GeneralCartmanLee 313 Posted January 23, 2009 Share Posted January 23, 2009 UEFA in talks to limit transfers and wages Reuters - Yesterday, 12:50 BRUSSELS - Europe's top football clubs and the game's European governing body UEFA have started preliminary discussions on curbing the amount of money that can be spent on player transfers or wages, sources familiar with the talks said. The European Club Association (ECA), which represents the continent's leading clubs such as Manchester United, Real Madrid and AC Milan, has proposed clubs should only be allowed to spend around 51 percent of their revenue on transfers or salaries. An upsurge in the cost of buying players -- highlighted by Manchester City's reported 110 million euros ($145 million) failed bid for AC Milan's Kaka -- combined with huge salaries prompted the move as the global financial crisis bites. "Talks are at a preliminary stage, but there is a view that clubs can not sustain this situation in the long term," one ECA source told Reuters on Thursday. "The issue is due to be discussed at a meeting of the ECA's general assembly next month." A senior UEFA official confirmed the governing body "was looking seriously at the proposal". World soccer body FIFA, UEFA and the European Union have also expressed concern over the influx of money from billionaire owners from outside Europe who have recently taken large stakes in clubs, particularly in England. In November, EU sports ministers mulled the possibility of a pan-European financial regulator for sport but decided instead to press FIFA and UEFA to introduce stricter financial rules for clubs and leagues. "If we fail to act, then the EU will," the UEFA official said. Under the ECA proposal, revenue would be determined as money received only from ticket sales, sponsorship, merchandise and television income. It would not include any financial investment by owners or major shareholders. "Any money from shareholders, or billionaire owners would be invested into the infrastructure of the club, such as building or renovating the stadium or investing in youth development such as an academy," the UEFA official said. However, there are concerns that smaller clubs who cannot accumulate large revenues from ticket and television sales may suffer from the ECA proposal. "One option would be to give such clubs a derogation for a couple of years to give them the chance to attract investors and sponsors," another ECA source said. "This is all part and parcel of the negotiations." Any deal with UEFA would only affect clubs involved in European competitions, such as the Champions League and UEFA Cup, and further discussions would also be needed to have any agreement enforced on a domestic level. How would this affect us ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ibroxblue 122 Posted January 23, 2009 Share Posted January 23, 2009 Would such things be legal? Or restraints of trade/infringements of employment rights? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frankie 505 Posted January 23, 2009 Share Posted January 23, 2009 Depends on how they come to their revenue figure? Is it based on turnover? Profit? And if so, is it based on the previous year's figures or an average of 5 years? Too many questions right now... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralCartmanLee 313 Posted January 23, 2009 Author Share Posted January 23, 2009 Would such things be legal? Or restraints of trade/infringements of employment rights? Yes it would be totally legal, there is no EU law to stop this...... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tontospal 1,116 Posted January 23, 2009 Share Posted January 23, 2009 Would such things be legal? Or restraints of trade/infringements of employment rights? Yes it would be totally legal, there is no EU law to stop this...... Under capitalism and the laws of supply and demand this will never happen, or at the very least be enforceable. If an Arab with too much money wants to spend it on football clubs or players how can anyone stop it? Every club/player has their price as was evident with Kaka. Kaka is happy at AC MILan. AC Milan are happy with Kaka. mAN cITY want Kaka. mAN cITY enquire about Kaka and are quoted a fee of over 100 million. Man City deem this as an acceptable price and enter in to negotiations. How can this be stopped? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralCartmanLee 313 Posted January 23, 2009 Author Share Posted January 23, 2009 Would such things be legal? Or restraints of trade/infringements of employment rights? Yes it would be totally legal, there is no EU law to stop this...... Under capitalism and the laws of supply and demand this will never happen, or at the very least be enforceable. If an Arab with too much money wants to spend it on football clubs or players how can anyone stop it? Every club/player has their price as was evident with Kaka. Kaka is happy at AC MILan. AC Milan are happy with Kaka. mAN cITY want Kaka. mAN cITY enquire about Kaka and are quoted a fee of over 100 million. Man City deem this as an acceptable price and enter in to negotiations. How can this be stopped? Ask the NFL as i'm pretty sure capitalisim exists in the USA and they have had a wage/transfer cap for many years. From everything i have read on this before announcing they have been in talks with the EU concerning this and they can apply it without breaking any EU regulations. UEFA goven the sport and if you want to be part of there originisation you play by there rules. