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Driving home tonight after the game,on Traynor's phone in he started talking about the BTC (without a caller being on) he was saying that he has heard that its over 294 pages long and will be published in the next few days. He didn't say anything else apart from HMRC are looking at 3000 companys that have been using EBT and other EPL clubs.

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Which is now liquidated? Oldco no longer exists. They won't get any money out of it unless they individually pursue Murray.

the oldco is still in administration, it will soon be in liquidation, it is not yet liquidated

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It is relevant to us. If the company that owned us for years loses the appeal then you can bet your arse that any titles etc won during that time will be looked at.

the BTC and the SPL tribunal are looking at different parts of the same thing - one does not affect the other

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I'd be stunned if it was a 100% award in HMRCs favour. Original tax figure was £19m? So I'd have a completely uneducated guess at no more than 30m. HMRC will be luck to see ten per cent of that.

don't you get it, the oldco has no money and what cash they did have Duff & Phepls spent - HMRC will get nothing, neither will any creditors, HMRC have made this a test case to go after other EBT companies

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Driving home tonight after the game,on Traynor's phone in he started talking about the BTC (without a caller being on) he was saying that he has heard that its over 294 pages long and will be published in the next few days. He didn't say anything else apart from HMRC are looking at 3000 companys that have been using EBT and other EPL clubs.

If we all recall, Leggo stated that 'Red, White & Blue' day would be a day in this week, yet he changed his tune last week and stated that next week would be the time.

The EBT is a joke!

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I think dm probably knew about it being a future possibility and wanted to pass the club on before it became assured. The other reasons you mention were probably his main reasons but without the btc I don't think dm would have been as desperate as to sell to Whyte. Maybe I'm wrong but to me it looks as if dm wanted out before the btc at any cost and that's why he ignored all warnings about whyte. Guy's a shitebag, should have been big enough to stand up and defend his actions and to point out it was him and not the club if found to be wrong.

NOT THE CLUB BUT THE COMPANY!!!

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Drawing from previous threads.........It seems the BTC outcome is to be made public on 24/10........and the affected parties already know the outcome (presumably as a courtesy so that they can take legal etc advice and prepare their press statements in time for the public announcement).

So there are bound to be non-disclosure agreements binding the parties not to disclose or discuss with those not authorised to know ahead of the public announcement. Wonder how long it will take for key bits of the the outcome to be leaked?

I'm hoping that the outcome falls substantially in oldco's favour ie that they complied with the laws in force at the time of the transactions and that if any breaches occurred that they were of a minor or technical nature and not matters of substance. I say this because I strongly suspect that the agreements were drawn up by tax advisers and solicitors who will have had a duty to ensure that the agreements were tax-compliant; that those who were the beneficiaries will themselves have taken independent legal and tax advice for the same tax-compliance reasons; and that the football authorities having had plenty of time to examine and challenge Rangers accounts and did not (it seems to me) have any query at the time of the transactions.

Now if there were technical or procedural breaches that are not matters of substance, then I still suspect that the rampant anti-Rangers fever that thas been whipped this year will doubtless produce reactions way out of proportion. So unless it is a resounding unequivocal finding in oldco's favour I would expect more abuse directed at Rangers which in turn hardens attitudes all round.

At least uncertainty will be ended, the outcome will be known and we can examine it and decide what reaction to give as Rangers fans. Then gird the loins for the next assault in the form of the SPL mercenary Nimmo and his title-stripping band of lawyers.

just realised, it's not oldco who's the defendant in the BTV, isn't it Murray's MIH?

oldco has nothing to do with the BTC

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Win lose or draw, the FTT decision matters not. The damage has already been done and we just have to get on with it. It's up to the management and playing staff to do their job and try to forget what has gone before. Winning football matches is what matters, not a possible debt that will never be paid anyway. I'm more concerned about the present and future, the past is already history. The FTT decision became irrelevant as soon as the CVA was rejected and CG took over, it is only a distraction for bloggers and journalists, giving them something to think and write about.

as soon as we had to have a newco, none of the old stuff mattered, except when SFA made Green accept oldco sanctions

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I know it stinks if our use of ebt's does turn out to be wrong. Can only imagine it would be permitted in an incorrect way because the club would be responsible and liable for running the scheme and not their client. I suppose ebt's and other loopholes are common place to these guys given that they are legal. They probably just make sure everthing is ok from their client's side of things.

the CLUB is not responsible, it was oldco / MIH

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I wrote this on here a few weeks ago, and it is as relevant today as it was then.

