Tenerife Bear

My first topic so please take it easy on me. First thing i have to admit is i am hurting, i am hurting immensely and that is probably what has been the catalyst to put my head above the water on here and post my thoughts but this is not a knee jerk reaction. My opinions have been consistent for some time. Last seasons team needed ripped up and rebuilt. Anyone denying that is a fool in my book. Warburton failed to read the signs. Just like he failed to learn from defeats to Falkirk and Hibs when they happened again, and again and for a 3rd time in Hibs case. From January onwards we should have been headhunting the very best players our clubs budget would allow, half a million for Dembele and £30k a week, for someone who would guarantee a huge financial return and enough goals to keep us competitive in the league. Players like that. The money was obviously there. We paid £500k for O'Halloran who has been a complete waste of time and money, probably throwing 5 a week at him, we paid big bucks to Senderos, Kranjcar, Hill and Barton, we signed a Polish keeper we never ever seen before being binned. We threw an alleged £10k a week at a kid who is injured more than he is fit, and whom had an poor injury record before coming here, we signed one sub after another and one inexperienced kid after another, all the while the club were trotting out the "going for 55" nonsense in an attempt to dupe fans into buying season books. He had the audacity to start this season with the same back line of Foderingham, Tavernier, Wallace, Kiernan and Wilson that collapsed so many times last season and whom had just been completely destroyed at Hampden a few months previous. His plans to sort that? A back up goalie, a substitute right back and 2 x 30+ hasbeens. 4 subs. Sure Hill has forced his way back into the team after an awful start but that is only because the others are so bad. In midfield he obviously identified some weakness because he signed no less than 5 midfielders to replace the lower league players from last year yet here we are January 2017 and Holt and Halliday are our mainstay centre midfield. Crooks isn't fit and looks as if he will need a couple of seasons to ever be good enough and/or fit, if at all, Rossiter has been a few weeks away from full fitness for 3, 4 months now, Kranjcar came with a dodgy injury record from the lower leagues in America and finds himself ruled out through injury again, the Barton signing which went against everything Warburton was brainwashing into fans about signings completely failed and Windass is another who we just can't keep fit. He can't play more than a few consecutive games. Up front we scored goals last season, against the Dumbartons and Livingstons, Alloas and Queens of the South, we scored goals, McKay shone, Miller played his part and Waghorn was doing the business up against players he knew he could get the better of but this is the Premiership now, there are no Alloas or Dumbartons in this league. Warburton ignored that and obviously believed what he had was enough, of course it was never going to be. Those of us who have lived through Scottish football and seen how hard it is for any Rangers team to be successful up here, despite the awful standard knew what we had was never going to be enough. The sole signing of some kid from Leicester Under 21s was worrying, as Celtic were snapping up a French Under 21 international who was valued down south at multi millions. Joe Dodoo has so far scored a few goals but shown nothing at all to suggest he will develop into any sort of player of note. Bottom line there is, he's rubbish. In my opinion, the kid is useless. In fact, it took Warburton well into August to sign the striker he identified as being good enough to be "highly competitive" in this league, with only a week or so of the transfer window remaining and time running out he threw almost £2m at a Preston North End striker, with no pace and whom had played the majority of his career with a partner. From where i was sitting it looked like a desperate attempt to just spend money and sign someone. Anyone. And that, squad building and transfer business, are only small parts of the problem with Warburton. There are just so many issues and so many problems we could be here forever going over them all. 10, 11, 12 players later and we are no better than we were last year. He was hired by Rangers after having less than 80 matches under his belt as a first team manager, he was not qualified enough, he was not experienced enough and he was never good enough. My first doubts crept in when we knew Weir would be his assistant, another one with next to no off field experience, a few weeks looking after kids at Everton, a handful of matches in charge at Sheff Utd where he lost all but 1 match i'm sure and a period as Warburtons assistant at Brentford. No track record, not enough experience and nothing to suggest he can coach and or develop players or organise teams along with his manager. Davie Weir is only here because of his playing legacy at the club and Warburton is only here because Davie Weir is his assistant. It's as close to jobs for the boys as one could get from this clueless board. This appointment hot on the heels of their first disaster appointing Stuart McCall who couldn't even get us out of the 2nd tier. The second alarm went off when we knew Lee Wallace would be club captain. A player of undoubted limited ability, a player lauded by fans for "staying for the fight", a player i don't even think is good enough to play for us never mind captain us. From then on, i knew, it was always going to end in tears. Right now, Mark Warburton is averaging 1 defeat every 6 games. That is quite simply unacceptable on it's own never mind all his other faults. That's 2 strikes for King and his pals now, a 3rd and it's surely "out" for them too. They must, they simply must get the next appointment right. that's before we even talk about spending a sheckle or two. Appointing a manager befitting the job is a bear minimum for any board, then we can properly discuss investment, youth policies and long term strategies. First thing is first, Celtic need stopped. Who is going to steady our sinking ship this time?

