Howsitgoing 4,281 Posted December 9, 2020 Share Posted December 9, 2020 1 minute ago, JamieD said: I don't understand what you mean. The English meaning is the same. It means black in Romanian, Spanish, Portuguese and English. It's just outdated in one of these languages. There’s a massive difference in calling a non white guy a “black guy” or a ”n****” Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
British_Empire 9,648 Posted December 9, 2020 Share Posted December 9, 2020 1 minute ago, JamieD said: Indeed. There are two separate issues here. If the outrage is because the word he used to describe black people was similar to "negro" then that's one thing, the problem then is with the Romanian language, not with the assistant ref. But if the outrage is because he used the guy's colour to identify him then that's a separate issue and I can see both sides. I don't think Webo or his colleagues would be offended if in the course of a normal conversation a white person described someone as "a black guy", but having someone striding over and saying "That black guy, send him off" and then getting a red card waved in your face is a different matter, especially if as far as you know the word used is widely considered to be outdated and offensive (to English speakers, which both Webo and Demba Ba are).Might it have been good all round if they had had a calm conversation about it and the guy could explain himself? Sure. I can understand in the heat of the moment why that didn't happen though. It's a natural consequence of the divide and rule society we live in under liberal capitalism International socialism is the only solution. That's exactly it. I think my first post on this was making the same point that if the whole world wasn't swept away in this hysteria and literally seeing racism everywhere and the momentums/bandwagons around it, then there could have been a calm conversation where the Romanian 4th official could have simply apologised if there was offence taken, but reassured that it's just another language and been picked up wrong - in other times (better times) both parties could have had a chuckle, shook hands and that was that. No chance of that in this current environment though. Depressing. The way things are, all this does is enhances racial tensions and makes things worse. Howsitgoing 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamieD 18,732 Posted December 9, 2020 Share Posted December 9, 2020 19 minutes ago, Howsitgoing said: There’s a massive difference in calling a non white guy a “black guy” or a ”n****” Yes, in English. But that's not because of the meaning, it's because of the historical baggage. The word "negro" in English has never been an insult. It is a description. The same description as "negro" in Spanish or "Negru" in Romanian. It's just no longer used because of its associations, which likely don't exist at all in Romania and which nobody gives a toss about in Spain. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howsitgoing 4,281 Posted December 9, 2020 Share Posted December 9, 2020 3 minutes ago, JamieD said: Yes, in English. But that's not because of the meaning, it's because of the historical baggage. The word "negro" in English has never been an insult. It is a description. The same description as "negro" in Spanish or "Negru" in Romanian. It's just no longer used because of its associations, which likely don't exist at all in Romania and which nobody gives a toss about in Spain. The player quite clearly translated the referees conversation and claimed that the referee used the “n*****” word as in the English version. He didn’t. The player mistook that word, didn’t realise its context in the language it was spoken and blew this out of proportion. The player isn’t big enough to admit his mistake and the referee will have to be outed as a racist due to it. Maybe the ref was stupid to use the colour of his skin as a way to differentiate the coach but it was not in the same context as this players rant. “ claiming he used the English version of n****. If the player did mean it in the Romanian languages term then he should of shouted that in his little rant. “You said black” has got far less consequences as “ you said n****” eejay the dj 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
KeyserSoze 14,438 Posted December 9, 2020 Share Posted December 9, 2020 1 hour ago, Dennis Reynolds said: 7th head in from the left in the back row, it’s not that difficult. Booooom 👍 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bears 791 Posted December 9, 2020 Share Posted December 9, 2020 57 minutes ago, JamieD said: Might it have been good all round if they had had a calm conversation about it and the guy could explain himself? Sure. I can understand in the heat of the moment why that didn't happen though. It's a natural consequence of the divide and rule society we live in under liberal capitalism International socialism is the only solution. I wonder if any Romanians would be - very understandably - offended by that comment! Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamieD 18,732 Posted December 9, 2020 Share Posted December 9, 2020 7 minutes ago, Bears said: I wonder if any Romanians would be - very understandably - offended by that comment! Perhaps, but Ceausescu's national communism was about as far from international socialism as you can get. Which is why the west liked him. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamieD 18,732 Posted December 9, 2020 Share Posted December 9, 2020 Anyway, British_Empire liked and agreed with my comment, which is good enough for me. