What do we need to get back to the top?

[the brown brogue 1,909]

26 minutes ago, TheBillyBoys1872 said:

The club is growing every single day. We will have more income coming in. 

Good point actually, we must be raking in a fair bit from all  the Club 1872 advertising throughout the stadium.

[TheBillyBoys1872 25]

6 minutes ago, Smile said:

You have no stated a fact yet. other than you believe the board in what they say. I will ask again what makes you believe in them now. ?

How many times do you need you pocket picked before you say enough is enough.

Look i never said i believe the board. What i an saying is they are what we have. Unless you can get a rich sigar daddy who can cover our losses while spending wrecklessly then we have to grow the business. The board are covering our losses. You just need to read our accounts. Why are they covering our losses? We'd have to downsise in order to cut those losses. That means staff losses, wage bill decreased whatever it takes to bring that loss down. The reason the board qre prepared to take the necessary losses at the moment is because they believe we will turn a profit soon. And That's what i believe. Sponsership will go up and the money we have will regular old firm games and finishing second is millions for us. That alone will make us turn a profit. Then we have to steady our business and grow it. And keep growing it until its at its full potential. 

If you can get someone who is rich and willing to subsidize our losses and put in 20 million and is happy to do all that. I'll drag King and every board member out of Ibrox myself. But its not going to happen. Sarver was our best bet and Ashley goons fucked it.

[Smile 26,600]

1 minute ago, TheBillyBoys1872 said:

Look i never said i believe the board. What i an saying is they are what we have. Unless you can get a rich sigar daddy who can cover our losses while spending wrecklessly then we have to grow the business. The board are covering our losses. You just need to read our accounts. Why are they covering our losses? We'd have to downsise in order to cut those losses. That means staff losses, wage bill decreased whatever it takes to bring that loss down. The reason the board qre prepared to take the necessary losses at the moment is because they believe we will turn a profit soon. And That's what i believe. Sponsership will go up and the money we have will regular old firm games and finishing second is millions for us. That alone will make us turn a profit. Then we have to steady our business and grow it. And keep growing it until its at its full potential. 

If you can get someone who is rich and willing to subsidize our losses and put in 20 million and is happy to do all that. I'll drag King and every board member out of Ibrox myself. But its not going to happen. Sarver was our best bet and Ashley goons fucked it.

 

I think we have come to an impasse, My worry is when the loans are called in we are fucked once again, i see no way forward for a board who have got in on lies and mistruths and i see no sugar Daddy waiting to take on a club who since this board has got in piled on debt on top of debt calling it soft loans.

If King and this board bought your car they would be back at the door begging you to put petrol in it.

 

[TheBillyBoys1872 25]

7 minutes ago, danger ranger said:

If you can't afford engines for a season you shouldn't be running a racing team, just like running a football team, nothing different between the two sports.

Rangers never made any money, at one point we were 90 million in debt on paper, which suddenly went to 18 million of debt which King was offered to buy Rangers, but king would only buy if the 18 million would disappear, it wouldn't so he backed off, why, because he does not have the clout to run a football club the size of Rangers which at that time had the resources to compete at the highest levels and he fine well knew how much it took to run Rangers.

Here is the bottom line under King, Rangers are fucked and getting more fucked by the day and will stayed fucked and his so called business model will ensure we stay fucked for years to come, offering up a fucked argument for a fucking liar is brainwashing of the highest order in trying to tell me you understand Kings business model as being correct and proper, remember this is the man who refused Rangers at a cheap price and then when the damage was done he came in on the cheap cheap and and is running Rangers on the cheap and the realities of buying cheap it costs you more in the long run.

I don't care for your argument for Kings business model, it adds up to the sum total of nothing and I don't see anybody investing in Rangers with him at the club, as for Ashley, he is still hovering about interestingly enough, who knows.

So... You hate King. I figured that much. Jokes aside, you can say you know more. If King wants to fuck of then he could. Then what? We would be even more fucked. You clearly don't understand business. You're ranting on about engines for F1 cars. We have 11 players who play football. If you onlu have an engine like you said you shouldn't be in F1. We have a full squad of players so what is your point? You reckon King should pump 50 million or 30 million or whatever into Rangers when our turnover is less than 30 million? While making losses already? 

Thank fuck you're not in control of Rangers. You'd fucking sink us within a season.

