The RM Beale poll

[James T Kirk 38]

20 minutes ago, The Dude said:

Walter managed seven finals in seven years during his first reign.  Losing out to Hibs, Dundee Utd  x2, Falkirk, Hearts x2,  Aberdeen, celtic.

 

Against the backdrop of a more competitive domestic scene of course.  

There's no denying we've massively underperformed in the cups in the last decade.  20/21 in particular rankles.  55 should have been accompanied by a treble.

[The Dude 20,028]

1 minute ago, James T Kirk said:

Against the backdrop of a more competitive domestic scene of course.  

There's no denying we've massively underperformed in the cups in the last decade.  20/21 in particular rankles.  55 should have been accompanied by a treble.

When Celtic were finishing fourth and fifth in the league?

[James T Kirk 38]

1 minute ago, The Dude said:

When celtic were finishing fourth and fifth in the league?

celtic were shambolic for the first half of the 90s yes.  

I meant the overall standard of the league.  It was better.  A spread of trophies was more 'normal'. 

Of course we were much better resourced and certainly underperformed in the cups - thats absolutely true.  

But im not sure what the point in drawing parallels between the 90s and now is.  Some sort of justification for the poor performances in cups since the return to the top flight? It rings a little hollow with, unlike the 90s, a single league trophy to show for it.

[The Dude 20,028]

2 minutes ago, James T Kirk said:

celtic were shambolic for the first half of the 90s yes.  

I meant the overall standard of the league.  It was better.  A spread of trophies was more 'normal'. 

Of course we were much better resourced and certainly underperformed in the cups - thats absolutely true.  

But im not sure what the point in drawing parallels between the 90s and now is.  Some sort of justification for the poor performances in cups since the return to the top flight? It rings a little hollow with, unlike the 90s, a single league trophy to show for it.

Was it? Always feel this is a fair bit of nostalgia kicking in. Not sure there's anything that really suggests the league was a higher standard than it is now.

[Jimfanciesthedude 25,691]

46 minutes ago, The Dude said:

Walter managed seven finals in seven years during his first reign.  Losing out to Hibs, Dundee Utd  x2, Falkirk, Hearts x2,  Aberdeen, Celtic.

 

Could argue Walters two stints shows the league was more competitive back then than nowadays

If we hadnt shat the bed in 55 season, the OF would have won every single trophy since hibs beat us in the cup final under warburton, out of the last 18 trophies in scottish football the OF have won 16 of them and st johnstone have two (the two we shat the bed in) 

Back in walters first spell there wasn't a dominance of cups like that, in Walters second spell there was, 

[King Jela 21,811]

1 hour ago, The Dude said:

Walter managed seven finals in seven years during his first reign.  Losing out to Hibs, Dundee Utd  x2, Falkirk, Hearts x2,  Aberdeen, celtic.

 

And that makes absolutely no difference whatsoever to what we're talking about with the current squad. 

1 cup win in 5 years with the current squad isn't justified because of cup failures in the 90's. Makes 0 fucking sense. 

[King Jela 21,811]

1 hour ago, cr3_bear said:

Not to worry mate

we have a decent record at tynecastle since 2020

Love the yearly trips to Tynecastle for the Davie Weir final. 

[The Dude 20,028]

3 minutes ago, King Rager said:

And that makes absolutely no difference whatsoever to what we're talking about with the current squad. 

1 cup win in 5 years with the current squad isn't justified because of cup failures in the 90's. Makes 0 fucking sense. 

We didn't have the current squad five years ago. Nowhere close to it.

Tav, Goldson, Barisic, Kamara and Jack are the only players at the club from the end of Gerrard's first season.

These players have all left since then:

McGregor
Foderingham
Firth
Katic
Edmundson
Worrall
Wallace
Polster
McAuley
Flanagan
Dorrans
Kent
Windass
Ejaria
McCrorie
Halliday
Coulibaly
Grezda
Arfield
Middleton
Lafferty
Murphy
Morelos
Defoe
Sadiq
 

 

[esquire8 45,492]

33 minutes ago, The Dude said:

We didn't have the current squad five years ago. Nowhere close to it.

Tav, Goldson, Barisic, Kamara and Jack are the only players at the club from the end of Gerrard's first season.

These players have all left since then:

McGregor
Foderingham
Firth
Katic
Edmundson
Worrall
Wallace
Polster
McAuley
Flanagan
Dorrans
Kent
Windass
Ejaria
McCrorie
Halliday
Coulibaly
Grezda
Arfield
Middleton
Lafferty
Murphy
Morelos
Defoe
Sadiq
 

 

That list....

[The Dude 20,028]

6 minutes ago, esquire8 said:

That list....

Almost as if there are more obvious reasons we won fuck all...

[esquire8 45,492]

2 minutes ago, The Dude said:

Almost as if there are more obvious reasons we won fuck all...