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ForeverAndEver 70,942 Posted December 9, 2020 Share Posted December 9, 2020 5 hours ago, British_Empire said: He called him something like Nuguru which in Romanian literally just translates to black person. In the coaches defence, he's probably heard negro as he doesn't speak Romanian but maybe if everyone wasn't obsessed with race and the official got the chance to explain to him properly without all the emotion in it it could have been cleared up? No chance of that. People would rather have the shit storm and the momentum from this bandwagon going on forever instead of letting common sense prevail at some point. Or the ref could’ve called him by name, fairly simple. 3 hours ago, Howsitgoing said: That’s what I’m thinking too. You hear him shouting “you said negro”. When someone explained to him that he meant “black” he altered it to “ you don’t say white player”. The guy will lose his refereeing license for that. If there was a group of black guys with one white guy in there would you not say “ the white guy” because I would. It’s two different people. The assistant is the one going on about negro and Ba is going on about him saying black guy. 1 hour ago, eejay the dj said: Brainless and unprofessional happens every second in life to be fair mate Players walking off the pitch is footballing anarchy .And should be absolutely hammered by UEFA When they grow a set of balls Na, load of shite. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bears 791 Posted December 9, 2020 Share Posted December 9, 2020 1 minute ago, JamieD said: Perhaps, but Ceausescu's national communism was about as far from international socialism as you can get. Which is why the west liked him. Try telling that to those who suffered there for decades. All far left systems are us vs them, just not officially. Any applied 'socialism' turns out in similar terms in reality. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
British_Empire 9,648 Posted December 9, 2020 Share Posted December 9, 2020 1 minute ago, ForeverAndEver said: Or the ref could’ve called him by name, fairly simple. But we're talking about the 4th official pointing out to the ref who he was and he didn't know his name. Bears 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ForeverAndEver 70,942 Posted December 9, 2020 Share Posted December 9, 2020 Just now, British_Empire said: But we're talking about the 4th official pointing out to the ref who he was and he didn't know his name. He should. Not exactly hard is it. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howsitgoing 4,281 Posted December 9, 2020 Share Posted December 9, 2020 6 minutes ago, ForeverAndEver said: Or the ref could’ve called him by name, fairly simple. It’s two different people. The assistant is the one going on about negro and Ba is going on about him saying black guy. Na, load of shite. They’ve just disabled the video. There’s a non white football player ranting to an official that he said negro. He didn’t, he said black as a way to describe this non white coach. I hope the official sues the offended little cretin. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
British_Empire 9,648 Posted December 9, 2020 Share Posted December 9, 2020 2 minutes ago, ForeverAndEver said: He should. Not exactly hard is it. I don't know and neither do you. I don't know if I expect a 4th official who's only helping out to know the names of all the coaching staff on either side or bodies dotted about the dug out. Can agree it's maybe a bit unprofessional if he doesn't but that's where it starts and stops. Racism for calling a black man black is the issue. Bears and Howsitgoing 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ForeverAndEver 70,942 Posted December 9, 2020 Share Posted December 9, 2020 4 minutes ago, Howsitgoing said: They’ve just disabled the video. There’s a non white football player ranting to an official that he said negro. He didn’t, he said black as a way to describe this non white coach. I hope the official sues the offended little cretin. Ba doesn’t mention negro, he says why call me this black guy because you never call somebody this white guy. The negro is from the assistant asking why he said negro. 4 minutes ago, British_Empire said: I don't know and neither do you. I don't know if I expect a 4th official who's only helping out to know the names of all the coaching staff on either side or bodies dotted about the dug out. Can agree it's maybe a bit unprofessional if he doesn't but that's where it starts and stops. Racism for calling a black man black is the issue. I do know, he should learn who they all are. It’s certainly no difficult either. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamieD 18,732 Posted December 9, 2020 Share Posted December 9, 2020 5 minutes ago, Bears said: Try telling that to those who suffered there for decades. All far left systems are us vs them, just not officially. Any applied 'socialism' turns out in similar terms in reality. I mean, I could tell it to the Romanian people who have elected as the largest party to their parliament a member party of the Socialist International, if you like. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brubear 2,880 Posted December 9, 2020 Share Posted December 9, 2020 1 hour ago, Dennis Reynolds said: Sorry counting and directions not a strong point for you. Problem is it is not clear who is and who isn't in the back row, so not that obvious. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
left winger 13,978 Posted December 9, 2020 Share Posted December 9, 2020 1 hour ago, British_Empire said: Because the word the 4th official used is something like Neguru (not the exact spelling but it's to that effect) which is Romanian for black person and when said it does sound like negro. I think it's a safe assumption to be honest he was using that word since it translates in his own language rather than just saying negro. I think you’re right, but safe assumptions when discussing such subjects, these days, aren’t really that safe. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
