Marco Negri's Beard 1,423 Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 And if Green turns out to be another Craig Whyte? I have no real issue with the form of the CVA (I'd like it to be shareholder costs and not a loan to the club), my issue is with Green and who his investors are.I would have much preferred some Rangers men in amongst them.We all would, there is no question of that, frankly though, there are no 'Rangers men' willing to stump up any cash and save us. TBK/BK were clearly the closest thing but they only wanted to save Rangers at a financial level that suited them. That, of course, is their perogative. However, it does rather grate that BK put so much effort into telling us about how he'd save us if he had to, yet wasn't willing to part with the cash to do so. I'd rather he hadn't even bothered mouthing off in the first place, no matter how pure his intentions.The idea of 'Rangers men' is getting somewhat difficult to truly define.Green isn't my first choice, I no little about him, I don't fully trust him and I have no clue in what direction he is going to take the club. Fact of the matter is, he's the only person to have taken us this far whether it is a loan or not, his investors have put the money out there. We are out of options. I don't get what Traynor et al think the alternative is at this moment? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edmiston Drive 3,846 Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 No I did not say that. I said that at least TBK and BK at least had the club in mind when they tried to get in on the act. Of course a lot of it was ego, but the difference with Green is, he has only 1 thing on his mind, and thats profit. He has seen a possibility to make a quick buck, and has sold the idea to anyone willing to listen. He couldnt give a fuck about the team. If it came to a decision on whether to buy a player or pay a dividend, we all know what his priority will be. Can anyone name any top football team that makes a profit every season?Based on that.......then we will start the snowball rolling down the hill again.............and yeah we can make a profit and still be the top team in Scotland as we have been throughout our years. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marco Negri's Beard 1,423 Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 No. They were at least in it for the club and not the money. What I cant get, is that we are a massive club, known throughout the world, and yet we cannot get people to come in and save the club. Why is that? Every Yank and Russian that has a few quid, are happy to spunk it away on teams like Reading, QPR and Aston Villa. Why cant a few wealthy guys see the potential in this club. They could get an Aston Martin for Mondeo money, and yet the only offers we have had have not even been Mondeo money, but more like fucking Robbing Reliant.Sorry but that is a lazy assumption, offset by the fact that they clearly only wanted to save the club at the price they saw fit. I'm not saying they had evil intentions to ruin us or anything, just that this idea that they were in it purely to resuce us is garbage Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marco Negri's Beard 1,423 Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 Rangers will be debt free. 20 investors20 million in the bank. D&P say they witnessed that one Themselves. then we have shifting deadlines.Quite true they haven't been 100% truthful. I'd like to know who has though. Folk are painfully naive if they gobble up every piece of info as gospel Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marco Negri's Beard 1,423 Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 Not true.If Green fails to come up with the money or the CVA fails, other bidders (who remain interested - if a bit coy for me) then the issue will likely open up again.Nice if true, don't really get where funding of the club comes from in the meantime? Still don't think there is exactly oceans of time for us to go back and re-think things Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frankie 505 Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 If I was in the process of trying to take over the club....then the fans would be the last of my worries................firstly and lastly would be getting the cva sorted and have the club out of the admin process.......................Then answer the fans concerns.I never thought for a moment that the questions are based on spite or of a jocular nature. To serious a situation for that , we shall leave that to the sons and daughters of the man in white to have their time at this.................our day will come to bury them with ridicule sooner than later.What in our current situation would you rather have...............................cva signed and sealed and administration a thing of the past or the fans made to feel happy.Fan goodwill is very important. Debenture creditors, season ticket sales and AIM share issue adds up to a lot of money. I don't think a successful takeover and appeasing fan worries should necessarily be exclusive of each other. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frankie 505 Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 Nice if true, don't really get where funding of the club comes from in the meantime? Still don't think there is exactly oceans of time for us to go back and re-think thingsThe funding of the club would possibly come from the CVA just as it is if Green's proposal is successful.If his CVA fails, it could be altered or added to. Othr bidders may also invest their own money much quicker if the worst happened.Green is NOT the only show in town (though I concede he is the one sitting at the dealer's table). Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marco Negri's Beard 1,423 Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 The funding of the club would possibly come from the CVA just as it is if Green's proposal is successful.If his CVA fails, it could be altered or added to. Othr bidders may also invest their own money much quicker if the worst happened.Green is NOT the only show in town (though I concede he is the one sitting at the dealer's table).Ok but if Green fails or walks away say? It's hardly as if the previous bidding processes have flown by? What happens for the week or 2 weeks while other bidders have to be identified and another PB has to be installed? I don't really get how we stay afloat? