SteveJ
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Posts posted by SteveJ
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Invite applications and then go through the usual recruitment process, make sure every candidate has the correct qualifications and experience and see what they produce by way of a plan to improve our situation within our resources. It isn't rocket science.
To do it properly, we don't have enough time. We need to do this for next season, but we need someone in now to steady the ship and give us a chance of promotion.
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I was referring to the Kit Manager position it would be no problem to lose the other, unspecified post, by merging these duties into current posts and the two Kit Manager roles. I never once mentioned the second post but you carry on thinking I had. You know the thread title is singular?
Where have I said you mentioned two jobs? We (the thread posters) were discussing the two roles and you joined in - I 'wrongly' assumed you wanted to discuss the options available and not just one.
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What? My premise was always taking one job and splitting it into 2 (possibly more). Try going back through the thread and you will see the post where I make the suggestion.
I've been on the Union side of negotiations and know that an employment tribunal operates in a much different way from a court.
There are currently two jobs, so the one job into two does not fit.
The tribunal system is administered by the same department as the courts. The court makes a decision based on a dispute, as does the tribunal. The difference being, the tribunal is headed by a respected member who understands the industry in question, where as the court is headed by a judge.
We are going around in circles, and debating on whether a tribunal is like a court is getting us nowhere. If you have been a union rep, then great, but get the basics right - two jobs currently.
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You mean the tribunal, why do you keep going on about 'the courts'. This is for an employment tribunal and not a court. You are aware that splitting responsibilities into 2 will create a job. The worth of those jobs would be entirely separate from what the incumbent of the redundant role was earning.
The downgrading of jobs goes on quite regularly, do you have any experience, on either side, of this sort of process?
I use the term court because everyone knows what it is and therefore widespread understanding. The process is exactly the same, as I am sure you are aware.
So now you are talking about taking two jobs and splitting between more jobs? That is a complete tangent to the previous mentioned taking two jobs and merging in to one!
I have not managed these scenario's in the past but have been around it.
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A reorganisation is long overdue. I think your opinion is misguided, having been involved in restructuring as a union rep the tribunal is unlikely to be able to find an issue with reorganisation, especially if it is creating jobs and, with the necessity within the organisation to reduce costs.
So the reorganisation is to create jobs? You seriously think the courts would agree with that when the previous salary for two positions was £190k and now the club are offering £30k for one?
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Sounds like Jimmy is a pal. You have an opinion and I have mine. Mine is based on some facts of legally making people redundant after they were offered the choice of taking pay cuts to save their jobs.
Anyway it doesnt change the fact that the Rangers kitman is on a huge amount of money for doing not very much. I wont mention the fact that its a bit odd that his son is found to be the assistant and is on 60K. I wonder if he was the most qualified person interviewed for the position?
He ain't a pal of mine but he is certainly Ally's pal.
You CANNOT make someone redundant because they refuse a pay cut - you are not making sense. To reduce the wage, you offer the pay cut and if they refuse you would need to make the role redundant. Once that happens, you have to be very careful on how you bring someone else in to a similar role on the reduced salary.
The easiest way is to place both Jimmy and his son on notice of being at risk of redundancy. You then ask them both to apply for a merged position and one will be offered the position at the reduced salary - if they accept, they take the role, if they refuse, they walk.
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Companies do this sort of thing all the time and the employee has no recourse. I found this from 2008:
I spoke to my mate who is in pro football and he told me this.
The kit man at a club like norwich is responsible for all the kit of full time players and staff at the club (first, reserve, youth)
He has to get all the kit ready and to the venue
he looks after players personal kit if they so desire (boots, extra kit) boots are put in a skip by youth players to take to games, some players do it themselves.
I would imagine he has no assistant but maybe a laundry lady, this means if the first team are away tuesday night and the reserves are training or playing the next day the kitman has to be there regardless of what time he got in to bed the previous night.
By all accounts it is a very demanding job that needs experience and knowledge.
salary 25-30k
The obvious answer would be to detach the first team Kit Manager role from the rest. Have one with first team responsibility and, one and an assistant with the rest. As for salary, any tribunal would look at the going rates for the new roles and would make a decision on that basis.
I think the court would have looked at the going rate had Charles Green did this 6 months after the TUPE. However, the fact that these employers have been paying the current rate since TUPE, it would not go well in a tribunal, in my opinion.
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I would go with this on an 12 month contract.
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Mate I think you will find he doesnt actually do the laundry. He is responsible for the logistics of it all and making sure the players have what they require. Do we really need a kitman and an assistant?You could quite easily make one position/person whatever way you want to put it,redundant.
Do the club require someone to manage the kit? You will find the answer is YES and as such, you cannot just make a man redundant because he has a nice wee contract.
Now that you have changed your thought process and understand that you can merge two positions in to one and have two re-apply for the role, you are coming back on to the right track.
However, the flaw with the two positions in to one is that it would be difficult to make Jimmy redundant if you offered him the new role at a small fraction of his previous salary - again the courts would look at the previous combined salary of two positions, the added responsibility for one doing both and if they felt the salary cut was unjust, rule in Jimmy's favour - in my opinion.
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One thing to note from this, which I am unsure has been mentioned.
Ally has stated to his media 'friends' that he handed in his notice because the club were seeking to cut costs on his staff - again. He stated he found that unacceptable as he took hi pay cut previously to stop that very scenario.
