Gandhi1872 186 Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 so he was moved out his natural position and played out of position. But I thought only McCoist done that...But he ended up being a world class left winger so you could say that is his natural position. Left back was him being played out of position because he hadn't been tried in midfield at that point. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude 20,027 Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 But he ended up being a world class left winger so you could say that is his natural position. Left back was him being played out of position because he hadn't been tried in midfield at that point.Wouldn't a player know his natural long before becoming a first team pro/international? Does that mean any player who is played out of position and finds form there has suddenly 'found' their natural position? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude 20,027 Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 Holy fuck Which ones are wrong? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
the drummer 414 Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 the dutch used to call it total football Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude 20,027 Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 the dutch used to call it total football Aye, but what did they know? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
elephants stoned 2,994 Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 Its pointless listing Bale, Ronaldo, Messi ect and comparing them with Little, Faure, Jig ffs! Playing players who are skillfully adept at more than one position in multiple positions is fine, playing players who are uncomfortable at best and downright awful at worst out of position, especially when we have ample players who are suited to those areas, is not fine. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Straight-Edge-Loyal 6,700 Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 Which ones are wrong?They are all technically correct but a huge jump in.the standard of player ffs. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude 20,027 Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 Its pointless listing Bale, Ronaldo, Messi ect and comparing them with Little, Faure, Jig ffs! Playing players who are skillfully adept at more than one position in multiple positions is fine, playing players who are uncomfortable at best and downright awful at worst out of position, especially when we have ample players who are suited to those areas, is not fine.So who determines these 'natural positions'? I read for years how John flecks natural position was just off the striker only to read him in the paper this week say he always wanted to play centre midfield.Who are these players suited to these position? If they are so good in these positions why is McCoist playing others out of position?Who would you have started ahead of those played 'out of position ' yesterday? I honestly couldn't say I've seen a single player this season out of position who was 'downright awful' as a result of it. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude 20,027 Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 They are all technically correct but a huge jump in.the standard of player ffs.It is a massive jump standard but the principle remains. It's not simply a McCoist phenomenon. I think it was goat that said you wouldn't likely see it at any other club in the world. I'd contend you'll likely see it at most clubs. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Straight-Edge-Loyal 6,700 Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 It is a massive jump standard but the principle remains. It's not simply a McCoist phenomenon. I think it was goat that said you wouldn't likely see it at any other club in the world. I'd contend you'll likely see it at most clubs.Andy Little is actually a right back to. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
GOAT 30,449 Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 It is a massive jump standard but the principle remains. It's not simply a McCoist phenomenon. I think it was goat that said you wouldn't likely see it at any other club in the world. I'd contend you'll likely see it at most clubs.Your pish poor example used players who started off in a certain position, but then found their real position as time went on. Comparing Ronaldo and Messi to the pish was fucking hilarious. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
graeme_4 37,618 Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 It is a massive jump standard but the principle remains. It's not simply a McCoist phenomenon. I think it was goat that said you wouldn't likely see it at any other club in the world. I'd contend you'll likely see it at most clubs.Not to the degree where half your starting 11 is out of position. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude 20,027 Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 Not to the degree where half your starting 11 is out of position.5/6 players out of position?I make it faure (at a push since he's played as many games at rb as he has CB) and nobody else yesterday. Little I'd disagree on as McCoist has publicly said he feels he is more effective at rw than cf. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
plymouthranger 4,265 Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 McCoist honestly hasn't a clue, if he thinks Little is better out wide than upfront.Nobody i've spoke to, has once, said he's more effective out wide. He's a poacher, his game is based around his finishing in and around the box and work rate. He's got decent acceleration, but isn't quick, so he struggles as a wide player. He also can't cross, which wingers with no pace e.g. Milner, have to be pretty good at to compensate for their lack of speed.He'll get some goals out wide, granted. But this is due to him drifting inside, which makes our play really narrow and easy to defend against. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude 20,027 Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 Your pish poor example used players who started off in a certain position, but then found their real position as time went on. Comparing Ronaldo and Messi to the pish was fucking hilarious.Gary Neville spent his whole career at rb despite Bing a CB.Puyol played was always a CB but was played at rb to ease him into Barcas first team.Your not telling me saf spent nearly 15m on a player who they never his natural position?What about gough, albertz, prso, gvb, novo and God knows how many others who all played out of position for us long after they had 'found' their natural position? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
