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COVID Breach


falkirkNS

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Find it weird how people use young and stupid in the same breath.  I know people who are young and not stupid as well as people who are old and stupid.  

Most young people are not stupid.  What the players displayed was a sense of arrogance that they were somehow above Covid regulations, that they can do whatever they like whilst the vast majority of people their age stay at home, even though they would love to hit the town on a night out.  And they knew that the risk of being caught would far outweigh the loss faced by an average young person who chose to breach the rules. 

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2 minutes ago, bluenoz said:

Can you honestly say you know all the covid rules mate? Cos they seem to change a lot. At least I get mixed up sometimes.

Let's just say the other five were their girlfriends for a moment. It wouldn't be outrageous for them to think they were still in a bubble even though we all know they weren't.

The details remain somewhat unclear.

Now if the other five were not their girlfriends then the guilt is unquestionable and if so, why was fringpong never questioned for a similar wrongdoing?

Yes I can, I know the regulations inside out tbh

Your clouding the issue by saying the details are unclear when the facts are there. Ten on the spot fines for a house party that was broken up. For there to be any doubt the ten would all need to come from the same two households which we both know didn’t happen.

Fk ping pong but there’s only two involved and that’s only 2 households regardless where she’s came from but I don’t know the exact details of this so can’t really answer but maybe there was no quarantine or lockdown in place at that time but i honestly don’t know 

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11 minutes ago, Valance1690 said:

I'm all for people getting a 2nd chance, the argument earlier was about Martindale and how he deserves a 2nd chance. Aye fair enough I see that point, he made mistakes a long long time ago, done his time & now wants to make a life for himself, that's fair enough.

This was 10 days ago, 5 players took it upon themselves to stick 2 fingers up to the club & do something the entire country is being told not to do. They knew exactly what they were doing & knew the ramifications if they got caught (and if they didn't). They knew them turning up at training on the Monday would've meant we lose probably the entire squad for 10 days & didn't give it a 2nd thought.

Not saying ban them from football, give them the jail and ruin their life's however the idea that they just saunter back into training/the squad after 10 days & a clearly rehearsed apology is bad news. Move them on and let them have a career elsewhere is punishment enough for me, you've fucked your chance here now good luck trying at another club.

The 5 players did something almost everyone in their age group and older is doing and met up in someone’s house. They had the Monday off so your wrong about training. Martindale deserves a 2nd chance cause his mistake was ages ago,this doesn’t make sense you either deserve a 2nd chance or not. They ain’t going to saunter back in as if nothing happened far from it. David goodwillie got done twice for assault and once for rape but still had a decent career in football,that’s the kind of cunt I’d chase,not our 5 players nor the sheep’s 6. If our 5 had fucked our season up then getting sacked would have been the least of their worries.

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8 minutes ago, stu43rigger said:

I wasn’t commending them and obviously if they hadn’t been caught they would never have owned up, however the point you made was “the fact it didn’t lead to anything wasn’t down to the players honesty of anything they done”, I don’t believe that’s true, just because they got caught by the police I don’t think they were under any obligation to tell the club and could have turned up as normal on Monday 

Of course there were obliged to tell there employer.  They’ve breached specifically created regulations to deal with a worldwide pandemic. The clubs and other elite sports employers have probably agreed to draw up specific HR policies in order for the govt to give them the go ahead 

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4 minutes ago, andyhrfc said:

Find it weird how people use young and stupid in the same breath.  I know people who are young and not stupid as well as people who are old and stupid.  

Most young people are not stupid.  What the players displayed was a sense of arrogance that they were somehow above Covid regulations, that they can do whatever they like whilst the vast majority of people their age stay at home, even though they would love to hit the town on a night out.  And they knew that the risk of being caught would far outweigh the loss faced by an average young person who chose to breach the rules. 

Young people  are the only group left in society that its still acceptable to talk shite about without it being an ism

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3 minutes ago, Dickie said:

The 5 players did something almost everyone in their age group and older is doing and met up in someone’s house. They had the Monday off so your wrong about training. Martindale deserves a 2nd chance cause his mistake was ages ago,this doesn’t make sense you either deserve a 2nd chance or not. They ain’t going to saunter back in as if nothing happened far from it. David goodwillie got done twice for assault and once for rape but still had a decent career in football,that’s the kind of cunt I’d chase,not our 5 players nor the sheep’s 6. If our 5 had fucked our season up then getting sacked would have been the least of their worries.

That's the risk they took, and thank fuck they got found out before it could've.

 

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2 minutes ago, Bad Robot said:

Yes I can, I know the regulations inside out tbh

Your clouding the issue by saying the details are unclear when the facts are there. Ten on the spot fines for a house party that was broken up. For there to be any doubt the ten would all need to come from the same two households which we both know didn’t happen.

