Buying and selling - we seriously need to improve (avoid if you don't want to see the Tim's mentioned)

[gmcf 34,142]

28 minutes ago, THE_MIGHTY_BEARS said:

This is what a DoF is for.

Yep . I hope we give it a chance . 

[Laudrup1984 25,100]

There's no doubt the taigs are being run better than us however it's no real coincidence they've been able to utilise the transfer market to their maximum potential primarily whilst we have been out of the picture.

I guess wanyama, forster, vdv and now dembele have or will go onto be very profitable for them however most if not all of these players were signed by the taigs when we were in difficulty and when we had little or no scouting system. There was therefore no competition from us as a rival club, so they have been able to cherry pick players on a promise of guaranteed silverware, fame, finance, Europe and that they can then get their big move to the English Premier League. 

The 4 above players IMO are decent players but the taigs have been able to use the champions league as a platform for these guys, they have exaggerated their domestic success incredibly and their pr machine, also known as the Scottish press have played a blinder. You only have to look at braceface. He's somehow managed to get into the Champions League best team despite being part of one of the worst participating teams in European football history. It's quite remarkable that this has happened without anyone questioning it.

The taigs have been very lucky on two points too. One, the English market is wild right now. If we were playing Champions League football right now and winning trophies we would also be receiving ridiculous offers for players too. In today's market you could probably double what you'd get for Cuellar, Hutton and Boumsong. They have been lucky in that respect. Also, they have spunked a Shitload of millions on a lot of very very shit players. I don't even know half of them as the media sweep it under the carpet and just talk about bloody Pena! They have wasted millions on Scandinavian, African, Dutch, Asian players to name but a few however if you continue to buy lots of players with no main rival to compete against you will eventually get some right, and in fairness they have been incredibly fortunate IMO with the above 4 players especially. Using the scatter gun approach you only need a few to come off and you've done it.

They obviously have more money than us however no matter how much money they have, being in Scotland, they will never be able to truly use that financial gain to a massive advantage IMO. It doesn't matter how much money you have, you will only ever be able to attract a certain level of player to Scotland. Therefore in that respect they'll never really get much better than they are now. If we can't get to that level we'd be as well chucking it. If we can't reduce a deficit against a taig team where guys like naeneck, armstrong, gordon and the thumb are key men then I truly despair.

Despite the financial gulf it's just numbers. It's one man's valuation. It doesn't really matter. More money should give you a better chance but it's not that simple. Look at Real, Milan, Man Utd, Everton etc. Finance is a lazy, easy get out. Yes the board have failed but it's not just them. The board, the management, the players have all failed us and failed us for far too long. As poor as the board have been some of our results this season are simply unacceptable. There can be no excuses.

The key is recruitment, and to maximise recruitment you need a competent board, a competent scouting team, a competent management team and competent players to all represent great value. It shouldn't be as difficult as we seem to make it for ourselves and it shouldn't cost as many suggest or seem to think IMO. Football is so simple but time and again we get it wrong, over and over again. 

The next year is going to be massive. I genuinely don't think the gap is insurmountable (between us as clubs and players, not necessarily for the title this season). However, a lot will depend on how we recruit over the next year and how we perform on and off the field. It will be very telling. If I'm honest though I'm not overly confident. Hopefully I'm wrong...........

[orangecountry 148]

5 hours ago, j1mgg said:

Couldn't remember his name as I kept on thinking of the guy from airwolf, or Virgil ted dibiases slave.

Who the fucks Barry Virgil and how are the bastards getting 7.5mil for him 

[Smell the hotdog 4,015]

1 hour ago, Supersonic said:

Sadly it was not even close. More like between 100k and 250k - McCarthy said it himself.

Let’s be honest the cunt was hopeless and barely worth £250k.

Anyone thinking otherwise has clearly forgot how bad a football player he is.

[Supersonic 4,654]

Just now, Smell the hotdog said:

Let’s be honest the cunt was hopeless and barely worth £250k.

Anyone thinking otherwise has clearly forgot how bad a football player he is.

Yes, he wasn't great but he was definitely worth more than we got for him. He's certainly worth it looking at his numbers this season so far in a higher league. 

Also, even how poor he seemed, I'd take him any day of the week over most the shite we have to pick from off our bench at the moment.

[jim beam 2,188]

27 minutes ago, Laudrup1984 said:

There's no doubt the taigs are being run better than us however it's no real coincidence they've been able to utilise the transfer market to their maximum potential primarily whilst we have been out of the picture.

