mitre_mouldmaster 21,510 Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 I will probably be savaged for the very mention of this topic but here goes.....If as expected the kangaroo court does decide to remove the titles from us, then what defence can we mount in court?I am honestly struggling to see how we can effectively challenge the decision, as corrupt as it may be.The SPL have cooked it in such a way as they can state we broke their rules and it's up to them which punishment they administer, one of which is te removal of titles for years when a player is incorrectly registered. It was different with the transfer embargo, as this was not on their list. Hence how they managed to get us with the licence condition, as no list of punishments existed.The case of Juninho is an interesting argument, as to any level headed person, the cases of his EBT should result in similar action, but I don't think it holds up in court. The SPL just have to say they interpret it as not an infringement. We could possibly challenge the SPL to investigate it and convict, but we can't really use it as a direct defence for avoiding title stripping, possibly just to force title stripping of Celtic.The only legal defence I can see possibly working would be Green stating that his investment was devalued. It is hard to quantify any tangible reduction in value to prove this point.As much as I want to believe that we can win this case, I just can't figure out how the hell we can.One thing is for sure, if they do manage to strip any titles, I wold support any action to either get out of Scotland or cripple the SFA / SPL for good.No doubt I'll be accused of being a tim for even discussing this, but I can assure you I am not.Please if anyone has any legal knowledge, please explain a form of defence we may use and be successful with. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlBear. 8,499 Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 unprecedented. They can't touch them.And if they put one slimy, cheating fucking finger on any of our deserved and rightfully won Championships they will awaken a shit storm that will wipe them off this planet for good. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tannerall 25,935 Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 unprecedented. They can't touch them.And if they put one slimy, cheating fucking finger on any of our deserved and rightfully won Championships they will awaken a shit storm that will wipe them off this planet for good.Very well put Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigblueyonder 11,158 Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 Let's not kid on ourselves that this is about titles, this is about SPL trying to save their skin with financial compensation... Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
adam2102 631 Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 not to sure how to legally challenge it - but if they do, scottish football is effectively over and rangers should start in english league 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craigie79 67 Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 David Murray mentioned that we in fact did not break any rulesOr that they accepted for 10 year that we were using EBT's Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mitre_mouldmaster 21,510 Posted October 22, 2012 Author Share Posted October 22, 2012 Albear,I hope you are right, but I can't understand your confidence.Why can't they touch them? How will they suffer? They have already shown they are willing to throw us to the wolves for the entertainment of the baying crowd. That decision cost them millions. Stripping us of titles probably won't cost them a penny, boycott excluded.It's not like co-efficient points have to be adjusted. The French and Italians were domestically stripped of titles, but co-efficients were not touched.Uefa tends to be of the opinion that each FA governs their own leagues. They are not going to force the EPL to follow the same action as the SPL, but neither will they step in to block the corrupt swines. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mitre_mouldmaster 21,510 Posted October 22, 2012 Author Share Posted October 22, 2012 not to sure how to legally challenge it - but if they do, scottish football is effectively over and rangers should start in english league 2I would fully back this if it happened. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlBear. 8,499 Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 Albear,I hope you are right, but I can't understand your confidence.Why can't they touch them? How will they suffer? They have already shown they are willing to throw us to the wolves for the entertainment of the baying crowd. That decision cost them millions. Stripping us of titles probably won't cost them a penny, boycott excluded.It's not like co-efficient points have to be adjusted. The French and Italians were domestically stripped of titles, but co-efficients were not touched. (For match fixing and bribes.)Uefa tends to be of the opinion that each FA governs their own leagues. They are not going to force the EPL to follow the same action as the SPL, but neither will they step in to block the corrupt swines.Why would they have tried so hard to get CG to sign away our right to challenge a decision on stripping titles? They are corrupt as the day is long, if they come for our titles they will expose the true level of that corruption. Their best chance is Scottish football reconstruction deflects away from this salem witch trial/kangaroo court, because they know they wont win. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mitre_mouldmaster 21,510 Posted October 22, 2012 Author Share Posted October 22, 2012 David Murray mentioned that we in fact did not break any rulesOr that they accepted for 10 year that we were using EBT'sThis is where the SPL are being at their slimy best.It's obvious to everyone that the SPL knew what was going on, but they can claim they thought we were using it as a loan scheme, not as a form of remuneration. This is why they can only get us if we have at least a partial liability from the BTC. They will claim it was not their responsibility to investigate the legalities of the scheme, but since the BTC decided they were payments, we were incorrectly registered.Legally it's hard to argue, even if it's bloody obvious to everyone that they knew what was happening. