Were We Naive In The Summer 2012?

[SteveJ 743]

What planet are you on? Or how good do you think our 'youth' are?

Posts like this are easy to type, and need no basis in reality. Presumably the youth to lead us to the top and into Europe would be Cole, Perry, Hegarty, Naismith, Hutton & Hemmings? Or do you want to ruin 16 and 17 year olds by getting them kicked up and down plastic pitches every week?

If we had 11 as good as Macleod, your theory could work but we quite simply don't. Maybe if McCabe & Ness hadn't walked out, but the best of our youth deserted us.

I did not mean that we would have 11 youth players in the starting line-up, I meant we could have a good crop of youth if they were given the chance every week, by playing with the experienced spine.

We only ever seem to give one youngster a chance every couple of years and due to our opposition from last season onwards, this was our perfect opportunity.

Go back and read the threads after administration and see that I am on the same planet that most bears were on back then.

[TAFKA 545]

Not naive to be honest, most of us wanted a fresh start, a style of footbal built on young players passing and moving with a maximum of three or four senior players.

Now the kids can't get into the team because they are either under-developed, not good enough or they are being kept out by older journeymen.

We are EXACTLY where I wanted NOT to be - shite football from average players getting paid too much and we have made zero progress in terms of style of play.

[legalbeagle 3,734]

I did not mean that we would have 11 youth players in the starting line-up, I meant we could have a good crop of youth if they were given the chance every week, by playing with the experienced spine.

We only ever seem to give one youngster a chance every couple of years and due to our opposition from last season onwards, this was our perfect opportunity.

Go back and read the threads after administration and see that I am on the same planet that most bears were on back then.

When we did have to play more of them last season, they struggled. And because of the lack of patience from Rangers fans they weren't exactly supported. The pressure is immense and a real struggle for most of them. The idea is great, but I am not sure it could ever be reality.

[SteveJ 743]

When we did have to play more of them last season, they struggled. And because of the lack of patience from Rangers fans they weren't exactly supported. The pressure is immense and a real struggle for most of them. The idea is great, but I am not sure it could ever be reality.

You really are missing the point. The point was to bleed the youth amongst a spine of experience - not dropping them in the shite because we did not have enough fit players.

[BFerguson6 121]

That is what everyone wanted, unfortunately Ally and his staff aren't good enough.

Charles Green knew this, but couldn't move him on for risk of fans not buying tickets.

did he really? based on what?

[BFerguson6 121]

I think a lot of people believed it would be Roy of the rovers stuff, we would somehow develop all these young players into great first team regulars whilst playing part timers.....

These boys weren't going to develop playing at this level, I do think we could of got 1 or 2 but they would have risen through the ranks anyway.

I don't understand where people thought we would make a profit and bank money for the return. I personally thought Ally would spend after the embargo anyway but did think it would be the likes of

Boyd, Novo, Thomson, Wilson who might have played for next to nothing. I am surprised that he signed so many very average players (peralta being the next gattuso was some laugh)

As for the mhanky mob, I was slightly puzzled at why people thought they would suffer as badly as they would 90% be playing CL football every year and banking 10-15mill.

Obviously the offield nonsense hasn't helped, can only hope we get it right in the next few months with cuts and rebuilding wisely.

[Getstiffed 8,863]

What planet are you on? Or how good do you think our 'youth' are?

Posts like this are easy to type, and need no basis in reality. Presumably the youth to lead us to the top and into Europe would be Cole, Perry, Hegarty, Naismith, Hutton & Hemmings? Or do you want to ruin 16 and 17 year olds by getting them kicked up and down plastic pitches every week?

If we had 11 as good as Macleod, your theory could work but we quite simply don't. Maybe if McCabe & Ness hadn't walked out, but the best of our youth deserted us.

See this is what is wrong with this discussion. No-one wanted a squad of 25+ 17 year olds and no-one on the opposite side believes we need a squad of 25+ 30 somethings on anywhere from 5 to 10 grand.

All we wanted was a balance. We had dross and youth last season and we coasted. Does it not stand to reason that we could have taken a few punts this summer, either on our own youth graduates or on players brought in; rather than paying Foster, Smith and Simonsen for the same job.

Said it before: I'd rather 2 or 3 young guys on peanuts sat on the bench and added nothing when they get picked, than paying Foster, Smith and Simonsen over the odds for the same return.

[tannerall 25,935]

How would we have got a decent squad to compete in Div 1 at that time ?

Was tough in the part time Div 3 but we improved quickly. Div 1 would have been against full time players quite a few levels higher, and unfortunately I think we would have have struggled to win the majority of games, or even worse spunked even more money to compete, leaving us even more financially vulnerable.

[legalbeagle 3,734]

See this is what is wrong with this discussion. No-one wanted a squad of 25+ 17 year olds and no-one on the opposite side believes we need a squad of 25+ 30 somethings on anywhere from 5 to 10 grand.

All we wanted was a balance. We had dross and youth last season and we coasted. Does it not stand to reason that we could have taken a few punts this summer, either on our own youth graduates or on players brought in; rather than paying Foster, Smith and Simonsen for the same job.

Said it before: I'd rather 2 or 3 young guys on peanuts sat on the bench and added nothing when they get picked, than paying Foster, Smith and Simonsen over the odds for the same return.