Fk ping pong but there’s only two involved and that’s only 2 households regardless where she’s came from but I don’t know the exact details of this so can’t really answer but maybe there was no quarantine or lockdown in place at that time but i honestly don’t know 

She came from a different country and should have been in quarantine. He then went to training every day. That case was far worse. At least our players never made it to the training ground thankfully.

We will probably never know who the other five were in the flat.

I really don't know the answer mate, but I do know it is time to move on. It is my opinion that they should not be fired. I know many disagree.

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4 minutes ago, andyhrfc said:

Find it weird how people use young and stupid in the same breath.  I know people who are young and not stupid as well as people who are old and stupid.  

Most young people are not stupid.  What the players displayed was a sense of arrogance that they were somehow above Covid regulations, that they can do whatever they like whilst the vast majority of people their age stay at home, even though they would love to hit the town on a night out.  And they knew that the risk of being caught would far outweigh the loss faced by an average young person who chose to breach the rules. 

The vast majority of young people stay at home,what planet are you on,just walk about especially in any park and see what’s going on. In my local park there is organised 5/6 a sides with dozens taking part,most young folk I know don’t give COVID a second thought apart from the inconvenience of it.

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I repeat I never once called them kids or a child. The bit I referenced a child was in reply to you saying your child is 9 and knows not to go behind your back I said bullshit every child makes mistakes. I wasn't meaning the players!! However they(players) are young men and can still make immature decisions. If you want to look for stupid opinions read through your own since you've made such a dramatic u turn! 

1 hour ago, Malkytfp1 said:

You are mistaking forgiveness for pointing out stupid opinions saying "they are just young kids" and "they are too young to make mature decisions". 

 

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7 minutes ago, bluenoz said:

She came from a different country and should have been in quarantine. He then went to training every day. That case was far worse. At least our players never made it to the training ground thankfully.

We will probably never know who the other five were in the flat.

I really don't know the answer mate, but I do know it is time to move on. It is my opinion that they should not be fired. I know many disagree.

I’ll get behind whatever SG does with them but he’s set a precedence and I think they’ll be shipped out at the earliest convenience but that’s not to say they’ll never play for us again. The squad tomorrow will give us an idea on what road SG is going down as who knows CB and NP might be at Ibrox.

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3 hours ago, SeparateEntityMyArse said:

They retain their services ya daftie. You're the only one talking about abusive and illegal conduct towards them 😂

So that's precedents (not just covid related) and legislation I've asked for and you can't/ won't provide either. Really, it's not a valid or compelling  argument AT ALL 😂

Employees have a right to be treated equally. This is set out in the ACAS Code of practice.

If two employees were found to have both committed the same offence, but one was treated differently than the other, then the one who was treated harshly would be able to raise a grievance and would probably win.

This would likely result in an employee who was on a fixed term contract being paid at least in part for the duration left on their contract.

Westlake v ZSL London Zoo ET/2201118/2015 is an interesting case that shows two employees who got into a fight, the company sacked one whilst keeping the other. The court found that this was wrong from the company. 

For them to be treated differently, the club would need to have documented notes detailing why they were treated differently based on the employees conduct prior to the action. This would include things such as verbal and written warnings on the employee record prior to the incident that took place.

Alternatively if the incidents in question were more or less serious would come into it, but it would not be to the clubs opinion but they would have to convince a judge that they incidents were significantly different.

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Just now, stevemac said:

As a side note, If they got a ban from the league, can they still compete in European competition? Genuinely don't know how that ban would work tbh

There is absolutely no way the club would do that just for PR reasons alone.

I think they could probably play, but i might be wrong. They wont though.

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3 minutes ago, mitre_mouldmaster said:

There is absolutely no way the club would do that just for PR reasons alone.

I think they could probably play, but i might be wrong. They wont though.

Oh I don't think either would feature anyway (unsure on tav injury and when he's expected back) but whether or not Patterson would be eligible to play if required

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19 minutes ago, Ross-Gazza genius said:

I repeat I never once called them kids or a child. The bit I referenced a child was in reply to you saying your child is 9 and knows not to go behind your back I said bullshit every child makes mistakes. I wasn't meaning the players!! However they(players) are young men and can still make immature decisions. If you want to look for stupid opinions read through your own since you've made such a dramatic u turn! 

 

Youre acting fucking mental.

I've not u-turned ya madman. My original qualms were with people like you saying they are too immature to make decisions. Saying it was just a wee error, let's forget about it. Would you be sitting here all high and mighty if they went to training and potentially lost us points in the league or got us fucked out of Europe?

And yes every child makes mistakes. But if my 9 year old boy is told no to go to his pals house during Covid, he fucking wouldn't. Especially (in the Rangers analogy) if he seen his brother get a boot up the arse for doing the same thing earlier.

