Nikica Jelavic 41 Posted April 2, 2014 Share Posted April 2, 2014 It's not the players that don't improve at Rangers that really worries me. It's the amount of good players that arrive and within 6 months go down hill. It's happened for years. But this year alone players like law, Black , Shiels, Daly have went downhill. This is again taking in to concideration for the level of player there playing against each week. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
topgoalie 637 Posted April 2, 2014 Share Posted April 2, 2014 Many chaps use the exp<b></b>ression "level playing field" when discussing both our managerial and club matters, that is obviously a question that works both ways is it not. If we were indeed on a level playing field as our present day opponents, how do posters think we would cope in all aspects.There are very few level playing fields in football.Look no further than the egoccentric CL where the cream always rises to the top....ie Spanish,German or English.To answer your question i will give you the answer you are striving for..we would struggle. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
scottyc06 6,915 Posted April 2, 2014 Share Posted April 2, 2014 Can you name one player that Auchenhowie has improved since it was opened?Charlie Adam, Chris Burke, Ross McCormack, Alan Hutton, Allan MacGregor, Lewis MacLeod?? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveKingLoyal 124 Posted April 2, 2014 Share Posted April 2, 2014 think some people also forget just cause your sitting in the cockpit of a lear jet doesn't mean your a great pilot.Fair enough but the expectation that we should have a great pilot goes without saying? And McCoist is far from that at the moment. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveKingLoyal 124 Posted April 2, 2014 Share Posted April 2, 2014 Charlie Adam, Chris Burke, Ross McCormack, Alan Hutton, Allan MacGregor, Lewis MacLeod??I think the improvement in them came after they left us tbh. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
trublusince1982 768 Posted April 2, 2014 Share Posted April 2, 2014 Can you name one player that Auchenhowie has improved since it was opened?http://www.rangers.co.uk/teams/academy-information/graduates Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
trublusince1982 768 Posted April 2, 2014 Share Posted April 2, 2014 Fair enough but the expectation that we should have a great pilot goes without saying? And McCoist is far from that at the moment.yeah hes a novice. judging a guy at this stage in his managerial career is nonsense. He could go on to become the best manager in history for all we know.the only question asked should be whether we can afford to have a novice manager at this stage?all the mccoist bashing and name calling of a club legend says far more about our support than it does mccoist. For people to speak publicly like they do on here about him has completely changed my view on our support. We have lost our dignity and respect even for the one man who did more than any to keep us alive. The rest of our x players did nothing. Not one raised a hand or even went to the training park to help him out back then. He is the only legend who fought tooth and nail. Respectful behaviour towards him should have been a must. He must be heart broken reading some of the comments on sites like this, i know i am. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
quinty 1,445 Posted April 2, 2014 Share Posted April 2, 2014 All things being equal we would struggle with the present day management team and structure.If I've got bb;s question correct and he thinks that our present day opponents would have comparative resources (e.g. budgets and training facilities etc we do i honestly think McCoist would struggle to get us out this league nevermind the next one.I think sometimes people forget our opponents train on parks/public parks while we have a multi million pound training facility.Its difficult to think of one player such a facility has improved recently since he came to us.The success of the Academy in recent years can be measured by the fact that in the last five seasons alone 20 Academy developed players have made their 1st team debuts during which time the club has won 3 SPL championships, 1 SFL 3 Championship, 1 Scottish Cup and 2 League Cups.These players are as follows: Lewis Macleod, Fraser Aird, Barrie McKay, Chris Hegarty, Robbie Crawford, Rhys McCabe, Andy Mitchell, Kane Hemmings, Thomas Kind Bendiksen, Ross Perry, Darren Cole, Jamie Ness, Kyle Hutton, Gregg Wylde, Andrew Little, Jordan McMillan, John Fleck, Danny Wilson, Andrew Murdoch, Tom Walsh and Danny Stoney. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
