hanleysguru

Aye, they did make assumptions and without justification as far as I've read, but my point is that this was the basis of their decision. I'm not saying they were right.

Eh? I never said we'd been breaking the law - I said that the SFA had acted through concern at that. By the way, can I just say I f**king loathe Celtic and am seriously f*cked off at being branded one of them for having a point of view.

I didn't claim to know anything about finance. You can call me whatever you like, but it's hardly a coherent argument.

I agree that the sanction is a joke, and will hopefully prove unlawfulif tested. If the SFA panel had been able to show only Whyte had knowledge of what was going on they'd have had no grounds for anything like what was upheld last night, but the initial report found that several other directors had knowledge of what was going on and did nothing. The board being the company, the company gets punished.

But you're not applying logic. Motherwell's situation can't be compared with ours; they didn't trade for a year while knowingly not paying tax on salaries. Rangers owe (depending on who's figures you accept) £9 - £13m in tax, accumulated during a single year, knowing the company was basically insolvent. #If you can show me that Motherwell did the same I'll accept what you're saying.

Just got texted: Craig Whyte turns out to be two kids wearing a long coat

I'm sure loads of Celtic fans would love to see Rangers die, but the reverse is equally true. I also agree that plenty of Catholics who have had no experience of persecution like to revel in it. But going back to Rangers and the SFA - look at last night's decision, taken by independent appointees - are you honestly saying they are part of an anti-Rangers/protestant agenda and can you provide any evidence to support that? I see nothing other than an institution sh*ting itself that its biggest member has been breaking the law big time for a year, possibly longer, and has to be seen to be doing something about it. They gain nothing from the demise of Rangers - absolutely nothing, and I'm sure every member of the SFA wishes all of this would just go away. STewart Regan must go to bed greeting every night.

Was it even called the Roman Catholic church? I thought that namearrive post-reformation?

Ok, suppose you're right - why do you think they want to obliterate Rangers and who do you think "they" are?

Motherwell didn't play for a year while failing to pay tax/NI/VAT due on player's salaries as far as I know. At the point they couldn't trade they went into admin - we continued to trade.

I never expected that!

As I said, my mother was Catholic but I was never taken to church and have been a confirmed atheist since I was old enough to see that religion was just a means of control. Re the SFA/SPL - no club has deliberately avoided paying tax/NI/VAT while trading, so I don't think there's a comparison. But then, I've lived in Leeds for 10 years so I'm removed from the situation. I agree that the SFA have frequently bungled and handled it badly, but I don't see an agenda driven by Catholics.

Agreed - religion is becoming an irrelevance. John Lennon was right. Oh - and Winning's a tube.

The "true doctrines" of the Catholic church are well documented and available for anyone who has too much time on their hands to read. Oh oh - wait a minute - this isn't going down the David Icke route, is it? Agenda? I'd bet serious money that much of what's driving the likes of the SFA is concern that UEFA will sanction them if they're not seen to be taking action. I'd also bet that they wish the whole thing with Whyte had never happened. The SFA and indeed the SPL are in a lose/lose situation. If they aren't seen to be taking action they'll get hammered. If they do, they risk destroying the already p*ss poor product that is Scottish football. I am fairly certain that even the Celtic board would rather that Rangers hadn't got into this position.

Who's "them". Seriously, life's too short mate.

Sure, but so have many other institutions, religious and otherwise, and let's not pretend that antipathy towards Catholicism only began when evidence of abuse began to emerge. For many, the abuse issue is simply used as a reason to legitimise their dislike of Catholicism.

Me - I don't see Catholicism as any worse than any other religion. It's a belief system governed by an institution that has historically done a lot of good and bad. Protestantism has its own structures, but I see nothing that represents a substantial difference. The CoE, for example, is headed up by whoever happens to be the reigning monarch. Historically, British monarchs or their various apparatus have committed terrible attrocities in the name of God and country. Modern protestantism is dying, as is much structured religion as falling congregational figures testify. However, Christianity, the shared root of both sects, is simply an adaptation of various pagan beliefs. Manufacturing political differences based on a preferrence for one religious structure over another seems anachronistic. I support Rangers because me best pal's dad did when I was a kid and he occasionally took the two of us to games. My dad was a rugby fan and couldn't be bothered with football. My ma was a Catholic who was quite happy to get peace on a Saturday afternoon, and I ended up supporting Rangers with no grounding in its history. It became more difficult for me when I developed an awareness of the semi-political beliefs of many fellow supporters were, but at the end of the day I just loved a football club and it never left me. I'm 43 now and genuinely sad over what has happened. But while I feel a lot of dismay over the current circumstances I have no doubt that were it Celtic who were in our position, I'm sure I'd think that their actions deserved the response from the SFA and that's why I can't get angry.

I don't think we've seen the worst of this. I don't wholly share the view that the country is run by republicans and I don't necessarily see the new player ban as a political decision, but I am absolutely certain that if we were given a 12 month ban on registration of players over 18 predicated on the non-payment of tax/NI over a 12 month period, then what awaits over the next few weeks will be worse. If we lose the BTC appeal at the FTT, or are found to be at in a breach of SPL rules following the contract investigation (which is separate and not dependent on the outcome of the BTC) I think that we're probably looking at a far harsher punishment than a 12 month ban.

Has there been any further word on the "second contracts" said to have been held by some of the squad, or is that just more media bollocks?

Sorry - HMRC were determined to go for administration because of the new PAYE tax case - that's what forced the issue.

Seriously though, everyone needs to be there, inside/outside the stadium - whatever it takes.

Unless the match is cancelled...

Anyone who seriously believes Whyte is going to pump ill gotten gains back into the club is deluded. We are in administration because of the PAYE and NI non-payment - that's what forced the administration today. Even then, Whyte has gotten his own guys in. We are being ragdolled by this guy, and there are still people prepared to stand by him. We are utterly f*****d.

Without a doubt.

Can't help thinking that the naivete of Rangers fans has been part of the problem. Everything Whyte has touched has shut down and when this was reported on the BBC the reaction was to criticise the messenger. I'm no expert, but the evidence would seem to suggest that Whyte doesn't suffer when his companies go tits up. I think everything he's doing is based on a calculated gamble and I'd bet money that no matter the outcome for Rangers, Whyte won't lose money (or sleep.)