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Briton 394 Posted January 23, 2009 Share Posted January 23, 2009 Would such things be legal? Or restraints of trade/infringements of employment rights? Yes it would be totally legal, there is no EU law to stop this...... Under capitalism and the laws of supply and demand this will never happen, or at the very least be enforceable. If an Arab with too much money wants to spend it on football clubs or players how can anyone stop it? Every club/player has their price as was evident with Kaka. Kaka is happy at AC MILan. AC Milan are happy with Kaka. mAN cITY want Kaka. mAN cITY enquire about Kaka and are quoted a fee of over 100 million. Man City deem this as an acceptable price and enter in to negotiations. How can this be stopped? Football is a sport and sporting bodies can introduce rules. I like this idea in principle. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frankie 505 Posted January 23, 2009 Share Posted January 23, 2009 Brown paper bag suppliers and motorway service stations will be welcoming this... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralCartmanLee 313 Posted January 23, 2009 Author Share Posted January 23, 2009 If the premiership couldn’t outbid everyone and offer the ridiculous wages it does now it would be interesting to see what happens to the English game. I would imagine Mr Murdoch will be fighting this, expect headlines in the sun about “barmy uefa bureaucrats” ruining our game anytime soon……. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
flov1 0 Posted January 23, 2009 Share Posted January 23, 2009 Great idea. Should have brought something like this in long ago. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
OzGers 425 Posted January 23, 2009 Share Posted January 23, 2009 alot of countries already abide by this system- you only have to look at australian football and rugby league who both operate a salary hap to good effect Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
J_RFC87 761 Posted January 23, 2009 Share Posted January 23, 2009 Would such things be legal? Or restraints of trade/infringements of employment rights? Yes it would be totally legal, there is no EU law to stop this...... No, salary caps distort competition. " All agreements between undertakings, decisions by associations of undertakings and concerted practices which may affect trade between member states and which have as their object or effect the prevention, restriction or distortion of competition within the common market…" As an effective horizontal agreement between competitors as to how much they will spend on a key service, salary caps are prima-facie in breach of this rule and will therefore be void and un-enforceable as between parties, unless it can be justified under the conditions set out in Article 81 (3). http://www.eionet.europa.eu/gemet/concept?...en&cp=13263 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ibroxblue 122 Posted January 23, 2009 Share Posted January 23, 2009 Would such things be legal? Or restraints of trade/infringements of employment rights? Yes it would be totally legal, there is no EU law to stop this...... Under capitalism and the laws of supply and demand this will never happen, or at the very least be enforceable. If an Arab with too much money wants to spend it on football clubs or players how can anyone stop it? Every club/player has their price as was evident with Kaka. Kaka is happy at AC MILan. AC Milan are happy with Kaka. mAN cITY want Kaka. mAN cITY enquire about Kaka and are quoted a fee of over 100 million. Man City deem this as an acceptable price and enter in to negotiations. How can this be stopped? Football is a sport and sporting bodies can introduce rules. I like this idea in principle. And sporting rules can be overturned in the courts e.g. Bosman. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saudibear 0 Posted January 23, 2009 Share Posted January 23, 2009 As someone else said in the USA, NFL and NBA have caps. The way it works in Basketball is that the team can only pay out so much in salary. i.e. lets say the salary cap is $10,000,000 for the season, if 1 player gets 8,000,000 then there is only 2,000,000 for the rest of the team. Only exceptions are home grown players or players who come from the draft, they are not effected by the salary cap. This means no team can buy all the superstars. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
J-Maestro 11,078 Posted January 23, 2009 Share Posted January 23, 2009 A salary cap only works if everyone has one solid cap they must keep to for the whole squad. By making a cap for just players you make sure that no team can break in to the top echelon of teams. As why play for a smaller club for the same money as the big one. Pointless idea, makes the rich richer and makes an even bigger gap between teams. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralCartmanLee 313 Posted January 23, 2009 Author Share Posted January 23, 2009 Would such things be legal? Or restraints of trade/infringements of employment rights? Yes it would be totally legal, there is no EU law to stop this...... No, salary caps distort competition. " All agreements between undertakings, decisions by associations of undertakings and concerted practices which may affect trade between member states and which have as their object or effect the prevention, restriction or distortion of competition within the common market…" As an effective horizontal agreement between competitors as to how much they will spend on a key service, salary caps are prima-facie in breach of this rule and will therefore be void and un-enforceable as between parties, unless it can be justified under the conditions set out in Article 81 (3). http://www.eionet.europa.eu/gemet/concept?...en&cp=13263 What is article 81.3.... All I can say is UEFA are actually being encouraged by the EU to do this. I won’t pretend to understand the EU law concerning this, none of us really do, but I doubt they would be announcing this after speaking to the EU if it broke there laws….. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