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaywalker 377 Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 I dont think England is even a remote possibility, but I would now support it as an idea even although I have always hated the very thought of turning our back on Scottish football.I still cannot honestly believe what has happened to our club over the last year.Time to ship out if there is a chance. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill tells the struth 45 Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 This is where the SPL are being at their slimy best. but since the BTC decided they were payments, we were incorrectly registeredWhen was this decided? It's the first I've heard... Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mitre_mouldmaster 21,510 Posted October 22, 2012 Author Share Posted October 22, 2012 Why would they have tried so hard to get CG to sign away our right to challenge a decision on stripping titles? They are corrupt as the day is long, if they come for our titles they will expose the true level of that corruption. Their best chance is Scottish football reconstruction deflects away from this salem witch trial/kangaroo court, because they know they wont win.It does not matter what reason they strip titles for, as long as their rules allow it. Unfortunately, I think they do.I honestly don't think they care about exposing their corruption, which again would be bloody hard to legally prove.They tried to strip our titles away as well as a condition for membership, they have already decided they want to do it. This idea they don't want to open a can of worms is destroyed by that. Green has already basically stated he believes they have already decided to do so.They wanted to remove our right to challenge as they are cunts and they wanted a simple execution. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rupret 223 Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 Historically, legally and morally they cannot touch our titles, doubt it will stop this Micky Mouse kangaroo court brigade having a go. They are trying to hang on to power.Everyone in the world is getting tired of FIFA, UEFA, SFA (or their local idiot branch) as they are antiquated almost corrupt organisations, killing the game.I hope and predict breakaway leagues are coming, and not just in this country. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlBear. 8,499 Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 It does not matter what reason they strip titles for, as long as their rules allow it. Unfortunately, I think they do.I honestly don't think they care about exposing their corruption, which again would be bloody hard to legally prove.They tried to strip our titles away as well as a condition for membership, they have already decided they want to do it. This idea they don't want to open a can of worms is destroyed by that. Green has already basically stated he believes they have already decided to do so.They wanted to remove our right to challenge as they are cunts and they wanted a simple execution.They can create as many rules and sanctions as they like but you are asking 'legally', in this respect they don't have a leg to stand on. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mitre_mouldmaster 21,510 Posted October 22, 2012 Author Share Posted October 22, 2012 When was this decided? It's the first I've heard...It hasn't, you seem to have missed the part of my post which states they can only come after us if we have some liability in the BTC.If we 100% win the BTC and they try to strip titles, then we can take them to the cleaners in court. I honestly believe we will have a partial liability, which gives them grounds. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craigie79 67 Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 This is where the SPL are being at their slimy best.It's obvious to everyone that the SPL knew what was going on, but they can claim they thought we were using it as a loan scheme, not as a form of remuneration. This is why they can only get us if we have at least a partial liability from the BTC. They will claim it was not their responsibility to investigate the legalities of the scheme, but since the BTC decided they were payments, we were incorrectly registered.Legally it's hard to argue, even if it's bloody obvious to everyone that they knew what was happening.In that case should the not have waited untill after the Tax Case to start proceedings or should they not have started when the became aware that we had a tax bill 18-24 months ago? starting it when they did just screams of a witch hunt.I still think it won't be titles stripped for our punishment Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ForeverBlue_Since91 2,895 Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 Albear,I hope you are right, but I can't understand your confidence.Why can't they touch them? How will they suffer? They have already shown they are willing to throw us to the wolves for the entertainment of the baying crowd. That decision cost them millions. Stripping us of titles probably won't cost them a penny, boycott excluded.It's not like co-efficient points have to be adjusted. The French and Italians were domestically stripped of titles, but co-efficients were not touched.Uefa tends to be of the opinion that each FA governs their own leagues. They are not going to force the EPL to follow the same action as the SPL, but neither will they step in to block the corrupt swines. Yes for match fixing and bribing refs fur fuck sake. No one has had titles stripped for financial problems before and this is why the top men from Juve can't get there heads around this situation. And they only got stripped of two tittles and demoted 1 division. Lets not forget they were involved in match fixing and bribing officials. And what happens if the SPL do strip these titles? Whats going to happen to them? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mitre_mouldmaster 21,510 Posted October 22, 2012 Author Share Posted October 22, 2012 They can create as many rules and sanctions as they like but you are asking 'legally', in this respect they don't have a leg to stand on.How not?Their rules state they can reaward results of games where players were incorrectly registered. They can legally do this.Their rules allow them to annul leagues where these 'rule breaches' have occurred. They can legally do this.I don't see how they don't have a leg to stand on.The problem, as highlighted above, is these football associations have too much power. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jules Gers 66 Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 not to sure how to legally challenge it - but if they do, scottish football is effectively over and rangers should start in english league 2 Scottish football has already died and england wont have us..so I guess we just fight this corrupt country with our best lawyers. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill tells the struth 45 Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 It hasn't, you seem to have missed the part of my post which states they can only come after us if we have some liability in the BTC.If we 100% win the BTC and they try to strip titles, then we can take them to the cleaners in court. I honestly believe we will have a partial liability, which gives them grounds.So the questions you have asked on this thread are all Hypothetical until the BTC is resolved? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mitre_mouldmaster 21,510 Posted October 22, 2012 Author Share Posted October 22, 2012 Yes for match fixing and bribing refs fur fuck sake. No one has had titles stripped for financial problems before and this is why the top men from Juve can't get there heads around this situation. And they only got stripped of two tittles and demoted 1 division. Lets not forget they were involved in match fixing and bribing officials. And what happens if the SPL do strip these titles? Whats going to happen to them?This is the SPL and SFA we are dealing with, they are nowhere near as compliant as other leagues.Remember if the SPL or SFA followed the same rules as England, we would still be in the SPL. The English FA did not cast Leeds down the divisions when their CVA was rejected and they went NewCo.They will try to take our titles, I just hope to god Green has an ace of some kind up his sleeve. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
WATP-FOREVER 5,231 Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 I will probably be savaged for the very mention of this topic but here goes.....If as expected the kangaroo court does decide to remove the titles from us, then what defence can we mount in court?I am honestly struggling to see how we can effectively challenge the decision, as corrupt as it may be.The SPL have cooked it in such a way as they can state we broke their rules and it's up to them which punishment they administer, one of which is te removal of titles for years when a player is incorrectly registered.It was different with the transfer embargo, as this was not on their list. Hence how they managed to get us with the licence condition, as no list of punishments existed.The case of Juninho is an interesting argument, as to any level headed person, the cases of his EBT should result in similar action, but I don't think it holds up in court. The SPL just have to say they interpret it as not an infringement. We could possibly challenge the SPL to investigate it and convict, but we can't really use it as a direct defence for avoiding title stripping, possibly just to force title stripping of Celtic.The only legal defence I can see possibly working would be Green stating that his investment was devalued. It is hard to quantify any tangible reduction in value to prove this point.As much as I want to believe that we can win this case, I just can't figure out how the hell we can.One thing is for sure, if they do manage to strip any titles, I wold support any action to either get out of Scotland or cripple the SFA / SPL for good.No doubt I'll be accused of being a tim for even discussing this, but I can assure you I am not.Please if anyone has any legal knowledge, please explain a form of defence we may use and be successful with.Green states, & d&p have clarified that Green bought the RFC assets with 115 trophies. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ForeverBlue_Since91 2,895 Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 How not?Their rules state they can reaward results of games where players were incorrectly registered. They can legally do this.Their rules allow them to annul leagues where these 'rule breaches' have occurred. They can legally do this.I don't see how they don't have a leg to stand on.The problem, as highlighted above, is these football associations have too much power.So why have they not done it then? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlBear. 8,499 Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 How not?Their rules state they can reaward results of games where players were incorrectly registered. They can legally do this.Their rules allow them to annul leagues where these 'rule breaches' have occurred. They can legally do this.I don't see how they don't have a leg to stand on.The problem, as highlighted above, is these football associations have too much power.Your mind seems made up. You see the all powerful spl coming for titles and you're giving up, backing down. They can't take them and they will not bully us into taking them.If you would trust me on one thing and one thing only it is this, The spl will never ever take away, not even one of, our World Record 54 titles. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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