I actually WANT the EBT/FTTT decision revealed.

Information has seeped out, both from Jim Traynor, and another poster on here recently, that HMRC, in going after us so publicly, may have completely destroyed their own case.

They have waited an awfully long time to "investigate" the EBTs, something not exactly hidden in our accounts.

Remember this, The HMRC get tax avoidance schemes sent to them all the time, and they vet them.

Most fail, and are deemed illegal, and companies are barred from using them, but others are passed, becoming legal ways for companies to not pay tax on money THEY EARNED.

This is the exact opposite of tax evasion, where you wilfully hide earnings from the taxman.

Our enemies have seized the high ground, by branding us tax EVADERS, when at the very worst, we have AVOIDED tax, and until the verdict is known, are innocent, until proven guilty.

If Traynor is correct, we face a minor charge and a penalty of £6 -£12million.

This is academic, because none of that will be payable.

Another thing I heard was that the Revenue waited so long to bring this to the fore that in effect, they have allowed to be created the monster which has now crippled our club, leaving the Revenue massively out of pocket, instead of recovering several millions...a complete balls up, if they were intending to use it for debt reduction.

If they are serious about chasing up the 8 EPL clubs, as the rumour suggests, who also have used EBTs' will they risk sending any or all of them into the abyss??

Some would like the verdict to be quietly forgotten.

I want full disclosure.

If MIH, who I believe did all our Accounting work, in Edinburgh, and charged RFC an annual fee, it is THEY, not even necessarily US, who deserve to be hauled up in the courts.

This verdict is crucial to us.

I think we should be asking where is the final lowdown on this.

If it was as bad as possible, then the £75 million quoted by Whyte would be worst scenario,and we would be called all the cheats under the sun, for obvious reason.

But, I believe this to be an absolute bluff, and it has allowed all of the mob we now see gathered...the BBC and their hatchet jobs, the rangerstaxcase website, Alex Thomson, the list goes on and on.

We need to know, and hope that the least worse case suggested is true, and then stand up and fuck it straight back at our detractors!

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The btc does matter because like it or not, it will have a bearing on the dual contract investigation.

The notion that david "the ego" murray has sat on a positive btc result for weeks is nonsensical. There is zero chance he (or his media pals) would sit on this, a positive result would vindicate his tenure in his eyes.

If I had to put money on it I'd say btc has gone against murray and oldco.

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The btc does matter because like it or not, it will have a bearing on the dual contract investigation.

The notion that david "the ego" murray has sat on a positive btc result for weeks is nonsensical. There is zero chance he (or his media pals) would sit on this, a positive result would vindicate his tenure in his eyes.

If I had to put money on it I'd say btc has gone against murray and oldco.

Someone has told JT its a 294page long verdict...

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Not getting at you but you appear to be basing your post on other posters' rumours. Where did 24 Oct come from ? If I was in charge of the release of such private information, someone's job would be out the window if there was early disclosure.

Yes, your're right 24/10 was drawn from an earlier thread and from no other source. I've found in prevous lines of work that it is not uncommon for parties to be given the determination of a case in full some time before a pre-determined disclosure date, especially if it is complex and / or potetially controversial and / or likely to be of significant public interest. The release of info would be embargoed and protected by non-disclosure agreements. And you are right on the second part that jobs would be on the line if early disclosures were made. But leaks do happen (and I stress I'm not encouraging it for the very reason that jobs can be on the line).

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