*Manticore* 1,893 Posted January 23, 2009 Share Posted January 23, 2009 What is article 81.3.... All I can say is UEFA are actually being encouraged by the EU to do this. I won’t pretend to understand the EU law concerning this, none of us really do, but I doubt they would be announcing this after speaking to the EU if it broke there laws….. Like Bosman I think. We'll only really know if they do it and it's then challenged in Court. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dezrfc1 26 Posted January 23, 2009 Share Posted January 23, 2009 this could do us a good favour or scottish football in genenral Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Briton 394 Posted January 23, 2009 Share Posted January 23, 2009 Football is a sport and sporting bodies can introduce rules. I like this idea in principle. And sporting rules can be overturned in the courts e.g. Bosman. That is true. If a rule can be shown to contradict an EC or national law the latter will certainly take precedence. I've argued that when people have suggested limiting foreigners. Tontospal talks of the laws of supply and demand though. Not the same thing at all. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
outlaw69uk 123 Posted January 23, 2009 Share Posted January 23, 2009 I think, for us, this would be a good thing, perhaps a very good thing. There are countless very good players, going to mid table/low end EPL clubs, purely for the money, and, only these clubs can afford to buy these players. This happens, and, it becomes a more even playing field, therefore, we SHOULD be able to attrct better players again, because things such as Euro football, and, success, along with presitge of who you play for, will (I would hope) become more important. As it says as well, we could get a new billionaire owner, but, they would only be allowed to invest in the youth structure (fantastic!) and things like the stadium, so, the obvious answer then is, dont spend stupid amounts on players, just double the size of a stadium and theres your extra revenue. Plus, the debt issue would be less, as, player costs would be lower Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
outlaw69uk 123 Posted January 23, 2009 Share Posted January 23, 2009 Would such things be legal? Or restraints of trade/infringements of employment rights? Yes it would be totally legal, there is no EU law to stop this...... No, salary caps distort competition. " All agreements between undertakings, decisions by associations of undertakings and concerted practices which may affect trade between member states and which have as their object or effect the prevention, restriction or distortion of competition within the common market…" As an effective horizontal agreement between competitors as to how much they will spend on a key service, salary caps are prima-facie in breach of this rule and will therefore be void and un-enforceable as between parties, unless it can be justified under the conditions set out in Article 81 (3). http://www.eionet.europa.eu/gemet/concept?...en&cp=13263 True, however, in the UK alone, it would be easy to argue that with the "monopoly" idea, and, also anti-competitive. The SPL cannot compete with the EPL Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
damien1 29 Posted January 23, 2009 Share Posted January 23, 2009 A salary cap only works if everyone has one solid cap they must keep to for the whole squad. By making a cap for just players you make sure that no team can break in to the top echelon of teams. As why play for a smaller club for the same money as the big one. Pointless idea, makes the rich richer and makes an even bigger gap between teams. This is exactly what would happen. And in the current climate where Celtic's turnover is greater than ours they would be able to buy and pay the wages of better players than Rangers. Teams like Hearts, Aberdeen and Dundee Utd would be in perpetual decline as they would never attract footballers from down south. Teams like St.Mirren, ICT, etc would die. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMMS 27 Posted January 23, 2009 Share Posted January 23, 2009 Oh the irony of Man U, AC Milan and Real Madrid being behind this. Suddenly because a non-G14 team (I know it doesn't exist anymore, ahem) has more money than any of them they resort to law to stop them, what a bunch of hypocrites. A salary cap exists in Rugby League in England and several clubs have been fined and docked points for breaching it. I feel a salary cap would be easily circumnavigated (and who would trust Juve or AC Milan to uphold anything fair?) just like the old minimum wage was. What works in American sport rarely works in Europe. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigSpliff 0 Posted January 23, 2009 Share Posted January 23, 2009 How would this affect us ? It would affect us, as it would affect everyone. If caps genuinely meant reductions then the trickle-down effect might be significant. In terms of ratios of salaries to revenue, we'd be a club who'd need to look hard at how close we are to the cut-off point. Complicated subject. Bound to be unintended consequences. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
*Manticore* 1,893 Posted January 23, 2009 Share Posted January 23, 2009 The SPL cannot compete with the EPL They aren't in competition with each other...... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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