[TheBillyBoys1872 25]

3 minutes ago, Smile said:

I think we have come to an impasse, My worry is when the loans are called in we are fucked once again, i see no way forward for a board who have got in on lies and mistruths and i see no sugar Daddy waiting to take on a club who since this board has got in piled on debt on top of debt calling it soft loans.

If King and this board bought your car they would be back at the door begging you to put petrol in it.

 

Its a bad situation i know. But we'd make it worse if we chucked money and failed. We can't take that risk when Rangers as a business cannot generate enough to cope with the expenditure it would develop if we did throw 20 to 30 million at it. Like i said, Sarver was our lifeline. And we got conned out of that also. Now KingCo ate in control what's stopping a rich cunt coming in and taking over? King would sell if someone came in and offered to take us over. We are not making any money and nobody rich is going to look at us unless they're a fan. Or have a relationship with a fan of ours. 

We are where we are. We can't think what happened years ago. We need to think how to make Rangers making even more money. We first need to break even and then turn a profit. We will never do that if we throw money at it. That's a gamble that we shouldn't be taking.

[RDFM 3,809]

We don't need another David Murray character at all or to spend 80 kajillion or whatever outlandish figure people are suggesting.

 

We need a businessman with his head screwed on straight backed by other good businessmen with their heads screwed on straight. Reckless spending isn't the answer.

 

Scott Sinclair is the best player in the league, he cost Celtic around £3 million pounds (Which could rise to £4,5 with add ons, presumably to do with the Champions League). We also need roughly 6/7 new first team players, which means that we'll need somewhere around £15 million. 

 

The key thing is the Champions League however. As long as we're not in it and they are they'll be better off than us financially and the longer we go not in it our clout with decrease both domestically and in Europe while theirs will do the opposite. You also need to factor in the retail deal, a proper board would be able to use retail very well and make significant returns on it once the Ashly debacle is dealt with. 

 

Also, we probably (definitely) need new management and coaches. Preferably someone that knows the club, for example, a former player or fan. If this were all to happen tomorrow then De Boer or Van Bronckhorst would be my preferred candidates.

[Smile 26,600]

4 minutes ago, TheBillyBoys1872 said:

Its a bad situation i know. But we'd make it worse if we chucked money and failed. We can't take that risk when Rangers as a business cannot generate enough to cope with the expenditure it would develop if we did throw 20 to 30 million at it. Like i said, Sarver was our lifeline. And we got conned out of that also. Now KingCo ate in control what's stopping a rich cunt coming in and taking over? King would sell if someone came in and offered to take us over. We are not making any money and nobody rich is going to look at us unless they're a fan. Or have a relationship with a fan of ours. 

We are where we are. We can't think what happened years ago. We need to think how to make Rangers making even more money. We first need to break even and then turn a profit. We will never do that if we throw money at it. That's a gamble that we shouldn't be taking.

 

 

What worries me also is when record ticket sales were achieved we still needed 3 million borrowed once again, mind blowing.

This board is needing to do a breakdown of exactly where all the money is going as it's not making it's way to the pitch.

A: Who on the board has loaned us money and how much.

B: who are the other lenders and how much have they individually loaned us.

C: What's happened to the Transparency promised.

D:What are they doing to bring in more money.

[TheBillyBoys1872 25]

25 minutes ago, Smile said:

I'm sure Rangers now in the Spl are a more attractive proposition. But with the debt this boards run up most Businessmen will run a mile.

No businessman is going to touch us if we're making losses. Forget the loans for a second. We needed them to keep afloat. Those loans will turn to equity unless there is loans i don't k oe aboit that you're referring too? If we never took the loans we'd have to downsize. Its as simple as that. The board felt that was a necessary decision to take based on the fact we will be turning a profit soon enough. They know we will turn a profit due to being in the top league, old firm games etc and sponsership will rise once our current deals expire. 

What are you advocating here? You want to chuck money at it?

[Smile 26,600]

2 minutes ago, TheBillyBoys1872 said:

No businessman is going to touch us if we're making losses. Forget the loans for a second. We needed them to keep afloat. Those loans will turn to equity unless there is loans i don't k oe aboit that you're referring too? If we never took the loans we'd have to downsize. Its as simple as that. The board felt that was a necessary decision to take based on the fact we will be turning a profit soon enough. They know we will turn a profit due to being in the top league, old firm games etc and sponsership will rise once our current deals expire. 

What are you advocating here? You want to chuck money at it?

 

 

The loans won't Magically turn into equity. Borrow Borrow is not the way forward to run any business.