allgers 735 Posted April 2, 2014 Share Posted April 2, 2014 My first thought was BEARS DEN!!!.For Rangers to be at the same level as those around would take some event, probably seismic. So Rangers without the support, without Ibrox, without our training facilities, well that just gets silly cause that would not be Rangers. Ally McCoist and team certainly wouldn't be there.So it's probably fair to say that team could be anywhere in the league... Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaddistonKnight 1,567 Posted April 2, 2014 Share Posted April 2, 2014 yeah hes a novice. judging a guy at this stage in his managerial career is nonsense. He could go on to become the best manager in history for all we know.the only question asked should be whether we can afford to have a novice manager at this stage?all the mccoist bashing and name calling of a club legend says far more about our support than it does mccoist. For people to speak publicly like they do on here about him has completely changed my view on our support. We have lost our dignity and respect even for the one man who did more than any to keep us alive. The rest of our x players did nothing. Not one raised a hand or even went to the training park to help him out back then. He is the only legend who fought tooth and nail. Respectful behaviour towards him should have been a must. He must be heart broken reading some of the comments on sites like this, i know i am.You make some very good points about what Ally did during our darkest hour. but I don't think that necessarily helps cut him more slack when it comes down to the question of managing Rangers going forward.He may become the greatest manager ever, but I don't know how long we could or should wait before determining if this is coming to pass in his current role. I am afraid that I don't think he will become a good manager based on the last 30 odd months in the role.Its my opinion, based on what I have seen. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Al 55 9,248 Posted April 2, 2014 Share Posted April 2, 2014 I think the improvement in them came after they left us tbh.So they were successful in spite of Auchenhowie...is that what you are saying? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveKingLoyal 124 Posted April 2, 2014 Share Posted April 2, 2014 The success of the Academy in recent years can be measured by the fact that in the last five seasons alone 20 Academy developed players have made their 1st team debuts during which time the club has won 3 SPL championships, 1 SFL 3 Championship, 1 Scottish Cup and 2 League Cups.These players are as follows: Lewis Macleod, Fraser Aird, Barrie McKay, Chris Hegarty, Robbie Crawford, Rhys McCabe, Andy Mitchell, Kane Hemmings, Thomas Kind Bendiksen, Ross Perry, Darren Cole, Jamie Ness, Kyle Hutton, Gregg Wylde, Andrew Little, Jordan McMillan, John Fleck, Danny Wilson, Andrew Murdoch, Tom Walsh and Danny Stoney.Thats all well and good but how many are now playing regularly? Macleod and Aird only from what I can see, Ill turn it around and say look at Shiels Black Sandaza and Law and how much they have deteriorated since joining us. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveKingLoyal 124 Posted April 2, 2014 Share Posted April 2, 2014 So they were successful in spite of Auchenhowie...is that what you are saying?Possibly, certainly at the time noone shed a tear about them leaving. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bawsburst 1,381 Posted April 2, 2014 Author Share Posted April 2, 2014 Good to see that honest posters can acknowledge the unevenness between the riches of our wage bill and those of our opponents, just shows money can buy success at least at the level we are at. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
topgoalie 637 Posted April 2, 2014 Share Posted April 2, 2014 Good to see that honest posters can acknowledge the unevenness between the riches of our wage bill and those of our opponents, just shows money can buy success at least at the level we are at.Money buys success at all levels.So the point being.?????? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
quinty 1,445 Posted April 2, 2014 Share Posted April 2, 2014 Money buys success at all levels.So the point being.??????His only point is 'Ally oot' Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Al 55 9,248 Posted April 2, 2014 Share Posted April 2, 2014 Possibly, certainly at the time noone shed a tear about them leaving.I think you are being unfair. At the time they weren't deemed good enough to get into the team and cement their place, the reasons can be argued to death.Doesn't mean Auchenhowie was anything but a hugely positive factor in their development. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
trublusince1982 768 Posted April 2, 2014 Share Posted April 2, 2014 Good to see that honest posters can acknowledge the unevenness between the riches of our wage bill and those of our opponents, just shows money can buy success at least at the level we are at.so should we stop using the wealth generated by our fans to create the best footballing side we can? So to use your favourite anology.You want me to go into a supermarket hand over £100 but only get £30 worth of food in return? Do you even understand your own point anymore or are you so lost in bloodlust for mccoist that all reason is gone? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bawsburst 1,381 Posted April 2, 2014 Author Share Posted April 2, 2014 The premise of the OP is simple , that you cannot grasp it is your problem. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
