now then forever
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Posts posted by now then forever
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Foderingham
Tavernier
Kiernan
Ball
Wallace
Holt
Halliday
Law
Waghorn
Miller
McKay
Tempted to start Thompson but might be slightly too much too soon.
That would be my starting 11 too. Would be tempted to start Miller on the left where he was pretty effective at the start of the season.
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Hibs Ins and Outs (25)
Carmichael, Oxley, Keatings, Boyle, Reguero, Bartley, McGinn, McGeough, McGregor, Eckersley, Henderson, Anier, Feruz. 13 In.
Booth, Cerny, Gardiner, Craig, S Allan, Robertson, Crane, Martin, Harris, L Allan, Insall, Dja Djedia. 12 Out.
Rangers Ins and Outs (25)
Foderingham, Tavernier, Holt, Kiernan, Wilson, Zelalem, Oduwa, Ball, Halliday, Waghorn, Thompson. 11 In
Boyd, Zaliukas, Foster, McGregor, Smith, Mohsni, Gallagher, McCulloch, Black, Daly, Faure, Hutton, Simonsen, Robinson. 14 Out.
25 each. No idea who the 3 were i missed out for Rangers, not that it matters, it actually does your side of the argument a favour. Maybe i have missed 1 or 2 out on either side, again, it doesn't matter. The only relevant fact is both managers have had very similar rebuild jobs to do.
Where do I start.....
Firstly, to start with you said 'We had a 22 player turn around, they had a 25 player turnaround. They had the bigger upheavel'. Now you are saying it was the same, both 25. However, again your list is wrong.
Crane, L Allan, Martin, and Insall are all still with Hibs. They've been loaned out to lower league teams. Which would bring your figure down to 8 out and 21 turnaround for them, compared to 25 with us.
However, if you were wanting to include loans out like them you would need to include the likes of Crawford and Murdoch that we have loaned out by us, so either way 'a bigger upheaval' for Rangers, not Hibs.
And as has been pointed out by another poster 10 of the players that left us in the summer were regular first team players, only a few of hibs could have considered to be. So quite clearly it was a much bigger upheaval for MW and Rangers having to bring in almost a whole new first team. Also Hibs already had some of the players in on loan the previous season, so not too much upheaval when they had already been playing their with the squad.
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Both managers did have similar rebuilds. They had a 25 player turnaround to our 22. Give or take 1 or 2 players. That is it.
Warburton keeps going about it being a squad game, it's all about the squad. The blind faith loyal can't have it both ways.
Why don't you list the Hibs turnaround of 25 players and Rangers turnaround of 22? If it's because you've basically just made them up and can't back them up with facts that's cool.
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The debate wasn't first team players, it was player turnaround. First team players was brought into it because the initial poster had made an arse of himself.
The only fact that matters is, Hibs had a more turbulent summer and transfer window, they spent less, still spend less and yet find themselves going toe to toe with us. I was only asking which manager had done the better job so far and the place has went into meltdown. It's fucking obvious but too many have their heads in the sand and are shit scared of the truth.
But they didn't. Are you going to post the list of players on both sides to back up your figures? There was only about 8 or 9 players left Hibs this season, and only a few of them were regular first team players. Rangers lost 10 first team regulars for this season, plus several other fringe players.
Also losing 10 first team players and various fringe/younger players, compared to losing 3 first team players and various fringe/younger players is far more upheaval in any reasonable persons mind. Stubbs already had a core team of first team players that he had built from the previous season on which to add. And I would say MW has done the better job so far, which is why we are currently top.
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Here's a clip from sky sports here, have a look at the drop ball and Stubb's comments. It really should have went back to qots anyway. Even more of an incentive for next week if we needed it. Imagine if we had done that against Hibs, there would have been an uproar and all sorts of conspiracy theories. Stubbs would have been raging. But because it went for him Stubbs viewed it as fair with the ref dropping it between the two players....
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if you look at hibs last 2 games last week they got a draw with a 92nd min goal which was offside
yesterday they won the game in the 94th min and i believe qos were raging as they got a man hurt and hibs did not return the ball to them which led to the goal
dont want to tempt fate but cummings has been off the boil he was taken off y/day 20 mins from the end
so they are not playing well either but have been getting the breaks
It was supposed to be a drop ball to restart the game, but the referee just dropped it at the feet of the hibs player who just ran off with the ball. You need to watch a clip of it and Stubbs had the cheek to say his view of it was the referee dropped it between the two players and the qots player never went for it, it couldn't have been further away than between them. Stubbs is totally deluded when it suits, typical one of them.