To be clear as you are struggling to understand, I am happy with whatever management decide and will back them. I still think the lads who knew what the fuck the deal was were idiots and deserve whatever they get, be that told to train with the youths for the rest of the season or whatever.

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51 minutes ago, bluenoz said:

Can you honestly say you know all the covid rules mate? Cos they seem to change a lot. At least I get mixed up sometimes.

Let's just say the other five were their girlfriends for a moment. It wouldn't be outrageous for them to think they were still in a bubble even though we all know they weren't.

The details remain somewhat unclear.

Now if the other five were not their girlfriends then the guilt is unquestionable and if so, why was fringpong never questioned for a similar wrongdoing?

I agree with most of your posts on a lot of topics. But I find this one baffling and reeking of excuses and whataboutery.

Bottom line is, they knew what they were doing was wrong and against what the club told them. They knew the consequences. 

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To be honest, the correct action is to give them all written warnings and fines (should this be in the contract), and then freeze out and sell the shite ones and give the talented ones a second chance as long as they show remorse.

If the shite ones also show remorse, then they are still shite and should be sold or released.

This is treating them equally and within the rules.

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Our Gaffer gets us.

He holds dear to his heart a set of standards, some of which will be non negotiables.

These standards epitomise what the Gaffer will insist upon in order to be a Ranger.

Non compliance to the required standard particularly the non negotiables set by the Gaffer will not be acceptable.

The Gaffer will have the morale courage, integrity and professionalism  to deal with the situation accordingly.

Regardless of watch the SFA deem to be a punishment.

I would not want to be one of the 5.

 

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, Bad Robot said:

not defending the sfa but again it’s an individual who has fkd up and it’s him who needs the penalty albeit the sfa should have refused uefa as it was a local Greek match and not a uefa tie. 
The fact that Roome was positive and he never informed madden or Stewart or the sfa he was positive tells me he’s a fkn idiot. I also ask did he not get the phone call from the track and trace and did any of them actually have the track and trace app which should have been pinging for madden and stewart 

You better not defend the sfa for a start mate. They cunts helped put us in a fucking position that fucked us and Scottish football along with their tagalongs.

Don’t misconstrue the damage. They are cunts! Make no mistake!  

 

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1 hour ago, Malkytfp1 said:

Youre acting fucking mental.

I've not u-turned ya madman. My original qualms were with people like you saying they are too immature to make decisions. Saying it was just a wee error, let's forget about it. Would you be sitting here all high and mighty if they went to training and potentially lost us points in the league or got us fucked out of Europe?

And yes every child makes mistakes. But if my 9 year old boy is told no to go to his pals house during Covid, he fucking wouldn't. Especially (in the Rangers analogy) if he seen his brother get a boot up the arse for doing the same thing earlier.

To be clear as you are struggling to understand, I am happy with whatever management decide and will back them. I still think the lads who knew what the fuck the deal was were idiots and deserve whatever they get, be that told to train with the youths for the rest of the season or whatever.

Everyone matures differently, because they are 19,20 or 21 doesn't mean they can't act in a immature way. They didn't go to training, they didn't get us points deducted and they didn't get us fucked out of Europe so if buts and maybe are pointless. Yes I felt sorry for Patterson as he's a young adult starting to grow up learning that every decision he makes is now on him, the 1 that should be ashamed is a 28 Yr old zungu who is old enough to know better but again it doesn't mean he isn't immature either. 

I'm glad we both agree they are idiots and happy for the manager to decide their future. 

It's because of the love of the club we are all passionate about what happens and if someone let's the club down, folk have a tendency to knee jerk and say "fuck them out the door" when in reality it's not as straightforward as that. Patterson has a bright future and since he's been with us this is the 1st time he's let the club down. If anyone listens to Andy halliday on open goal he spoke highly of him and his attitude.

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I personally think the younger ones deserve some slack. Especially if it wasn't a party and just them and the other half's having a pizza, and not the wild party it's made out to be. I've broken lockdown rules. I had a little girl in Feb last year and there was no chance the old dear wasn't going to get to meet her granddaughter. If they weren't footballers no one would give anywhere near as big a shit. And everyone going ott ie. Get them the sack. Please tell me you haven't done anything you shouldn't have in the last 12 months. Because if you have maybe your employer should consider your position too 

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7 minutes ago, bluebear24 said:

I personally think the younger ones deserve some slack. Especially if it wasn't a party and just them and the other half's having a pizza, and not the wild party it's made out to be. I've broken lockdown rules. I had a little girl in Feb last year and there was no chance the old dear wasn't going to get to meet her granddaughter. If they weren't footballers no one would give anywhere near as big a shit. And everyone going ott ie. Get them the sack. Please tell me you haven't done anything you shouldn't have in the last 12 months. Because if you have maybe your employer should consider your position too 

Unreal 

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