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Vanguard Bears - just who are they?


charlotte1008
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Thats a political speech hidden inside comments about supporting Rangers - nothing more - nothing less - Football,andRangers would be a lot better if people took the politics and religion out of sport.

I'm afraid that Scotland's media and MSPs like to keep politics and religion involved in football, particularly when it involves Rangers and suits their own agendas.

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I'm afraid that Scotland's media and MSPs like to keep politics and religion involved in football, particularly when it involves Rangers and suits their own agendas.

BP9s friend Mr Salmond has been spectacularly invisible in this whole saga.

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So I shouldn't have the right to speak to fellow Bears' over the internet? Why? Are they above me? Would I rock the boat too much? Would my opinions be too far separated from the rest?

You've seen my views over this thread, would an admin even allow me access to the site?

Ok, let me put it this way, if I want to join the "Harley Davidson owners club", would it not be perhaps an idea if I actually owned a Harley Davidson? Or join and say, well, bikes are ok, I haven't got one, but I should have th right to join you and speak about it? Sounds a bit daft eh?

I don't really take what many say on a forum as a true reflection of who they are, wvb excepted.

I would ask, why do you want to join? Is it simply because its a locked door and you want to see inside?

What would you contribute? Time? Money? Skills? Contacts? Nothing?

Just by your "are they above me" comment, I would personally be concerned (I am not admin by the way, just a member), because, I don't know, just sounds a bit off to me.

What are your expectations of it?

Actually, that's a pretty good set of questions really I think

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Your opening sentence is perhaps one of the main reasons its a good thing vb and others exist. Do you REALLY believe it has nothing to do with them?

Lets leave politics (you can't but let's pretend anyway) and religion out of it, and concentrate on... Football

Sfa?

Spl?

Tv deal negotiations

Now tell me "they" don't have a big influence in any of those areas? I skipped the media because that can be classed as propaganda ergo politics ;)

Have you seen how our players are allowed to be treated so far this season? By sfa refs? Now I am the first to say they need a good kicking base on performances but it's ridiculous

You have to remember that "they" are part of what could easily be classed as an extremist cult, so, if we took those elements away, we the people would still be a target for them, they would just be happy they had stripped the club of something else

I leave politics out of 99% of the things I do on here.

First of all who do you class as "they"? Celtic, or more than that?

Do I believe that the likes of Lawwell have too much power? Yes.

Do I believe the likes of Regan are an embarrassment to the organisation they represent and to the country in terms of football? Yes.

Should our players be more protected? Hmm... yes, I suppose, but if you'll look across other games at this level I'm sure you'll see similar tackles and aggression.

Can these things be done outwith an organisation that doesn't marginalise and leave some fans isolated due to their political and religious stance? Yes, yes it can.

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Ok, let me put it this way, if I want to join the "Harley Davidson owners club", would it not be perhaps an idea if I actually owned a Harley Davidson? Or join and say, well, bikes are ok, I haven't got one, but I should have th right to join you and speak about it? Sounds a bit daft eh?

I don't really take what many say on a forum as a true reflection of who they are, wvb excepted.

I would ask, why do you want to join? Is it simply because its a locked door and you want to see inside?

What would you contribute? Time? Money? Skills? Contacts? Nothing?

Just by your "are they above me" comment, I would personally be concerned (I am not admin by the way, just a member), because, I don't know, just sounds a bit off to me.

What are your expectations of it?

Actually, that's a pretty good set of questions really I think

I don't want to join the organisation in its current form. I was told constructive criticism was accepted by the VB's - that's what I started off by giving, and it's descended into me defending my points against a number of posters with arguments getting strewn all over the place!

But what do you class as being a "Harley Davidson" man? I'd say I'm as big a Rangers fan as anyone here. They play a huge part in my life, I've ploughed thousands of pounds of my cash into the club, I know my stuff, I follow the team as much as I can and I wear my pride of my team on my sleeve. But somehow, I still don't feel I'd fit into the "Harley Davidson" club.

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I leave politics out of 99% of the things I do on here.

