Pedro: Time to go?

[ForeverAndEver 71,304]

Yes, I think it"s close to the stage of me hating him.

[jamess 3,404]

I'm surprised by the numbers that want to give him more time.  I just don't see him being the answer,  and the longer we duck the inevitable,  the less time a replacement has to turn things round. Needs done well before the January transfer window or I just see another wasted season.

[The Dude 20,026]

Just now, K.A.I said:

I just feel the proof is in the pudding. There's no enough coming through to a decent standard IMO. 

Each of the past 3 years he's been here we've ended up saying next batch, next batch, next batch ... he can't seem to refine them and polish them and put them into the first team as first team ready players. Was told only the other week the focus is now on the next lot of 16's which seems to be the default standpoint.

He's only been Academy boss since Jan 2015. The current group of 20s were almost all in the system before he took over.

The current 16s group will be first one really who will have been through the whole/majority of the 'elite' set-up under his watch.

Can't really blame the guy for lads who have been in the system 5,6,7 years not being good enough.

Not to mention, the whole 'polish' thing is precisely the reason they've pushed this academy games stuff and want a Colt team in the league. There's a huge drop-off in Scotland from 16/17 years old as it becomes much tougher to get kids playing in a competitive environment.

[Gman36 3,454]

Sam Allardyce please... Please... We're fucking due a turn. Allerdyce and a reasonable transfer kitty and we'd be challenging those scummy fucks. 

[K.A.I 36,183]

Just now, The Dude said:

He's only been Academy boss since Jan 2015. The current group of 20s were almost all in the system before he took over.

The current 16s group will be first one really who will have been through the whole/majority of the 'elite' set-up under his watch.

Can't really blame the guy for lads who have been in the system 5,6,7 years not being good enough.

Not to mention, the whole 'polish' thing is precisely the reason they've pushed this academy games stuff and want a Colt team in the league. There's a huge drop-off in Scotland from 16/17 years old as it becomes much tougher to get kids playing in a competitive environment.

OK almost 2 years and 10 months then not 3-years.

But it comes down to your perspective and the faith you've got. What happens if this batch of 16's in a couple of years aren't upto scratch that's 5-years down the man when the warning signs were possibly there but just dismissed. People talk about not wanting to keep rebuilding with the first team and keeping someone who's a crap manager in Pedro in a job but there's something similar going on in the unders too - the wrong people in charge but too scared to change it (or maybe can't afford to change it)

That's why and I'm sure you'll agree it's important to get these decisions right first time. 

Scotland is it's own worst enemy - at the Rangers U20's vs Dumbarton game I was told not many Dumbarton fans will be coming out, I asked why and I was told that their fans along with most others are totally against the premier league teams putting colt teams into their competition which is a shame as it's great for development, it's competitive and raises the profile and money with some half decent crowds. Or should. But as usual it's Scottish football being Scottish football. 

[STEPPS BOY 73,669]

3 points behind St Johnstone and they have a better goal difference than us.

 

Damning.

[The Dude 20,026]

Just now, K.A.I said:

OK almost 2 years and 10 months then not 3-years.

But it comes down to your perspective and the faith you've got. What happens if this batch of 16's in a couple of years aren't upto scratch that's 5-years down the man when the warning signs were possibly there but just dismissed. People talk about not wanting to keep rebuilding with the first team and keeping someone who's a crap manager in Pedro in a job but there's something similar going on in the unders too - the wrong people in charge but too scared to change it (or maybe can't afford to change it)

That's why and I'm sure you'll agree it's important to get these decisions right first time. 

Scotland is it's own worst enemy - at the Rangers U20's vs Dumbarton game I was told not many Dumbarton fans will be coming out, I asked why and I was told that their fans along with most others are totally against the premier league teams putting colt teams into their competition which is a shame as it's great for development, it's competitive and raises the profile and money with some half decent crowds. Or should. But as usual it's Scottish football being Scottish football. 

That's the very nature of youth development though. There have been plenty of boys who were world beaters at 14,15,16 that by the time they were 20 were working as brickies due to their own actions (or lack thereof).

Christ, across his entire time at Man United Ferguson had something like one kid every other season (on average) who came through and made more than 50 appearances for them, and that includes the 'Class of 92' lot and this was at a time when there were far less foreigners in British football.