I guess wanyama, forster, vdv and now dembele have or will go onto be very profitable for them however most if not all of these players were signed by the taigs when we were in difficulty and when we had little or no scouting system. There was therefore no competition from us as a rival club, so they have been able to cherry pick players on a promise of guaranteed silverware, fame, finance, Europe and that they can then get their big move to the English Premier League. 

The 4 above players IMO are decent players but the taigs have been able to use the champions league as a platform for these guys, they have exaggerated their domestic success incredibly and their pr machine, also known as the Scottish press have played a blinder. You only have to look at braceface. He's somehow managed to get into the Champions League best team despite being part of one of the worst participating teams in European football history. It's quite remarkable that this has happened without anyone questioning it.

The taigs have been very lucky on two points too. One, the English market is wild right now. If we were playing Champions League football right now and winning trophies we would also be receiving ridiculous offers for players too. In today's market you could probably double what you'd get for Cuellar, Hutton and Boumsong. They have been lucky in that respect. Also, they have spunked a Shitload of millions on a lot of very very shit players. I don't even know half of them as the media sweep it under the carpet and just talk about bloody Pena! They have wasted millions on Scandinavian, African, Dutch, Asian players to name but a few however if you continue to buy lots of players with no main rival to compete against you will eventually get some right, and in fairness they have been incredibly fortunate IMO with the above 4 players especially. Using the scatter gun approach you only need a few to come off and you've done it.

They obviously have more money than us however no matter how much money they have, being in Scotland, they will never be able to truly use that financial gain to a massive advantage IMO. It doesn't matter how much money you have, you will only ever be able to attract a certain level of player to Scotland. Therefore in that respect they'll never really get much better than they are now. If we can't get to that level we'd be as well chucking it. If we can't reduce a deficit against a taig team where guys like naeneck, armstrong, gordon and the thumb are key men then I truly despair.

Despite the financial gulf it's just numbers. It's one man's valuation. It doesn't really matter. More money should give you a better chance but it's not that simple. Look at Real, Milan, Man Utd, Everton etc. Finance is a lazy, easy get out. Yes the board have failed but it's not just them. The board, the management, the players have all failed us and failed us for far too long. As poor as the board have been some of our results this season are simply unacceptable. There can be no excuses.

The key is recruitment, and to maximise recruitment you need a competent board, a competent scouting team, a competent management team and competent players to all represent great value. It shouldn't be as difficult as we seem to make it for ourselves and it shouldn't cost as many suggest or seem to think IMO. Football is so simple but time and again we get it wrong, over and over again. 

The next year is going to be massive. I genuinely don't think the gap is insurmountable (between us as clubs and players, not necessarily for the title this season). However, a lot will depend on how we recruit over the next year and how we perform on and off the field. It will be very telling. If I'm honest though I'm not overly confident. Hopefully I'm wrong...........

Well said and spot on.

[SPWF 8,230]

10 minutes ago, Supersonic said:

Yes, he wasn't great but he was definitely worth more than we got for him. He's certainly worth it looking at his numbers this season so far in a higher league. 

Also, even how poor he seemed, I'd take him any day of the week over most the shite we have to pick from off our bench at the moment.

I’d rather have Jimmy Bell come off the bench than that useless cunt. I’ve never seen a more inept finisher in my life. 

[Gazzalivesforever 1,987]

53 minutes ago, Supersonic said:

Yes, he wasn't great but he was definitely worth more than we got for him. He's certainly worth it looking at his numbers this season so far in a higher league. 

Also, even how poor he seemed, I'd take him any day of the week over most the shite we have to pick from off our bench at the moment.

I'd much rather have had waghorn/garner off the bench than Herrera.

[Gazzalivesforever 1,987]

8 minutes ago, Rangers_no1 said:

Who are these 'numerous' unearthed talents?

The scum have bought a fuck load of absolute shit over the years as well, which seems to be ignored by many including some of our fans....

Edit: Just seen @Laudrup1984 excellent post above about scum and their poor signings not ever getting mentioned!

For every Wanyama there's a Pukki ?

[SeparateEntityMyArse 53,715]

2 minutes ago, Gazzalivesforever said:

For every Wanyama there's a Pukki ?

Racist. Ye cannae be typing that these days.

[gmcf 34,142]

1 hour ago, Laudrup1984 said:

There's no doubt the taigs are being run better than us however it's no real coincidence they've been able to utilise the transfer market to their maximum potential primarily whilst we have been out of the picture.