You seem to be backing and believing this board again make up your mind.

[gogzy 31,195]

a shedload of cash and possibly a new management team.

[TheBillyBoys1872 25]

6 minutes ago, Smile said:

What worries me also is when record ticket sales were achieved we still needed 3 million borrowed once again, mind blowing.

This board is needing to do a breakdown of exactly where all the money is going as it's not making it's way to the pitch.

A: Who on the board has loaned us money and how much.

B: who are the other lenders and how much have they individually loaned us.

C: What's happened to the Transparency promised.

Those are valid points. And I'm with you. Season ticket money alone doesn't cover the operating costs of the club. That's my while point. Thr club as a business is shagged. They're trying to grow it to make more money for the club. It won't happen over night. Throwing money at it which the business doesn't generate risks the security of our club if we fail. Nothing is guaranteed in football. We could blow the taigs out the water and still fucking lose the league after spending more than them. It just means if we fail pur losses increase and King isn't going to keep covering our losses. Especially that fucking higher. 3 million loss was this year. Its getting smaller so the board are doing something right. They increased the wage bill and still cut losses from the year before. We should be close to breaking even when the next set of accounts are due out. Or making a nice profit 

[TheBillyBoys1872 25]

5 minutes ago, Smile said:

The loans won't Magically turn into equity. Borrow Borrow is not the way forward to run any business.

You seem to be backing and believing this board again make up your mind.

So if we don't borrow the loans then what do we do? Downsize? You tell me. If er downsize we're further behind the paedos.

[Smile 26,600]

Just now, TheBillyBoys1872 said:

Those are valid points. And I'm with you. Season ticket money alone doesn't cover the operating costs of the club. That's my while point. Thr club as a business is shagged. They're trying to grow it to make more money for the club. It won't happen over night. Throwing money at it which the business doesn't generate risks the security of our club if we fail. Nothing is guaranteed in football. We could bloe the taigs out the water and still fucking lose the league after spending more than them. It just means if we fail pur losses increase and King isn't going to keep covering our losses. Especially that fucking higher. 3 million loss was this year. Its getting smaller so the board are doing something right. They increased the wage bill and still cut losses from the year before. We should be close to breaking even when the next set of accounts are due out. Or making a nice profit 

 

I think we are needing clarity on where all the money has went so far.

[kingtom80 166]

                     

 

                         three new defenders two half backs,and some one

                          who can score goals.

[Smile 26,600]

Just now, TheBillyBoys1872 said:

So if we don't borroe the loans then what do we do? Downsize? You tell me. If er downsize we're further behind the paedos.

This board and King put up the money he promised initially, he never got in on the battle cry I'm going to give you a crisis loan every few weeks and keep you on your knees.

[TheBillyBoys1872 25]

5 minutes ago, Smile said:

I think we are needing clarity on where all the money has went so far.

Its in the accounts. They are online. Read them. We don't make as much money as you think which is bonkers i know but its the truth. The most valuable income stream in season tickets which is about 17 million. It takes more than 17 million to run Rangers. A lot more. 

[Tenerife Bear 1,748]

8 minutes ago, Smile said:

I think we are needing clarity on where all the money has went so far.

I think roughly from old accounts it cost us £15m per year to run the club before we even paid a wage to a staff member or a player. Add the wage bill on top of that and costs will be up at almost £30m i would guess. 

Season tickets may account for about £18m but where does the rest of our income come from? Catering is tied up, retail is tied up, i can't see where else we could bring in much else. Sponsorship, hospitality. What is left to make money from? 

And this is in no way a defence of the board who have failed to made good on promises made but i don't think there is any money going "outside" the club. There's just none there. 

[TheBillyBoys1872 25]

6 minutes ago, Smile said:

This board and King put up the money he promised initially, he never got in on the battle cry I'm going to give you a crisis loan every few weeks and keep you on your knees.

You're missing the point. If King decides to splash the cash and we fail, bearing in mind we're making losses still. You'd actually hurt the club more than its already hurting. The losses would also increase if we don't get to the champions league. The taigs scrapped into the champions league and was lucky. They have a turnover more than double ours.... Yes more than double.