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I'd go..
Foderingham
Tav
Ball
Kiernan
Wallace
Law
Halliday
Holt
McKay
Waghorn
Miller
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His corners are terrible. Surely it isn't that hard for a professional footballer to whip a corner in to the middle of the box with a bit of pace on it.
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Nowhere near good enough. Would rather hardie got some opportunities before clark. Think we also need a left sided centre back to replace Wilson.
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Looks like the type of player MW would like. Loads of potential to add value, flexible, and has the physical presence that he's after. Doing well just now in the defensive midfield role.
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I'd be very surprised if they sold him for £1million. They sold Jamie Paterson for £2million a few years ago and he's nowhere near the player Bradshaw is, and Bradshaw is under contract for another few years as well. I reckon it would be upwards of £3.5 million for Bradshaw.
Bradshaw only has 18 months left on his contract. Swindon had a £500k bid for him rejected in the summer. Jamie Paterson went for an undisclosed fee and from the sources I can see they reckon the fee was only six figures, rising to around the million pound mark with add ons.
Defensive midfielder with a physical presence and enough pace/movement to act as cover is the priority though. I like the look of Matt Crooks for that, or someone with similar attributes.
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I'd be surprised if we landed him.
Same, but if we're trying to build a team to win the spl next year and compete in Europe surely a player playing for Walsall in league 1 for around a million quid shouldn't be out of our reach.
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I'd take Matt crooks from Accrington as defensive midfield. Only 21 so loads of scope to improve and add value. He's been getting rave reviews from Accrington this year, which is probably as good if not better level than we're playing at just now. He's also 6'3 so would add much needed physical presence and he's reasonably quick too.
Someone like Tom Bradshaw would be great up front. Reasonably tall and quick and can finish. Although I'd imagine he would cost around the million mark.
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Pick this team
Wes
Tav Kiernan Ball Wallace
Halliday
Law Holt
McKay Wags Miller
Halliday, and the two thee CMs need to drop short more often at stop putting the onus on Kiernan to hit a 40 yard pass as we kept putting ourselves under pressure today.
We need to hit some of our crosses first time as Hibs will reckon they gave us Sussed, with no crossing just looking for cut backs.
We need to play Miller on the left not right or central. We played him there at the start of the season and he scored a few getting on the end of balls at the back post. He's got the best movement in the team.
Finally we need to give away more professional fouls when they are on the counter. We are too nice, don't think I saw one today.
That would be my team too. And decent point about Miller on the left. Hopefully, we get the lad in from Accrington in January to play defensive midfield, another striker (Clark isn't good enough) and possibly another centre half (Wilson isn't good enough).
Tav needs to control his runs more too so we don't get so exposed defensively.
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If you reduce your valuation of Dean Shiels by about 1 million I think that's a more realistic valuation of what we could/will get for him.
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I believe azure were doing hibs too but hibs have just binned them.
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Who does the catering, is it done in house or by a company? Who does the hospitality catering?
Edit: just seen someone say azure do it. Anyone know when the contract is up?
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I agree we could do with strengthening in these areas, particularly if Ball goes back to Tottenham. Although we have a decent spine already in Foderingham, Kiernan, Halliday/Holt and Waghorn to build on.
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Zelalem or shiels for Wilson. Oduwa for clark
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Would be good to see maybe a formation change maybe to 4-4-2 and have mackay and halliday on the wings.
Wes
Tav ball wilson wallace
Halliday holt law mackay
Waghorn oduwa
This is based on if the players are fit to return
Aye ok Ally
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I think Ball is a good player and while he played ok last night I could not recall him winning a ball in the air all night mind the Livinstone striker was a big lad .
I'd agree with this. Still think he's a good player tho. On the other hand Kiernan hardly ever loses a header, he's s tank.
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Brilliant as usual from mw. Not only did the journos have their arses handed to them with their embarrassing questions and comments, so did a good few on here who were coming out with similar comments. Answered every one superbly.
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It's not,, you could Join my "PM Club" and enjoy the whole game on an HD channel with no adverts or buffering..
I'd like in on this too please?
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Dave Smith's commentary is absolutely brutal
Derek Lyle
in Jimmy Bell's Kitroom
Posted
Just out of interest does anybody know if he's a Rangers fan?
He was involved in a bit of confrontation with the Hib's crowd after the game on Saturday, and then one or two players in the tunnel. After the ref dropping the ball at the Hib's player's feet rather than doing a proper drop ball and not letting Hutton back on the pitch. One of my mates was at the game and he apparently done a 'flute' sign to the crowd...