I guess wanyama, forster, vdv and now dembele have or will go onto be very profitable for them however most if not all of these players were signed by the taigs when we were in difficulty and when we had little or no scouting system. There was therefore no competition from us as a rival club, so they have been able to cherry pick players on a promise of guaranteed silverware, fame, finance, Europe and that they can then get their big move to the English Premier League. 

The 4 above players IMO are decent players but the taigs have been able to use the champions league as a platform for these guys, they have exaggerated their domestic success incredibly and their pr machine, also known as the Scottish press have played a blinder. You only have to look at braceface. He's somehow managed to get into the Champions League best team despite being part of one of the worst participating teams in European football history. It's quite remarkable that this has happened without anyone questioning it.

The taigs have been very lucky on two points too. One, the English market is wild right now. If we were playing Champions League football right now and winning trophies we would also be receiving ridiculous offers for players too. In today's market you could probably double what you'd get for Cuellar, Hutton and Boumsong. They have been lucky in that respect. Also, they have spunked a Shitload of millions on a lot of very very shit players. I don't even know half of them as the media sweep it under the carpet and just talk about bloody Pena! They have wasted millions on Scandinavian, African, Dutch, Asian players to name but a few however if you continue to buy lots of players with no main rival to compete against you will eventually get some right, and in fairness they have been incredibly fortunate IMO with the above 4 players especially. Using the scatter gun approach you only need a few to come off and you've done it.

They obviously have more money than us however no matter how much money they have, being in Scotland, they will never be able to truly use that financial gain to a massive advantage IMO. It doesn't matter how much money you have, you will only ever be able to attract a certain level of player to Scotland. Therefore in that respect they'll never really get much better than they are now. If we can't get to that level we'd be as well chucking it. If we can't reduce a deficit against a taig team where guys like naeneck, armstrong, gordon and the thumb are key men then I truly despair.

Despite the financial gulf it's just numbers. It's one man's valuation. It doesn't really matter. More money should give you a better chance but it's not that simple. Look at Real, Milan, Man Utd, Everton etc. Finance is a lazy, easy get out. Yes the board have failed but it's not just them. The board, the management, the players have all failed us and failed us for far too long. As poor as the board have been some of our results this season are simply unacceptable. There can be no excuses.

The key is recruitment, and to maximise recruitment you need a competent board, a competent scouting team, a competent management team and competent players to all represent great value. It shouldn't be as difficult as we seem to make it for ourselves and it shouldn't cost as many suggest or seem to think IMO. Football is so simple but time and again we get it wrong, over and over again. 

The next year is going to be massive. I genuinely don't think the gap is insurmountable (between us as clubs and players, not necessarily for the title this season). However, a lot will depend on how we recruit over the next year and how we perform on and off the field. It will be very telling. If I'm honest though I'm not overly confident. Hopefully I'm wrong...........

Just . . . . . excellent . ?

[Smell the hotdog 4,015]

1 hour ago, Supersonic said:

Yes, he wasn't great but he was definitely worth more than we got for him. He's certainly worth it looking at his numbers this season so far in a higher league. 

Also, even how poor he seemed, I'd take him any day of the week over most the shite we have to pick from off our bench at the moment.

We signed him for around 250k and sold for around the same price. I think that indicates his market value.

Even with the dross on our bench I’d still rather not have him at the club. Fuckin sick of the sight of his head down and run into players style and the lack of anything resembling a right foot.

The guy was atrocious.

[Supersonic 4,654]

Another player we'll probably sell for fuck all close to what we should be is Windass:

 

[Redwhiteandblue 3,330]

We have always bought "the finished article" so we could win titles. That's why we have been bad at making money from signings. Except Boumsong and (forgot his name, played with us in the uefa cup season) the other CB, I can't remember us ever selling a player we have signed for more than we paid for them (excluding youth players). Anyway, that's the reason why we have been bad at that. 

Now, we have no choice but to buy potential. What we should've done when we were in Div3. Maybe we would've had more Barrie McKays. Anyway, we're a few years behind, but until we win the league and have players playing well in the champions league, then we are never going to get more that £5m a player, no matter how good they are. 

[Redwhiteandblue 3,330]

1 minute ago, Supersonic said:

Another player we'll probably sell for fuck all close to what we should be is Windass:

 

Either shite or its Warburton. 