I thought the ref had an excellent game.

That's Kenny though, that is what he does. He isn't a finisher. He's a model professional with tremendous experience. He should be a back up and mentor for our very own Dembele type players.

Faded away in second half a little but was superb for the majority. One wonders what he could really do in a good team. Well played him!

Sounds like you are firefighting for Warburton. 3 pass marks today. Foderingham, McKay and Miller. The rest were their usual mediocre self. Midfield especially is still a huge concern. The heartbeat of any team, ours are completely out of their depth at this level. Must have been a few years since any Rangers manager or team has lost 3 old firm games on the trot too. 10 years maybe, possibly longer. It's not good enough, it's just nowhere near good enough.

The board have nether the money nor the balls to get rid of him. His target is to happily plod along in Celtics shadow and that is what he is doing.

Very poor defensively but then we all knew that before the game and before the team was picked. Quite simply a liability.

Poor decision making from a very average player. No shock there. What was he, a Darlington or Doncaster sub or something?

Wallace isn't and there's not many of Warburtons 20+ signings who are any good for what we need or where we need to go sadly. Foderingham, McKay, Windass, Miller for experience and Gilks. That's honestly about it. From a squad of what, almost 30 players. And yes it is, disgraceful. Recruitment has been appalling since day one. The new super scout has only cost us more money as well.

Me neither. Really don't see the fuss over him. All our fullbacks are poor, captain included.

It's a bit gutting that we don't have any kids to rely on, youths to bring through and let loose. The kids in our 20s must be bursting for a chance but their pathway is blocked by a guy who wasn't good enough for Hearts.

5-3-2 counter attack. I can't really see anything else. We will invite pressure, they will dominate the ball as their midfield is far stronger, we just have to hope we can keep their forwards quiet. Midfield is a huge worry. Bigger than defence for me. As is up front. There's no penetration, threat or goals there. Fearing the worst, hoping for the best. Best of luck Rangers

I wonder if Garner will even start. I think we might go with Miller, Waghorn and McKay up front.

I don't think they are friends, are they? Bit crazy expecting Ally to be ahead of the 2 he picked as well!

Ignore me. Thought i read New in there! Good luck and have fun!

There is finishing 2nd 20/30+ points behind Celtic and no domestic cups to show for the season and there is finishing 2nd, making Celtic work for the title, losing out by single digit points and ensuring they don't win a treble by winning at least 1 domestic cup. The interpretation of 2nd is so wide open that it can be looked upon many ways depending on which side of the agenda one sits. Whilst 2nd is never acceptable, this year of all years it may be the only one in our history where it is the most realistic target, that said, it doesn't mean if we do finish 2nd that the manager survives for reasons i mention above. I would empty him either way. I personally see finishing 2nd as a mere formality, certainly not an achievement or barometer to keep the job. I've seen more than enough, as they say.

He just doesn't get it. Judge him at the end after he gets 2nd place, as if it is some sort of achievement, so those who are happy with that can defend him again and we go into next season with the same problems, same man in charge and end up with the same end result again. Seen and heard it all before. He may well finish 2nd but it may be a season where Celtic win a domestic treble, go the whole season unbeaten domestically and win the league by at least 20 odd points, maybe more. So far it has been a very poor season, 2 trophies are gone already as well. To rescue the season we have to go on a long long winning run, not unbeaten, winning run, win the Scottish Cup and beat Celtic at least both times at home. I don't see how anything else can be acceptable. As for gelling and learning, nothing more than soundbites to appease the masses. Talking to us like idiots. And it's becoming a habit.

I accept that about Dodoo, there's just something about him i can't take to. I don't actually know what it is. Perhaps he hasn't been given a fair chance. He was strangely frozen out of the team after the contributions he made that you mention above. I have to agree as well that other players have been given prolonged periods in the first team despite offering less. Holt to name one. Halliday another.

I completely disagree and past history has shown that. The last 4 or 5 years was different. Watching Celtic win title after title and being in the same league as them will only be stomached for so long. I believe you are overestimating our fans loyalty. They won't hang about. In my opinion.