[William McBeath 2,154]

31 minutes ago, TheBillyBoys1872 said:

Look i never said i believe the board. What i an saying is they are what we have. Unless you can get a rich sigar daddy who can cover our losses while spending wrecklessly then we have to grow the business. The board are covering our losses. You just need to read our accounts. Why are they covering our losses? We'd have to downsise in order to cut those losses. That means staff losses, wage bill decreased whatever it takes to bring that loss down. The reason the board qre prepared to take the necessary losses at the moment is because they believe we will turn a profit soon. And That's what i believe. Sponsership will go up and the money we have will regular old firm games and finishing second is millions for us. That alone will make us turn a profit. Then we have to steady our business and grow it. And keep growing it until its at its full potential. 

If you can get someone who is rich and willing to subsidize our losses and put in 20 million and is happy to do all that. I'll drag King and every board member out of Ibrox myself. But its not going to happen. Sarver was our best bet and Ashley goons fucked it.

Yup the finances will take a bit of time to recover after what was done to us, especially with the ongoing loss of retail revenue. The thing that is going to cause us more problems is that King talked a whole heap of mince coming in the door about splashing cash. If the team is not truly competitive from the off next season he'll be glad he's in SA.

[TheBillyBoys1872 25]

2 minutes ago, Tenerife Bear said:

I think roughly from old accounts it cost us £15m per year to run the club before we even paid a wage to a staff member or a player. Add the wage bill on top of that and costs will be up at almost £30m i would guess. 

Season tickets may account for about £18m but where does the rest of our income come from? Catering is tied up, retail is tied up, i can't see where else we could bring in much else. Sponsorship, hospitality. What is left to make money from? 

And this is in no way a defence of the board who have failed to made good on promises made but i don't think there is any money going "outside" the club. There's just none there. 

Yet, we're still paying money for the likes of Garner. And people say the board are not putting any money in. The club makes no money. It costs the board to keep up functioning as a business. Without those soft loans we'd have to either downsize which would put us further behind. That's what Ashley and his fat bastard crew wanted.

[Smile 26,600]

6 minutes ago, TheBillyBoys1872 said:

Its in the accounts. They are online. Read them. We don't make as much money as you think which is bonkers i know but its the truth. The most valuable income stream in season tickets which is about 17 million. It takes more than 17 million to run Rangers. A lot more. 

 

The board knew this when taking over though was no shock Kings been on the board since 2000, and they did due diligence.

[Bad Robot 21,149]

4 hours ago, MasterD said:

Pretty much everything.

New owner/investors.

A lot of money.

A lot of new players.

A manager.

Unfortunately it seems to be this 

[TheBillyBoys1872 25]

2 minutes ago, William McBeath said:

Yup the finances will take a bit of time to recover after what was done to us, especially with the ongoing loss of retail revenue. The thing that is going to cause us more problems is that King talked a whole heap of mince coming in the door about splashing cash. If the team is not truly competitive from the off next season he'll be glad he's in SA.

But he made those claims before he knew the extent of the clubs finances. I'm not sticking up for him but that's the truth. He could damage the club if he invests to much based on a gamble which is champions league because the club could not afford to maintain that higher expenditure. We can't maintain the expenditure we got. Kings not going to keep chucking 20 million here and there if we fail. It won't work and we'll be back in administration before you know it, if we did that. It seems that's what people want in order to beat the taigs. 

[Tenerife Bear 1,748]

5 minutes ago, TheBillyBoys1872 said:

Yet, we're still paying money for the likes of Garner. And people say the board are not putting any money in. The club makes no money. It costs the board to keep up functioning as a business. Without those soft loans we'd have to either downsize which would put us further behind. That's what Ashley and his fat bastard crew wanted.

I agree with all that, my problem is King also knows this yet still promised to make it good. He still promised to plough money in and he also said that we would run at a loss for a few years yet in order to close the gap and catch Celtic. There has been no sign of that coming to fruition. This living within our means nonsense is a pipedream, a moonbeam right now, we cannot and will not for the foreseeable. That is why we need a board able and willing to invest and a board with the means to do what is needed. the board knew this before they took over, they knew what they were getting into yet still wanted to take over. 

The retail deal is a red herring, it's only worth £4m a year at best. Even that isn't close to being enough to operate properly and close the financial gap on Celtic. 

Right or wrong, this club needs an injection of 8 figures and soon. We are merely treading water right now, going through the motions, or sleepwalking if you like. A sleeping giant. It needs an owner with the means to wake it up from it's slumber. 

[keithgersbear 3,225]

It is going to take time, remember the playing squad 3+ years ago was absolutely ripped apart, the club was gutted. It is going to take patience, probably a new manager and obviously better players but it will eventually happen and Rangers will win the league within the next 5 years.