[SPWF 8,230]

7 minutes ago, Redwhiteandblue said:

We have always bought "the finished article" so we could win titles. That's why we have been bad at making money from signings. Except Boumsong and (forgot his name, played with us in the uefa cup season) the other CB, I can't remember us ever selling a player we have signed for more than we paid for them (excluding youth players). Anyway, that's the reason why we have been bad at that. 

Now, we have no choice but to buy potential. What we should've done when we were in Div3. Maybe we would've had more Barrie McKays. Anyway, we're a few years behind, but until we win the league and have players playing well in the champions league, then we are never going to get more that £5m a player, no matter how good they are. 

Carlos Cuellar. How can you forget one of the most important players in one of the most memorable seasons in our history? It was only 10 years ago 

[MasterD 7,435]

20 minutes ago, Supersonic said:

Another player we'll probably sell for fuck all close to what we should be is Windass:

 

Hands aff 

[Malvern 11,329]

9 hours ago, Supersonic said:

What are you talking about? We got like £600k for selling Mckay and Waggy mate, we're quids in!!

 

 

only got to get another 19,500K now before Dinky is paid off, well it is his kids inheritance after all.

[NixonRFC 1,333]

13 hours ago, gj923 said:

I want to see us get to a position where we don't have to sell players - the worrying thing as a poster mentioned above is that if a club comes in the likes of morelos or mccrorie with an offer we would probably take it in January.

We sold Mckay to the championship for 500k whilst they sold Johansen for about 2m to Fulham.

Johansen was a league winner in Scotland and Norway, a full internationalist playing regularly and had played plenty of European games, he was also Scotland's Player of the Year the year before Fulham signed him, I don't doubt the tims business model is pretty good but i don't think this one was one of their better moves.

[Drunk and disorderly. 14,418]

Surely this is why we have brought a dof in. Won't work overnight. Leaving the buying and selling of players to the board clearly wasn't working. Letting managers like Ally negotiate contracts was throwing money away too.

 

 

[Tam Müller 340]

19 hours ago, Gazza1212 said:

It may make for uncomfortable reading for some but for all their many faults it was the scums fanbase that initiated all that's right with their club......thats fact wither you choose to a accept it or not that is fact. Not Mccann,  not lawell it was just tarriers who decided amongst themselves enough is enough. 

They hit rock bottom, united in sufficient numbers to force change and made it happen. I believe I'm  among the most bitter detractors of cfc on here but even I can't deny the truth. 

Different times, different financial era but if the will is there it can be done .

Sorry mate but I find that to be pish. Have a quick look at their attendences over the 90s and it shows them for the gloryhunters they were/are

We sunk as far as any Scottish club can sink and we broke records for attendance. The only exception being 14/15 as part of a fan wide boycott.

in Warburtons championship season we had a higher average attendance than them despite them winning the league at a canter and europa league football.

Even the last season and a half I dont remember a league game attendence being below 45k and thats despite utter dogshit not to mention two 5-1s and the worst result in footballing history being pumped out of europe by a team of cheese spinners and goat farmers.

not meaning to get up on the soapbox but it fucking riles me hearing about how they saved their club. Did they bollocks! A wee tit in a bunnet did and they flocked back seeking glory.

They might be streets ahead, 10k extra seats in their scaffolding supported shithole stadium, have an epl manager and be the best theyve been in 15 years but are they fuck a better fanbase or bigger club.

[GlasgowRangers1983 461]

The press have a massive part to play in the inflation of celtic players costs.

[James Rolle 514]

15 hours ago, Supersonic said:

Another player we'll probably sell for fuck all close to what we should be is Windass:

 

What is “close to what we should be”? Media reports that we have knocked back 200k for Josh!! Apparently we value him at 2m, which is about right. We really have fucked ourselves by letting some decent players go for peanuts, now all those lower league chumps think they can come in and pick off our best players for nothing!

[Gazza1212 1,212]

1 hour ago, Tam Müller said:

Sorry mate but I find that to be pish. Have a quick look at their attendences over the 90s and it shows them for the gloryhunters they were/are

We sunk as far as any Scottish club can sink and we broke records for attendance. The only exception being 14/15 as part of a fan wide boycott.

in Warburtons championship season we had a higher average attendance than them despite them winning the league at a canter and europa league football.

Even the last season and a half I dont remember a league game attendence being below 45k and thats despite utter dogshit not to mention two 5-1s and the worst result in footballing history being pumped out of europe by a team of cheese spinners and goat farmers.

not meaning to get up on the soapbox but it fucking riles me hearing about how they saved their club. Did they bollocks! A wee tit in a bunnet did and they flocked back seeking glory.