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frankie 505 Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 Ok but if Green fails or walks away say? It's hardly as if the previous bidding processes have flown by? What happens for the week or 2 weeks while other bidders have to be identified and another PB has to be installed? I don't really get how we stay afloat?If Green walks away, another bidder can assume control of the existing CVA should they prefer that route. They would probably amend it though.If the CVA fails, other bidders (despite what D&P claim) can apparently bid for the newco assets. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baillie Blue 5 Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 Based on that.......then we will start the snowball rolling down the hill again.............and yeah we can make a profit and still be the top team in Scotland as we have been throughout our years.But would the profit be big enough to keep these guys happy? Thats one possible worry.Sorry but that is a lazy assumption, offset by the fact that they clearly only wanted to save the club at the price they saw fit. I'm not saying they had evil intentions to ruin us or anything, just that this idea that they were in it purely to resuce us is garbageI'm not a fan of any of these guys, if they really had Rangers at heart then they would have come up with the money.Its the fact that nobody has come in with a real cash offer that would save the club all this shite thats going on now. Why is that? Is it because there is more to all this than has been reported? We are a massive, well known, global brand and have hundreds of thousands of fans all over the world, and yet we end up with Whyte, Green, TBK, BK and Dumb & Dumber. If it wasn't really happening, you couldnt make it up. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edmiston Drive 3,846 Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 Fan goodwill is very important. Debenture creditors, season ticket sales and AIM share issue adds up to a lot of money. I don't think a successful takeover and appeasing fan worries should necessarily be exclusive of each other.If the fan has the money he will purchase the season book........share issue if it is for the benefit of the club and we are sitting as we should be then the shares will move...........Debenture creditors bought their seats to have a part of Ibrox on their name , which is still being honoured I believe unless the bond holder wishes to become a creditor...which would be highly unlikely.As I mentioned I personally have no problem being told once they own the club, then we are out of this horrendous situation.Again from a personal pint of view I am sick to my back teeth of the various fan groups coming out with badly timed statements for no other reason than to be seen to be of self importance.Can you think of one specific valid point made be these self proclaimed dogooders. The fighting fund was this not the brainchild of a group of friends getting together? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sprotson11 147 Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 It's the only show in town. He said from the start he was in it for the money. For him to sell and make profit the club will have to be debt free and have a turnover with some profit. This is the scenario I'm hoping for.I am happy for him to make any money from a sale above what he has invested.The problem is that he will get all his money back even if Rangers are not successful and cant be sold. Its a no lose situation for him Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turnberry18 3,204 Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 If the fan has the money he will purchase the season book........share issue if it is for the benefit of the club and we are sitting as we should be then the shares will move...........Debenture creditors bought their seats to have a part of Ibrox on their name , which is still being honoured I believe unless the bond holder wishes to become a creditor...which would be highly unlikely.As I mentioned I personally have no problem being told once they own the club, then we are out of this horrendous situation.Again from a personal pint of view I am sick to my back teeth of the various fan groups coming out with badly timed statements for no other reason than to be seen to be of self importance.Can you think of one specific valid point made be these self proclaimed dogooders. The fighting fund was this not the brainchild of a group of friends getting together?Some of our fans are becoming as famous as the players. Anymore of this and it is going to be difficult for the autograph hunters to decide which Stand to wait outside. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edmiston Drive 3,846 Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 Some of our fans are becoming as famous as the players. Anymore of this and it is going to be difficult for the autograph hunters to decide which Stand to wait outside.That has to be the post of the week and the most spot on observation Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marco Negri's Beard 1,423 Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 If Green walks away, another bidder can assume control of the existing CVA should they prefer that route. They would probably amend it though.If the CVA fails, other bidders (despite what D&P claim) can apparently bid for the newco assets.My point being though that this wouldn't immediately happen. If Green walked away this second and soembody else decided to bid to attempt to take us through a CVA, there would be a period of time in which I don't think we would have the funding to run our club, no? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gash07 26 Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 Lies were the first sign that Mr Whyte was not all that he seemed. At the time everybody tried to find plausible explanations for the lies, i.e to hoodwink hmrc, genuine error, etc, etc. We all said it would never, ever happen again. Here we are only months later repeating the same mistakes. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