God awful scouting and recruitment.

If only Tony Bloom bought us instead of Brighton 

[King Jela 21,811]

53 minutes ago, The Dude said:

We didn't have the current squad five years ago. Nowhere close to it.

Tav, Goldson, Barisic, Kamara and Jack are the only players at the club from the end of Gerrard's first season.

These players have all left since then:

McGregor
Foderingham
Firth
Katic
Edmundson
Worrall
Wallace
Polster
McAuley
Flanagan
Dorrans
Kent
Windass
Ejaria
McCrorie
Halliday
Coulibaly
Grezda
Arfield
Middleton
Lafferty
Murphy
Morelos
Defoe
Sadiq
 

 

So what is your point about the 90's then? The squad and mentality of the squad over the last 5 years have been the mentality/attitude of losers. 

Nothing to do with ability, like you suggested the problem was.

[esquire8 45,492]

1 minute ago, King Rager said:

So what is your point about the 90's then? The squad and mentality of the squad over the last 5 years have been the mentality/attitude of losers. 

Nothing to do with ability, like you suggested the problem was.

It's all 3.

[King Jela 21,811]

43 minutes ago, esquire8 said:

It's all 3.

All 3 what? The 90's, ability and mentality are the reason we have an awful cup record? 

[BridgeIsBlue 66,854]

Turned the key often enough in Europe because we were the underdogs, but when it comes down to the crunch and picking up trophies we shit the bed time and time again. 

Our own captain has admitted this

[Jimfanciesthedude 25,691]

9 hours ago, The Dude said:

Almost as if there are more obvious reasons we won fuck all...

That list is still good enough to beat the sheep etc, 

[The Dude 20,028]

Just now, Jimbeamjunior said:

That list is still good enough to beat the sheep etc, 

We did and that squad finished above them in the league.

[Jimfanciesthedude 25,691]

1 minute ago, The Dude said:

We did and that squad finished above them in the league.

They put us out of both cups gerrards first season, mccinnes had gerrards number quite often iirc

[The Dude 20,028]

11 minutes ago, Jimbeamjunior said:

They put us out of both cups gerrards first season, mccinnes had gerrards number quite often iirc

It happens. Far better Rangers teams have been papped out of cups by far worse sides. 

[beararse 6,942]

39 minutes ago, BridgeIsBlue said:

Turned the key often enough in Europe because we were the underdogs, but when it comes down to the crunch and picking up trophies we shit the bed time and time again. 

Our own captain has admitted this

This. 

It can’t be a coincidence we’ve had such a poor trophy return these past 5 years whilst the two mainstays of our team are Tav and Goldson: both of whom have publicly admitted we couldn’t handle the pressure/didn’t believe we could win.

Irrespective of their positive contributions, the constant over reliance on these two has ultimately been our downfall.

You can’t have a successful team if it’s led by senior players with a defeatist mindset.

 

[Jimfanciesthedude 25,691]

15 minutes ago, The Dude said:

It happens. Far better Rangers teams have been papped out of cups by far worse sides. 

On the consistent basis that gerrards squad did? Doubtful

Sheep twice

Hearts, tarriers 

St mirren, st johnstone 

Hibs

Tarriers twice 

A howling record over 5 years of the majority squad gerrard and beale assembled

[Jimfanciesthedude 25,691]

15 minutes ago, beararse said:

This. 

It can’t be a coincidence we’ve had such a poor trophy return these past 5 years whilst the two mainstays of our team are Tav and Goldson: both of whom have publicly admitted we couldn’t handle the pressure/didn’t believe we could win.

Irrespective of their positive contributions, the constant over reliance on these two has ultimately been our downfall.

You can’t have a successful team if it’s led by senior players with a defeatist mindset.

 

That matchday programme before the Hamilton game by Tav 

[The Dude 20,028]

1 minute ago, Jimbeamjunior said:

On the consistent basis that gerrards squad did? Doubtful

Sheep twice

Hearts, tarriers 

St mirren, st johnstone 

Hibs

Tarriers twice 

A howling record over 5 years of the majority squad gerrard and beale assembled

I posted the list of team Walters side were papped out the cups by during his reign It’s every bit as shite. 

 

[cr3_bear 15,614]

2 minutes ago, The Dude said:

I posted the list of team Walters side were papped out the cups by during his reign It’s every bit as shite. 

 

Yeah we got knocked out of cups under Smith in both his spells . We also consistently won the title under him along with numerous other cups. The situations are not comparable 

[The Dude 20,028]

Just now, cr3_bear said:

Yeah we got knocked out of cups under smith . We also consistently won the title under him along with numerous other cups. The situations are not comparable 

We did regularly win the league under him, you’re right. That doesn’t mean we didn’t lose in cups to shite. Every Rangers manager has lost in cups to shite. Every Rangers manager in the future will likely lose some cup games to shite.