British_Empire 9,648 Posted December 9, 2020 Share Posted December 9, 2020 1 minute ago, ForeverAndEver said: I do know, he should learn who they all are. It’s certainly no difficult either. No, the only thing you THINK you know is that it's professional to know their names. You have no idea how hard it might be, in the heat of the moment to know the names of everyone dotted about the dug out. He's a 4th official not the ref. It's not like it's a domestic competition where you see these guys and engage with them every week. As I just said, I can accept it if anyone thinks it's unprofessional but it's in no way racist to call a black man, a black man. If you disagree with that sentence then you're another that's lost the plot. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howsitgoing 4,281 Posted December 9, 2020 Share Posted December 9, 2020 Just now, ForeverAndEver said: Ba doesn’t mention negro, he says why call me this black guy because you never call somebody this white guy. The negro is from the assistant asking why he said negro. I do know, he should learn who they all are. It’s certainly no difficult either. Someone has claimed that this 4th official used the n***** word. That offended little cretin should be sued by this official. They’ve shut down the twitter video now and so they should. This official will be used as a scape goat due to someone ears dropping and it resulting in slander against an official that was doing his job albeit he could of found a better way to differentiate the coach. There’s a big difference from this official saying that “ n**** over there” or “ that black guy over there” Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ger4life_1872 29,308 Posted December 9, 2020 Share Posted December 9, 2020 Imo part of the problem last night seems to be the 4th official only ever uses the term black guy to refer to the coach that got the red card , if he calls the ref over and says you need to deal with the coach he can't act like that , then points him out as the black coach I don't think there should be an issue, But on whats available just now he seems to say to the ref you need to deal with the black guy over there he can't act like that Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ForeverAndEver 70,942 Posted December 9, 2020 Share Posted December 9, 2020 3 minutes ago, British_Empire said: No, the only thing you THINK you know is that it's professional to know their names. You have no idea how hard it might be, in the heat of the moment to know the names of everyone dotted about the dug out. He's a 4th official not the ref. It's not like it's a domestic competition where you see these guys and engage with them every week. As I just said, I can accept it if anyone thinks it's unprofessional but it's in no way racist to call a black man, a black man. If you disagree with that sentence then you're another that's lost the plot. Lol. I’d you’re a 4th official and don’t know there is something wrong. It’s not, but regardless of language (like Cavani) using the word negro during a game/on social media is daft. Lost the plot would be the likes of you greeting in every thread x Just now, Howsitgoing said: Someone has claimed that this 4th official used the n***** word. That offended little cretin should be sued by this official. They’ve shut down the twitter video now and so they should. This official will be used as a scape goat due to someone ears dropping and it resulting in slander against an official that was doing his job albeit he could of found a better way to differentiate the coach. There’s a big difference from this official saying that “ n**** over there” or “ that black guy over there” Jesus holy fuck. Ears dropping Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howsitgoing 4,281 Posted December 9, 2020 Share Posted December 9, 2020 Just now, ForeverAndEver said: Lol. I’d you’re a 4th official and don’t know there is something wrong. It’s not, but regardless of language (like Cavani) using the word negro during a game/on social media is daft. Lost the plot would be the likes of you greeting in every thread x Jesus holy fuck. Ears dropping He picked up on one word and took a different context from it. That usually is the consequences of ears dropping. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howsitgoing 4,281 Posted December 9, 2020 Share Posted December 9, 2020 2 minutes ago, ForeverAndEver said: Lol. I’d you’re a 4th official and don’t know there is something wrong. It’s not, but regardless of language (like Cavani) using the word negro during a game/on social media is daft. Lost the plot would be the likes of you greeting in every thread x Jesus holy fuck. Ears dropping Ok sorry eavesdropping. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
British_Empire 9,648 Posted December 9, 2020 Share Posted December 9, 2020 6 minutes ago, ForeverAndEver said: Lol. I’d you’re a 4th official and don’t know there is something wrong. It’s not, but regardless of language (like Cavani) using the word negro during a game/on social media is daft. Lost the plot would be the likes of you greeting in every thread x I'd rather comment in every thread regarding this shite and try add something compared to you, who adds fuck-all across the whole forum apart from stupid comments or trolling. You're honesty a wee nyaff at times. You are trying to argue over the wrong thing too. I don't know if it's bad practice or not for a 4th official to not know everyone by name splattered across the dug outs. Maybe he should know and he's not done his homework, I'll happily go with that - my issue is simple, that irrespective of that, calling a black man black is not racist and doesn't merit teams walking off the pitch like an act of barbaric racism has occurred. If you think that's racist you're an utter spazzy. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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