Last season was awful, so I'm not sure the model works. Biggest problem remains that the players who were the right age to step up left (McCabe, Ness, maybe even Fleck)

Many have been dismissed by the fans (Hutton, Perry, Naismith, Cole) and the ones we clamour for are still a bit young for the pressure of 45k fans. (McKay, Gasparotto).

Macleod, Aird and Clark have had good opportunities.....would have been good to get more of Hegarty or McAusland imho.

[Jimfanciesthedude 24,607]

When we did have to play more of them last season, they struggled. And because of the lack of patience from Rangers fans they weren't exactly supported. The pressure is immense and a real struggle for most of them. The idea is great, but I am not sure it could ever be reality.

i think if you remember correctly our experienced purchases struggled more than our youngsters

[legalbeagle 3,734]

i think if you remember correctly our experienced purchases struggled more than our youngsters

I thought it was pretty poor all round tbh.

[Jimfanciesthedude 24,607]

I thought it was pretty poor all round tbh.

yup but at least the youngsters have the excuse of inexperience

[legalbeagle 3,734]

yup but at least the youngsters have the excuse of inexperience

Yes, but it seemed on here that a lot were marked as ones to be dumped regardless of that. We are not a patient fanbase!

[Brian Fantana 28,894]

Not once did i think the bheasts would get weaker or that we would produce youth worthy of the top flight in a Rangers jersey. We haven't learned the lessons of the past as nothing has changed in terms of coaching and scouting and people still want someone (King) to plow money in to see us buy like fuck and go into debt starting the cycle again

[CanadianBacon 2,088]

I'm no fan of Ian Black (there, I've said it) but before he came to us he was a standout in midfield for the Watery Farts and was probably their MOTM in the 5-1 demolition on the HIV's in the 2012 Scottish cup final - but he's Sucked (with a capital S) since he joined us on a reported £7k per week. Likewise Templeton, a decent player in that Farts squad but who has hardly kicked a ball in anger since he arrived - his form has long since deserted him. Nicky Law was a stand-out at M'well....his form has also gone A.W.O.L., same goes with Dean Shiels (injuries notwithstanding for any of them)......players being played out of position, tactics that would get football stopped (everyone back in our own penalty box defending corner kicks?????) and on it goes.

I don't think we were being naive....but I do feel we've been let down by someone who appeared to have no master plan other than to buy big names (for the lower leagues I might add) and give youth a sideways glance and a nod in their direction every once in a while....usually when the older named players (above) were injured......again.

McCoist has shown no signs that he's thinking long term. Why only two weeks ago he was asking what his budget would be for the January transfer window. I mean c'mon......has he seen the league table? Why do we need more of the same (with no sell-on value like many already purchased) when this season is done and dusted, title-wise?

It's fiscal madness.

I think that's his downfall and one which I hope the present Board deal with this summer.

[MasterD 7,436]

Think many people were trying to kid themselves on that it would be great just to put a brave face on it.

[Brian Fantana 28,894]

I think that's his downfall and one which I hope the present Board deal with this summer.

Great post CB. But the last bit, i think we both know there's only one action to take to deal with it and i doubt they would for fear of a fans revolt.

[Christchurch Rangers 1,229]

Were We Naive In The Summer 2012?

No I don't think we were naive at all: we were grateful that Rangers had been saved, we were excited about having a fresh start, a clean slate so to speak; a chance to rebuild from the bottom up.

A chance to see Rangers becoming a fit, strong and healthy club after years of mire and mismanagement

Nothing naive in that. Sounds like a reasonable situation all things given.

What we didn't realise was the extent of the on-going issues off the pitch and in the boardroom: the poisonous squabbles, the infighting and bitching.

The club is being torn asunder from within not without....

That's the problem: the boardroom Rangers men are shooting each other in the foot and leaving the whole club in a perilous position.

Maybe thats where we were naive: thinking that the club itself was always bigger than the personalities involved in running it, for sadly those personalities have embarrassed themselves and hurt the club time and again.

Rangers desperately needs stability off the pitch and the club needs people who are going to protect and nurture RFC, not tarnish her name and run her into the ground.

[elephants stoned 2,994]

What i was getting at in my op is that basicly our level of outgoings are not too bad, for a spl club we would be doing quite well but our income in the lowest tiers of Scottish football is to be frank a joke, without massive investment (spent wisely for a change) Rangers cannot function in the lower leagues for very long unless we stripped everything to the bone and made ourselves totaly uncompetitive against top flight teams. Our naivety in my view was thinking we could run Rangers on a shoestring budget and still retain our ability to sign big players and be a force in the Scottish Cup without any financial problems mounting. Going to the 3rd division was the noble thing to do but in hindsight the 1st division would have been much better for us, not that we had much say in the end though.

[BigDak 799]

One thing I would like to add is that maybe it was a case of getting us up to the top as quickly as possible then when we're there digging in and holding on til we've got the strength to stand up and start takin' names again.

I picture it like climbing a mountain with way too much gear than is necessary that is too heavy and needs cast aside as we get up the mountain until we get to the summit, out of breath and not able to stand, where we take a knee for a bit knowing that we aren't going to get blown off the top and biding our time til we have enough in us to stand up and plant our flag in that mother f*cker (most likey a Union Jack)!