First of all who do you class as "they"? Celtic, or more than that?

Do I believe that the likes of Lawwell have too much power? Yes.

Do I believe the likes of Regan are an embarrassment to the organisation they represent and to the country in terms of football? Yes.

Should our players be more protected? Hmm... yes, I suppose, but if you'll look across other games at this level I'm sure you'll see similar tackles and aggression.

Can these things be done outwith an organisation that doesn't marginalise and leave some fans isolated due to their political and religious stance? Yes, yes it can.

You have to realise people's motivation for doing things. You may not be political or religiously minded, however, does that matter when someone else's are?

By they, I mean both Celtic and something else. The two, in fact 3 are inseparable. Republicanism and religion are deep rooted there, and in that sense it does give them an edge. Far less half baked Roman Catholics than cos. why don't they like the union? They can't rule it, simple. Salmons has gotten to a point, where nationalism (that's not so bad at times) and republicanism are pretty much the same thing in his eyes.

When you understand why people do things, it gives you new perspective.

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I don't want to join the organisation in its current form. I was told constructive criticism was accepted by the VB's - that's what I started off by giving, and it's descended into me defending my points against a number of posters with arguments getting strewn all over the place!

But what do you class as being a "Harley Davidson" man? I'd say I'm as big a Rangers fan as anyone here. They play a huge part in my life, I've ploughed thousands of pounds of my cash into the club, I know my stuff, I follow the team as much as I can and I wear my pride of my team on my sleeve. But somehow, I still don't feel I'd fit into the "Harley Davidson" club.

No doubt that you are a big Rangers fan, but for generations of fans, we are more than just a club.

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Out of interest, would VB ever decline membership for someone they knew to be a Rangers fan?

Yes, each new member has to be vouched for by someone on the board who knows them personally. Being a Rangers fan, or a member of the PUL community is simply not enough.

The site is ran as a tight ship, and intends on staying that way.

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You have to realise people's motivation for doing things. You may not be political or religiously minded, however, does that matter when someone else's are?

By they, I mean both Celtic and something else. The two, in fact 3 are inseparable. Republicanism and religion are deep rooted there, and in that sense it does give them an edge. Far less half baked Roman Catholics than cos. why don't they like the union? They can't rule it, simple. Salmons has gotten to a point, where nationalism (that's not so bad at times) and republicanism are pretty much the same thing in his eyes.

When you understand why people do things, it gives you new perspective.

You were the one that asked for politics to be taken out of it, you just ploughed the politics straight back in!

So you don't believe a, let's say, more moderate version of the Vanguard Bears' could exist and do the same work?

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I would check with an admin, but I would imagine plenty.

So how can VB possibly proclaim to be defenders of Rangers fans if they exclude people who they know to support Rangers?

'We defend history, tradition and the Rangers support........apart from some of them'.

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Yes, each new member has to be vouched for by someone on the board who knows them personally. Being a Rangers fan, or a member of the PUL community is simply not enough.

The site is ran as a tight ship, and intends on staying that way.

Being a Rangers fan is not enough to join a Rangers forum? One that purports itself to be the self-proclaimed defender of the support?

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So how can VB possibly proclaim to be defenders of Rangers fans if they exclude people who they know to support Rangers?

'We defend history, tradition and the Rangers support........apart from some of them'.

If people are vouched for, it stops any of the undercover beasts from joining.

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You were the one that asked for politics to be taken out of it, you just ploughed the politics straight back in!

So you don't believe a, let's say, more moderate version of the Vanguard Bears' could exist and do the same work?

I haven't read any of the previous pages, so forgive me if I'm covering old ground.

The Vanguard Bears is a Loyalist Rangers website, of that no one can argue. Unashamedly so, I may add. Therefor, politics obviously play a part in who we are, and the direction we are going.

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So how can VB possibly proclaim to be defenders of Rangers fans if they exclude people who they know to support Rangers?

'We defend history, tradition and the Rangers support........apart from some of them'.

I made a similar point earlier... for the sanity of both sides, I'd just preferred someone was actually able to clear up what they mean by it.

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