Ajax are the masters of it but it took them years to get the right set-up in place. It's far from an overnight fix.

The English do the same with U23s being involved in the EFL Trophy.

[K.A.I 36,183]

2 minutes ago, The Dude said:

That's the very nature of youth development though. There have been plenty of boys who were world beaters at 14,15,16 that by the time they were 20 were working as brickies due to their own actions (or lack thereof).

Christ, across his entire time at Man United Ferguson had something like one kid every other season (on average) who came through and made more than 50 appearances for them, and that includes the 'Class of 92' lot and this was at a time when there were far less foreigners in British football.

Ajax are the masters of it but it took them years to get the right set-up in place. It's far from an overnight fix.

The English do the same with U23s being involved in the EFL Trophy.

I know but celtic have had Forrest, McGregor, Tierny, Ralston all come through in the last what 5 for Forrest and couple of years for the rest. 

If they can do it, we should be able to, too. We put a lot of money and resources into our academy it's not unrealistic to expect some players. 

[The Dude 20,026]

Just now, K.A.I said:

I know but celtic have had Forrest, McGregor, Tierny, Ralston all come through in the last what 5 for Forrest and couple of years for the rest. 

If they can do it, we should be able to, too. We put a lot of money and resources into our academy it's not unrealistic to expect some players. 

Not sure if you've noticed or not but we've kinda been in the grubber the last five years. IIrc, they MASSIVELY outspend us on the academy side of things just now and have done for a good few years. I suppose that's helped by having a free run at the CL money for five years while we slit our own throat and begged to be sent down to the third division.

[Brown Brogues 223]

26 minutes ago, K.A.I said:

and that there is a MASSIVE improvement in where we're at just now, which is all I'm saying. 

Yes but for how long? If we are a convincing 2nd this year, we will probably expect the title sooner rather than later. I just dont think Rangers as a club can win the title with our current structure. Its a depressing thought. I just feel deflated by it all. 

[K.A.I 36,183]

3 minutes ago, The Dude said:

Not sure if you've noticed or not but we've kinda been in the grubber the last five years. IIrc, they MASSIVELY outspend us on the academy side of things just now and have done for a good few years. I suppose that's helped by having a free run at the CL money for five years while we slit our own throat and begged to be sent down to the third division.

Oh i've noticed - which makes all the hot air rhetoric from them even more gaulling.

We will never agree on this, you have always thought we've done great work there with Mulholland and I simply don't. Time will tell if I'm correct or if I'm being unfair or if it's something in between both of our thoughts.

But I've booked for Mechelen and Alkmaar and I'm about to book Benfica for Monday after the cup final so I'll still go and support the boys and see if any of them can change my mind. 

Anyway I'm away out to run ma daily 9k and shake some of this rage from today, I'll pick up your response when I get back

[K.A.I 36,183]

2 minutes ago, Brown Brogues said:

Yes but for how long? If we are a convincing 2nd this year, we will probably expect the title sooner rather than later. I just dont think Rangers as a club can win the title with our current structure. Its a depressing thought. I just feel deflated by it all. 

I agree we can't win the title under this current structure but we could be achieving more in other areas, todays celtic game was a pathetic display but it's brought the question of Pedro to a head again as this was his chance to redeem and put the bad memories to bad but alas the nightmare continues

[toad 320]

Unfortunately football development is an extremely tough subject to make a call on. There are some youngsters who excel compared to others at an early age but when they hit a certain age they just don't seem to be able to progress further. It's a really complex subject to determine success as there are so many variables such as physical capabilities, desire, focus, willingness to learn etc etc when dealing with developing kids through to young adults. So many kids also loose focus or get turned away and don't return to the game and  it is such a difficult area to judge success. It s also a protracted process across a number of years but I must admit we as a club don't seem to get as many through as we would like. I suppose it is even more difficult at Rangers though as youngsters normally have to be  exceptional to get through to the first team and stay there, due to the demands we as a support place on them.