trublusince1982 768 Posted April 2, 2014 Share Posted April 2, 2014 The premise of the OP is simple , that you cannot grasp it is your problem.earlier on you quoted me as one of the few who understood!No wonder nobody can follow you when you jump from one opinion to another post by post. Maybe you should try answering some of the questions instead of trying to deflect from your mistakes, then maybe your posts would be clearer. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bawsburst 1,381 Posted April 2, 2014 Author Share Posted April 2, 2014 We would be 15 points ahead, if we had a level playing field. IE scouts,money and a board that drove for success on the park were all available and no threat of financial ruin.Edit. Just reread. Thought you meant if we were back in the top league.If we played the teams we do right now with comparative budgets etc then mccoist would be the difference and lead us to glory.Good to see someone is able to address the thrust.earlier on you quoted me as one of the few who understood!No wonder nobody can follow you when you jump from one opinion to another post by post. Maybe you should try answering some of the questions instead of trying to deflect from your mistakes, then maybe your posts would be clearer.No I didn't say you understood, addressing the thrust is not necessarily understanding it you obviously didn't simple as it is, a few have turned the premise into a reason to defend Alistair, perhaps they have a guilty conscience. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
trublusince1982 768 Posted April 2, 2014 Share Posted April 2, 2014 if we stick with the premise ally is only successful because of the disparity in budgets etc1. Is that what you mean in the op?2. If so before we get into whether its true or not. Do you not think we as Rangers fans owe Mccoist a debt of thanks for the massive part he played in keeping the club alive? Would it not be fair and in the Rangers way to allow him and support him as he learns and progresses as a new manager? He has not held us back we have progressed on schedule. He has wasted no money on transfers. The first team wage budget is miniscule for a club of our stature. In fact the wage bill % to turnover is probably lower than our oppositions. Every goal he has been set by the board has been met and achieved with record breaking ease.3. If your premise is true how to you account for the 15 point lead he earned in the spl?4. How did he beat celtic? Whats his record against celtic?5. How did he manage to have such a good run at the start of the spl season, which included a very good run of games where we scored loads and conceded few? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
trublusince1982 768 Posted April 2, 2014 Share Posted April 2, 2014 No I didn't say you understood, addressing the thrust is not necessarily understanding it you obviously didn't simple as it is, a few have turned the premise into a reason to defend Alistair, perhaps they have a guilty conscience. very impressive. Its almost like you consider the legal ramifications of any post and always leave yourself a grammatical out. Something the DR teach their jurnos to do so they can take all the bigoted shots they like. Its strange but predictable i suppose to see our fans start to emulate those we hate. guess its our form of stockholm syndrome. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
scottyc06 6,915 Posted April 2, 2014 Share Posted April 2, 2014 No I didn't say you understood, addressing the thrust is not necessarily understanding it you obviously didn't simple as it is, a few have turned the premise into a reason to defend Alistair, perhaps they have a guilty conscience. What exactly do you mean by level playing field though? Players? Manager? Fan base? Stadium? If you are taking all of these into consideration then there is nothing left to base any argument on? Also who are we comparing this to? Many clubs, just in the league we are in, have different budgets, so again impossible to compare with? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bawsburst 1,381 Posted April 2, 2014 Author Share Posted April 2, 2014 Many chaps use the expression "level playing field" when discussing both our managerial and club matters, that is obviously a question that works both ways is it not.If we were indeed on a level playing field as our present day opponents, how do posters think we would cope in all aspects.Good to see that honest posters can acknowledge the unevenness between the riches of our wage bill and those of our opponents, just shows money can buy success at least at the level we are at.What exactly do you mean by level playing field though? Players? Manager? Fan base? Stadium? If you are taking all of these into consideration then there is nothing left to base any argument on?Also who are we comparing this to? Many clubs, just in the league we are in, have different budgets, so again impossible to compare with?Looks clear enough to me. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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