They might be streets ahead, 10k extra seats in their scaffolding supported shithole stadium, have an epl manager and be the best theyve been in 15 years but are they fuck a better fanbase or bigger club.

Before I address the rest of the post mate let's make one thing abundantly clear. At no point did I say or even infer they were a better fan base or a bigger club. Some of the fenian propaganda associated with them is genuinely hilarious and I certainly don't buy into it.  All this "club like no other" fucking nonsense is for the gulable and nothing more. 

I'm well aware of the facts surrounding attendances etc. The difference being we don't feel the necessity to shove it down everyone's throat. But truth be known this only makes our current situation all the more frustrating for me because no one can deny the feeling is there. 

What worries me is our failure to come together. That's what troubles me and that's my biggest fear moving forward. It's high time we attract our own "Wee tit in the bonnet" because this shambles we are all propping up bears very little resemblance to the Rangers I know. 

Every year that passes it seems to me we become more apathetic and tolerant of mediocrity. All the time they grow stronger, more organised and more intent in keeping the status quo. I wholeheartedly believe we as a support have the desire within us to get back on top but it's the infighting and lack of focus that restricts our progress. 

[MurrayWilson 3,381]

18 hours ago, Laudrup1984 said:

There's no doubt the taigs are being run better than us however it's no real coincidence they've been able to utilise the transfer market to their maximum potential primarily whilst we have been out of the picture.

I guess wanyama, forster, vdv and now dembele have or will go onto be very profitable for them however most if not all of these players were signed by the taigs when we were in difficulty and when we had little or no scouting system. There was therefore no competition from us as a rival club, so they have been able to cherry pick players on a promise of guaranteed silverware, fame, finance, Europe and that they can then get their big move to the English Premier League. 

The 4 above players IMO are decent players but the taigs have been able to use the champions league as a platform for these guys, they have exaggerated their domestic success incredibly and their pr machine, also known as the Scottish press have played a blinder. You only have to look at braceface. He's somehow managed to get into the Champions League best team despite being part of one of the worst participating teams in European football history. It's quite remarkable that this has happened without anyone questioning it.

The taigs have been very lucky on two points too. One, the English market is wild right now. If we were playing Champions League football right now and winning trophies we would also be receiving ridiculous offers for players too. In today's market you could probably double what you'd get for Cuellar, Hutton and Boumsong. They have been lucky in that respect. Also, they have spunked a Shitload of millions on a lot of very very shit players. I don't even know half of them as the media sweep it under the carpet and just talk about bloody Pena! They have wasted millions on Scandinavian, African, Dutch, Asian players to name but a few however if you continue to buy lots of players with no main rival to compete against you will eventually get some right, and in fairness they have been incredibly fortunate IMO with the above 4 players especially. Using the scatter gun approach you only need a few to come off and you've done it.

They obviously have more money than us however no matter how much money they have, being in Scotland, they will never be able to truly use that financial gain to a massive advantage IMO. It doesn't matter how much money you have, you will only ever be able to attract a certain level of player to Scotland. Therefore in that respect they'll never really get much better than they are now. If we can't get to that level we'd be as well chucking it. If we can't reduce a deficit against a taig team where guys like naeneck, armstrong, gordon and the thumb are key men then I truly despair.

Despite the financial gulf it's just numbers. It's one man's valuation. It doesn't really matter. More money should give you a better chance but it's not that simple. Look at Real, Milan, Man Utd, Everton etc. Finance is a lazy, easy get out. Yes the board have failed but it's not just them. The board, the management, the players have all failed us and failed us for far too long. As poor as the board have been some of our results this season are simply unacceptable. There can be no excuses.

The key is recruitment, and to maximise recruitment you need a competent board, a competent scouting team, a competent management team and competent players to all represent great value. It shouldn't be as difficult as we seem to make it for ourselves and it shouldn't cost as many suggest or seem to think IMO. Football is so simple but time and again we get it wrong, over and over again. 

The next year is going to be massive. I genuinely don't think the gap is insurmountable (between us as clubs and players, not necessarily for the title this season). However, a lot will depend on how we recruit over the next year and how we perform on and off the field. It will be very telling. If I'm honest though I'm not overly confident. Hopefully I'm wrong...........

This nails it perfectly. Its a complete waste of time worrying about the difference in finances. Its about doing what we do right, just as you say. The problem is we do just about everything wrong, manager selection and subsequent player purchases being the main faults. The last debacle with pedro has set us back big style, if we cant get these things right then weve no chance.