I don't agree with comparing the Scottish Premiership which is a 1 horse race to the Italian Serie A as it was then or us with one of the richest clubs in the world who had numerous world class players on their books. I have no idea how you can say so sure that it will likely happen, it just as likely won't happen that way given the gulf between us and Celtic just now. Or that the playing staff will gradually get better. We came from the 2nd tier in Scotland with a mediocre squad and signed a full team of players who were no more than bench warmers. We didn't get any better, what makes you think we will get better next season. Can we even afford to wait or gamble? There are so many reasons and variables of why i think it will be different, it may well be worse. As i said, there is nothing to suggest right now that we can catch or stop Celtic. They will win the title from now until football is cancelled if nothing changes at Rangers as it is right now. We are the only club who can stop them and that is our aim. How we do that is what the debate is. In Scottish football the formula is easy, we all know what it takes to be successful. Money. Celtic are the richest club paying the most wages so will win the league every year without fail until we start spending properly. When we won 9IAR we were the richest club paying the most money. Martin O'Neill went to Celtic and spent circa £40m and won a couple of titles, Advocaat sent £80m and won a couple of titles, Strachan spent £20m and won a couple of titles, Walter Smith came in and spent £40m and won titles, Neil Lennon spent tens of millions and won a couple of titles. Tony Mowbray didn't and didn't, Paul Le Guen didn't and didn't. Ally McCoist didn't and didn't. Mark Warburton didn't and won't. That is how it works up here. There are only 2 teams who can win the league. Who wins the league depends on who is making or spending money and using it the wisest. We won't stop Celtic with 5 year plans of developing players from the lower leagues in England. We won't stop Celtic by blindly supporting Mark Warburton or the Rangers board because we like them. We won't stop Celtic by dominating the football or from learning from previous mistakes which we don't anyway. We won't stop Celtic by loaning the odd kid from down south to compliment an already weak staring 11 or by signing 30+ year old hasbeens to compliment the same poor starting 11s. We will stop them by making good promises of heavy investment. We will stop them by showing an ambition and desire to success befitting our great club. We will stop them by appointing a manager with the right experience and credentials to manage this great club.

We had no option but to follow in the lower leagues and Celtic were not our concern then. I don't know how you can say with any great certainty that will be better next season, there is nothing to suggest that at all in my opinion. Celtic will grow and develop just like everyone else in your hypothetical situation so i don't see how they will get caught up with short of us making huge investment in the playing squad. That is the only thing that will cut the gap, not time. Money.

I totally agree although we have had a full year and a half for this group to grow together and gel. Guys like Foderingham, Tavernier, Wallace, Kiernan, Wilson, Holt, Halliday, McKay, Miller and Waghorn have all been together from day 1 under Warburton and still don't look like a team. The core of this seasons team is the majority of last seasons team which struggled even then at a lower level and still we don't flow or play as one. The same mistakes are being made by the same players and the manager that were being made 12 months ago. That is a huge concern. It has to be. We keep hearing the same party lines from the manager but nothing ever changes. You say it takes time, i agree but they have all had time, the manager has had more than enough time to show us something, the new players are not our biggest problems, those have been over a year in the making. My issue, and this is only my opinion, is that there is nothing at all to suggest that this group of players or this management team can deliver what i expect of a Rangers team, there is nothing to suggest they will even improve never mind be successful.

It was 5 years ago and Ibrox will be a ghost town in the next 2 or 3 years never mind 5 if we don't win the league before then. We cannot and should not have to wait 5 years to catch a very average Celtic team. It's simply unthinkable. Rangers fans just won't wait another 5 years to win the league, i know they won't.

I agree with all that, my problem is King also knows this yet still promised to make it good. He still promised to plough money in and he also said that we would run at a loss for a few years yet in order to close the gap and catch Celtic. There has been no sign of that coming to fruition. This living within our means nonsense is a pipedream, a moonbeam right now, we cannot and will not for the foreseeable. That is why we need a board able and willing to invest and a board with the means to do what is needed. the board knew this before they took over, they knew what they were getting into yet still wanted to take over. The retail deal is a red herring, it's only worth £4m a year at best. Even that isn't close to being enough to operate properly and close the financial gap on Celtic. Right or wrong, this club needs an injection of 8 figures and soon. We are merely treading water right now, going through the motions, or sleepwalking if you like. A sleeping giant. It needs an owner with the means to wake it up from it's slumber.

I think roughly from old accounts it cost us £15m per year to run the club before we even paid a wage to a staff member or a player. Add the wage bill on top of that and costs will be up at almost £30m i would guess. Season tickets may account for about £18m but where does the rest of our income come from? Catering is tied up, retail is tied up, i can't see where else we could bring in much else. Sponsorship, hospitality. What is left to make money from? And this is in no way a defence of the board who have failed to made good on promises made but i don't think there is any money going "outside" the club. There's just none there.