 

[Blue Avenger 22,567]

7 minutes ago, K.A.I said:

I agree we can't win the title under this current structure but we could be achieving more in other areas, todays celtic game was a pathetic display but it's brought the question of Pedro to a head again as this was his chance to redeem and put the bad memories to bad but alas the nightmare continues

No one could redeem themselves against the scum with such a gap in quality.  We are not at the taces and never will be under any manager whilst this board remain in power.

[Boaby Bear 411]

I want him gone but he will still be here come next summer.

Nothing against the guy but he is tactically inept at this level. We don't have the time to give a foreign manager the space needed to cut his teeth.

[harlands plater 16,952]

34 minutes ago, STEPPS BOY said:

3 points behind St Johnstone and they have a better goal difference than us.

 

Damning.

And a better manager than us.

[SJFC 2004 32]

4 hours ago, simplythebest said:

The second half surrender is unforgivable for me 

To put it simply they absolutely toyed with us in the second half. As I have said a few times before should not have survived our most embarrassing result in Europe and should never have been given the job in the first place. 

[saltire266 502]

23 minutes ago, K.A.I said:

Oh i've noticed - which makes all the hot air rhetoric from them even more gaulling.

We will never agree on this, you have always thought we've done great work there with Mulholland and I simply don't. Time will tell if I'm correct or if I'm being unfair or if it's something in between both of our thoughts.

But I've booked for Mechelen and Alkmaar and I'm about to book Benfica for Monday after the cup final so I'll still go and support the boys and see if any of them can change my mind. 

Anyway I'm away out to run ma daily 9k and shake some of this rage from today, I'll pick up your response when I get back

What about the boy Atakayi? Surely better than Windass and plenty of pace.The boy Houston at RB gets good reviews also?

[the brown brogue 1,890]

39 minutes ago, STEPPS BOY said:

3 points behind St Johnstone and they have a better goal difference than us.

 

Damning.

Not to mention a point behind fucking hibs, Motherwell win tomorrow and we're in 6th place and 7 games in we're closer to the bottom of the league than the top.

[ritchieshearercaldow 22,109]

Up till now the poll shows Pedro should be given more time, if anyone on the board are looking in that's all they need to see.

I have no confidence in Pedro or the majority of his signings but realistically we are stuck with him, the board will give him the season, who knows we might just make second an improvement on last season and that will do for the board, anything less and he should go.

 

[Boaby Bear 411]

4 minutes ago, the brown brogue said:

Not to mention a point behind fucking hibs, Motherwell win tomorrow and we're in 6th place and 7 games in we're closer to the bottom of the league than the top.

Fucking depressing reading that fuck me.

[ritchieshearercaldow 22,109]

6 minutes ago, the brown brogue said:

Not to mention a point behind fucking hibs, Motherwell win tomorrow and we're in 6th place and 7 games in we're closer to the bottom of the league than the top.

Hivs have still to play them though and they'll just roll over or the scum will gift them a point, in the scheme of things it's going to be hard for any team to take 3 points off them, someone needs to though.

[STEPPS BOY 73,669]

11 minutes ago, the brown brogue said:

Not to mention a point behind fucking hibs, Motherwell win tomorrow and we're in 6th place and 7 games in we're closer to the bottom of the league than the top.

I used St Johnstone because they've also played the taigs.

[Courtyard Bear 41,357]

Aye let’s sack this one and get another in then sack him and get another one in and sack him and get another one in. 

The onwership of our club is the problem when the support wake up to this fact we might move forward. 

[Gandhi1872 186]

1 hour ago, K.A.I said:

I just feel the proof is in the pudding. There's no enough coming through to a decent standard IMO. 

Each of the past 3 years he's been here we've ended up saying next batch, next batch, next batch ... he can't seem to refine them and polish them and put them into the first team as first team ready players. Was told only the other week the focus is now on the next lot of 16's which seems to be the default standpoint.

McCrorie, A Wilson and Barjonas all look good prospects from what I’ve seen and why should try and get them in the team when the chance arises. A Wilson and Barjonas should be playing before the likes of Danny Wilson and Jason Holt and it’s only through playing that they will improve and cement themselves in the first team. Arguably this is the time when we should be pitching youngsters in as the league looks unlikely. I think Mulholland has done a good job implementing the games against foreign opponents too. I was very impressed with the calibre of teams they’ve managed to arrange fixtures against.