 96 Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 The BTC had little to do with Murray wanting to sell. RFC was up for sale some years before HMRC came knocking at the door. As for the more recent urgency to sell, that was brought on by MIH hitting troubled times and the Bank of Scotland (HBOS) coming under the governance of the more hard-line Lloyds. As for the result of the FTTT I hope it is postponed even longer. I would like to see what the SPL tribunal says before the result because that puts their panel in an awkward position.I think dm probably knew about it being a future possibility and wanted to pass the club on before it became assured. The other reasons you mention were probably his main reasons but without the btc I don't think dm would have been as desperate as to sell to Whyte. Maybe I'm wrong but to me it looks as if dm wanted out before the btc at any cost and that's why he ignored all warnings about whyte. Guy's a shitebag, should have been big enough to stand up and defend his actions and to point out it was him and not the club if found to be wrong. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Getstiffed 8,863 Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 No, but I'm not stating my opinion as fact. Its not as simple as 'win or lose' no matter how much you want it to be. Each individual payment will be subject to different levels of taxation.And if we are found to be liable for zero pounds, does that not constitute a win? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude 20,026 Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 And if we are found to be liable for zero pounds, does that not constitute a win?It does. But being liable for £1 doesn't make it a loss. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spectre 1,663 Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 The decision will be made on the 24th of October.The decision has 100% definitely already been made, it may be that it is made public on the 24th but the panel members are having no further discussion on it and have agreed the outcome which has already been passed to the parties involved Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Getstiffed 8,863 Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 It does. But being liable for £1 doesn't make it a loss. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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