GOAT 30,449 Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 Gary Neville spent his whole career at rb despite Bing a CB.Puyol played was always a CB but was played at rb to ease him into Barcas first team.Your not telling me saf spent nearly 15m on a player who they never his natural position?What about gough, albertz, prso, gvb, novo and God knows how many others who all played out of position for us long after they had 'found' their natural position?You're fucking at it. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
elephants stoned 2,994 Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 So who determines these 'natural positions'? I read for years how John flecks natural position was just off the striker only to read him in the paper this week say he always wanted to play centre midfield.Who are these players suited to these position? If they are so good in these positions why is McCoist playing others out of position?Who would you have started ahead of those played 'out of position ' yesterday? I honestly couldn't say I've seen a single player this season out of position who was 'downright awful' as a result of it. A players position should be determined by their abiltys there, so Jig who has a good goalscoring ability but not such a great defensive mind such as positioning, tackling ect is to my mind a natural striker but because hes big and strong hes used as a CB. Jig is actually not that bad at CB but better up front. Take Stevie Smith he has been utilised at LW and CM this season and imo he was downright awful there, similar to Papac a couple of years ago, Robbie Crawford at RW has looked pretty uncomfortable when put there and although Lewis Macleod is class and that shows, when hes on the left he is also constrained from what he would be as a deep lying playmaker. There are times guys will need to play different positions and thats part of football but having a team week in week out not playing to its full potential because the manager likes square pegs in round holes is frustrating. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
legalbeagle 3,734 Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 You're fucking at it. What sort of examples do you want him to give? Ones that haven't worked? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Godfather 75,699 Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 Spain play a CB at rb (Ramos)Real play a left back as a winger (bale) A winger as a cf (Ronaldo)Gary Neville spent most of his career out of position at right backPuyol and Messi both started their club careers out of position (rb and rw respectively)I could go on for hours here.Seriously? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude 20,027 Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 You're fucking at it. I'm also right however. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude 20,027 Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 Seriously?I'll ask you what I've asked the rest, which ones are wrong? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
legalbeagle 3,734 Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 A players position should be determined by their abiltys there, so Jig who has a good goalscoring ability but not such a great defensive mind such as positioning, tackling ect is to my mind a natural striker but because hes big and strong hes used as a CB. Jig is actually not that bad at CB but better up front. Take Stevie Smith he has been utilised at LW and CM this season and imo he was downright awful there, similar to Papac a couple of years ago, Robbie Crawford at RW has looked pretty uncomfortable when put there and although Lewis Macleod is class and that shows, when hes on the left he is also constrained from what he would be as a deep lying playmaker. There are times guys will need to play different positions and thats part of football but having a team week in week out not playing to its full potential because the manager likes square pegs in round holes is frustrating.Macleod is a good example, it may well be that getting him out of the mayhem of the centre, allowing more experienced players to deal with that, while playing with Wallace more closely will help him and give him passes to pick. Because Wallace is a WB, Macleod gets to come inside more anyway. Starting young midfielders in wider positions is quite a common tactic for managers (ditto young centre backs coming in at FB) Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
GOAT 30,449 Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 Seriously?Nah, he's at it. Nobodies that thick. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude 20,027 Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 Nah, he's at it. Nobodies that thick.I see you still can't pick holes in my examples. I'll give you an easy one. Richard Gough. Did we play him out of position or was the rest of his career spent out of position? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
GOAT 30,449 Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 I see you still can't pick holes in my examples. I'll give you an easy one. Richard Gough. Did we play him out of position or was the rest of his career spent out of position?Richard Gough was a centre back, so no we didn't play him out of position. I can't believe I'm replying to your idiocy. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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