If true, then it sounds like we are wasting our breath, as the board are currently looking to cut staff salaries and I would assume Jimmy will be high up on that list.
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I doubt he does any cleaning of the kit, I can't think of a kit man who does. The position can be split and new posts offered at lower wages, he can then re-apply for one of the new positions.
I agree there are ways around it but I was more pointing out that you cannot simply make someone redundant if they don't accept a pay cut. The courts would chew us up and spit us out.
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He also has a company car and an early finish everyday.
The problem here is that he is still on so much. Like all high earners he should have been asked to take a rather severe paycut.
If they cant accept that then you make them redundant and they have to go find a job paying as much as they were on at Rangers.
Easy when you think about it.
You cannot make the kitman redundant unless you plan on stopping cleaning the kit. It is the position that becomes redundant, not the employee
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is this the level we are stooping too.The guy is on too much money,but trying to shame and blacken the name of people who have been loyal to the club for years is utterly shameful,if we need to get these people off the wage bill,at least do it with a bit of class,leaking peoples wages to shame them to the support is shameful,not the Rangers way,but that's the problem ,none of these imposters running the club have a fuckin clue what the Rangers way is.
I am getting pig sick of hearing this pish! If I worked for a company who offered me inflated wages for a role and they went in to hard times but my contract was offered to be transferred under TUPE, I would be as loyal as the next man as I would know that I stood absolutely no chance of earning that inflated wage anywhere else.
He might be a good kit man, but he would struggle like the next man to get a job outside of Ibrox.
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This makes no sense whatsoever. The board have not told Ally he's not allowed to goto sporting events
And being at a Rugby match is not taking the piss out of Rangers fans
Employers can stipulate terms in these cases of gardening leave - to prevent competitors gaining inside information on the business. We do not know if this has happened but if it has, I would reckon sporting events would be high up on the list. What we do know is Ally is supposed to be a Rangers fan, yet he just happened to pose in front of a journo pals camera AFTER a heavy defeat to Hibs. The man should have been as embarrassed by that result as Kenny and the fans, and as such not getting a smile in the media.
Ally is milking us dry and laughing at us at the same time.
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And? This is a complete non-issue imo.
It's not a non-issue.
Ally has been placed on Garden leave, yet he is being photographed by a friend at a sporting event after Rangers were humped. In a legal battle, he would win, as he was not at a football match, but he IS taking the piss out of the board and in turn, the Rangers fans!
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Andy Nicol posted it on Twitter.
Ally's friend!
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I think many are missing the point here. The Rangers and Glasgow Warriors were in Edinburgh today - both being on Sky Sports, with the Rugby on after us.
I am guessing Ally was at both but it looks like he used a press friend to post a photo of him enjoying himself at the Rugby game.
Whether he wants to rip the piss out of the fans, club or board, he is not the legend that some of our fans still maintain he is. The quicker they realise this, the quicker we rid ourselves of his legacy as a manager.
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I wouldn't be at all surprised if we beat Septic but miss out on the play-off final.
Don't dream!
To beat Celtic, you need a team empowered by belief and desire - Rangers currently have neither.
A new management team is what is required and only then will Rangers find the balls to compete with them. The new management team may happen if the new share deal finds us with a 30% majority holding - let's hope that is sorted quickly!
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Sadly Boyd is wider and less maneuverable than the proverbial bus
What? Did you see him try and take a defender on the right wing today? He would have taken him, if not for the push, but he gained the free-kick nonetheless. Had he been on from the start, he might have helped or he may not have - difference is, he came on to save the game, not win it!
Fucking sick of fans aiming their pish at the individual player!
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I was born in 1963 and in the first 24 years of my life we won the league 4 times and one of those was before I was one.
It felt like Rangers never won it the league and apart from 3 out of 4 years in the mid to late 70s.that was true.
We often finished 3rd 4th or even 5th in the league but we came back.
We can come back again but my god its going to be a tough haul.
The day in Aberdeen in 87 when we won the league for the first time since 78 will stay with me forever and I will be there the next time we win the league and I will stay with Rangers till then and beyond.
During that time, did Rangers EVER have a 5 star stadium, 75% season ticket sales, £30m in shares issues and still blow £50m in two seasons?
I love the fact that some hold on to the bad times - we have seen them too - and the rise above them but this is not a lovers tiff followed by the shag of your life. This is fucking serious and could bury our club!
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He played Stevie Smith at left outside mid. That is reason enough to fire McDowall for stupidity.
When Stevie Smith plays well, he gets praise, but when he plays shit the manager gets it for playing him out of position. Make up yer mind ffs (I aim that at a majority and not just you).
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He tried to communicate with the team as well, which I would think is pretty important and a vast improvement on McCoist.
Yep, I mentioned that also, earlier.
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He wont take any shite and attitude from any of our imposters.
McDowell simply cant be allowed to stay on any longer. Cant wait until the summer to ship out this mob. I would only keep Lewis McGregor and Aird at a push.
This semi final I am dreading. We wont even score. Will be hiding at least 5 or 6.
Before today Hibs had only beaten the 3 bottom teams at home. Sums up where we are.
Davies is the man to steady the ship despite what others say. He will take the job and make a difference.
Says the man that - in the same week that many lost their life from a traffic accident - wished Ian Black to be run over by a bus?!
Away and take yer pish elsewhere son!
Warnock Sacked
in Jimmy Bell's Kitroom
Posted
I mentioned him last week but as assistant to Jim Jeffries - it did not go down well lol.