caseyjones 3,009 Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 Its this or we fail to exist. Wonder if these same articles will be flaying about if the CVA actually gets accepted. It's done now, all we can do is wait and seeSkepticism is crucial. We shouldn't simply accept this as 100% genuine and perfect. Don't really get what the same article repeated a million times over does though. Us Scots are a welcoming bunch eh? I do wonder what the opinion would be should the exact same CVA be put forward by TBK?The exact same. The personalities are largely immaterial to most Bears. The deal is the bottom line. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Non_Sucumbi 876 Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 Green is in it for financial gain and has admitted so.Traynor wrote:"Whyte bought Rangers, not with his money but borrowings. Green is buying the club from him, not with his money but borrowings."The difference is that Shyte borrowed money against Rangers assets BEFORE he was legally entitled to do so.Green is using money from 'financial backers'.The devil is in the details Jim!!!! fukkin wank person fukkin wank journalist Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marco Negri's Beard 1,423 Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 I'm not a fan of any of these guys, if they really had Rangers at heart then they would have come up with the money.Its the fact that nobody has come in with a real cash offer that would save the club all this shite thats going on now. Why is that? Is it because there is more to all this than has been reported? We are a massive, well known, global brand and have hundreds of thousands of fans all over the world, and yet we end up with Whyte, Green, TBK, BK and Dumb & Dumber. If it wasn't really happening, you couldnt make it up.Well my reply was to your post which said "They were at least in it for the club and not the money." - Just saying, i'm not convinced that this is really that true a statement And nobody has come in for us because we are a fucking state of epic proportions. We owe tens of millions to creditors, we are facing potentially massive bills from HMRC to add to this and a whole heap of shite from the SPL. We also play in a shite league which is financially bereft, with little to no potential to really make any money, short of us winning European tournaments on a consistant basis.As much as I love the club, i'm of the opinion that if you want to buy Rangers right now you are either a fool or you have so much money that this would just be a plaything for you. There is nothing to be made from owning us and that is sadly what businessmen are looking for.There isn't anything more to it than that surely? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marco Negri's Beard 1,423 Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 The exact same. The personalities are largely immaterial to most Bears. The deal is the bottom line. Personalities or 'Rangers men' became irrelevent to me when I realised that 'Rangers men' only want us for what they deem to be an acceptable price. I'd happily have Rangers-minded folk involved but I just want a deal that works for the club, as do we all i'd hope Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marco Negri's Beard 1,423 Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 Lies were the first sign that Mr Whyte was not all that he seemed. At the time everybody tried to find plausible explanations for the lies, i.e to hoodwink hmrc, genuine error, etc, etc. We all said it would never, ever happen again. Here we are only months later repeating the same mistakes.Who exactly doesn't lie in football?What's the solution here? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
caseyjones 3,009 Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 Who exactly doesn't lie in football?What's the solution here?When someone stresses that they will give the truth when asked, and then does the exact opposite, they deserve all the scepticism that comes their way. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
loyalfollower 1,543 Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 Like how people say greens scurrying around looking for investors. How do you know this? Did he not catagorically say after c.v.a outcome we'll know who his backers are? I understand all negative vibes,but in life theres many unanswered questions. 1 things certain the season ticket money is needed by green so I doubt he'll do anything to disappoint us. (atleast until after september!!!) Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marco Negri's Beard 1,423 Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 When someone stresses that they will give the truth when asked, and then does the exact opposite, they deserve all the scepticism that comes their way.I fully accept that Green has been economical with the truth. My problem is that plenty of the same people who are sceptical about his bid seem rather free-and-easy about how truthful other potential bidders have been. Football is a game in which so much of what is said is lies. Scepticism should certainly be important with Green, my problem is that scepticism doesn't seem to be applied evenly to all. It seems to depends on character traits, who you are, where you're from and what connection you have to Rangers. I find this troublingHa we are like a scorned lover, never committing to a relationship again. Who knows, Mr Green might not be the right man, but at some point we are gonna have to open our hearts/legs to someone Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
simplythebest 11,453 Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 Lies were the first sign that Mr Whyte was not all that he seemed. At the time everybody tried to find plausible explanations for the lies, i.e to hoodwink hmrc, genuine error, etc, etc. We all said it would never, ever happen again. Here we are only months later repeating the same mistakes.Just because some aren't assuming the worst and jumping to conlusions doesn't mean they aren't cautious. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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