The Cuckoo's Nest

[D'Artagnan 13,319]

One could be forgiven for confusing the scenes surrounding Scottish football in the last few weeks with a scene from One Flew Over the Cuckoo’s Nest. But amidst all the hullabaloo one fact shines above all...a total miscarriage of justice.

Scottish football should be ashamed of itself. No strike that.....the whole of Scotland should wake up tomorrow morning and be utterly ashamed of itself.

Once again we have overreacted to the bullies. Yes Dougie MacDonalds position probably was untenable after he told lies....but ask yourself what kind of pressure has been exerted on our referees by a particular football club that forced him into a position where he felt he had to lie to vindicate himself ?

But it gets worse. Far worse. So Hugh Dallas forwarded an e-mail which poked fun at the visiting pontiff....suddenly according to Peter Kearney, director of the Scottish Catholic Media Office, the e-mail was an example of "deep, wide and vicious anti-Catholic hostility".

Once again Scotland has acquiesced to the paranoia of Celtic Football and the Catholic Church. And there lies our shame as a nation.

How long are we going to allow them to perpetuate these myths ?

Rangers football club and their support have all too often been victims of these two organisations paranoia. Who can forget Cardinal Keith O’Briens opening statement at the anti-sectarian summit a few years ago when he accused Protestants of indulging in a fictious game of “Punch a pape” ?

This is the same Cardinal who suggested Catholic priests guilty of child abuse were in need of “spiritual counselling” rather face the law of the land. He is also the same fellow who suggested that gays were akin to paedophiles. Those in glass houses.....

This paranoia and myth has been perpetuated, and more importantaly tolerated, for far too long in this country.

Unfortunately for Kearney and O’Brien the facts do not fit squarely with the picture they are trying to paint. Those in the academic world have taken their accusations and totally destroyed them, much to the dismay of those who jumped on MaConnell’s phoney “Scotlands Secret Shame”, such as Nil By Mouth. Prof Steve Bruce of Aberdeen University has demonstrated through academic study and research that this myth is nothing other than a complete fabrication.

http://news.scotsman.com/opinion/Beware-myths-that-tarnish-sectarian.2603272.jp

What is even more alarming was a Sunday Herald survey a few years back in Holyrood which showed that 91% of Scottish MSP’s felt the Catholic Church had an unhealthy influence in Scottish politics.

Why do we allow this Church such an influential say in our matters of state ? Why do we continue to buckle to their demands ?

More importantly why was Hugh Dallas forced to resign ? Why was Kearney allowed to demand his resignation.

At times I wonder if our whole nation is in a state of total unconsciousness.

This was a joke about the leader of a church which across 2 continents has been involved in the systematic abuse, and cover up of children. Furthermore when the victims started to come forward they were subjected to bullying, intimidation and manipulation in order to keep them silent.

http://www.boston.com/globe/spotlight/abuse/

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/nov/2...and-child-abuse

However on a personal level the subject of the Dallas e mail is himself accused by several hundred victims of being complicit in a cover up.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/8587082.stm

So just how does Kearney or anyone else from the Catholic Church for that matter, feel they can take any kind of moral high ground ? The apologies they have made publicly to the thousands of victims of their abuse are considerably shallow when you realise they have often failed to take action against even those convicted of child abuse.

http://thelede.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/09/1...priests-in-u-k/

Lies, cover ups, child abuse, silencing victims, cruelty across 2 continents of our world and yet they seem to retain some kind of moral authority in this small country of ours. What an utter embarrassment. Im ashamed to be a Scotsman.

But it doesn’t stop there. For in a 3rd continent they have spreading lies which have resulted in the deaths of thousands of Africans, and such lies were the subject of a BBC Panaroma documentary.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programmes/panorama/3844945.stm

Can there be anything more despicable than the crimes this organisation have carried out across 3 continents of our world ?

Lorraine Boettner in her book Calvinism in History said “Knox made Calvinism the religion of Scotland, and Calvinism made Scotland the moral standard for the world.”

If we are the “moral standard” then God help the rest of the world.

[ELNick 0]

thing is it's not just Scotland that the catholic church wield an unhealthy position of power. This is a global matter that is endemic throughout the world. Wake up people and do your research.

[D'Artagnan 13,319]

thing is it's not just Scotland that the catholic church wield an unhealthy position of power. This is a global matter that is endemic throughout the world. Wake up people and do your research.

Yes but this is a country which only has a Catholic population of about 16%.

[ELNick 0]

Yes but this is a country which only has a Catholic population of about 16%.

May only 16% of the popultion but I'd wager the media percentage is far more than 16%? Open to debate

[D'Artagnan 13,319]

May only 16% of the popultion but I'd wager the media percentage is far more than 16%? Open to debate

Id agree 100% with you on that one.

[ELNick 0]

Id agree 100% with you on that one.

Glad we're in agreement Good post BTW

[eastcoastbear 122]

Morning D'Art.

I said to BLUEDIGNITY in a text the other day that maybe the Orange Order should become political. Not sure if they've tried this in the past?

The majority of this country needs a voice and leader to counter the RC influence and power and I reckon the OO should be striving to be that leader.

[Ozblue 4,332]

You're pretty well on the money,D'Artagnan and it makes good reading.

It is a total disgrace that Kearney and his organisation can interfere in a sport...or in politics, but if he want's to play that game where his Church can influence a sacking of a sporting body, I'd be high~tailing it to my local MSP to register my disgust and objection about all this.

Now I never saw the film,"One flew over the Cuckoo's nest" but I can tell you with cetainty that it seems that the lunatics have certainly taken over the Asylum in this case.

[D'Artagnan 13,319]

Morning D'Art.

I said to BLUEDIGNITY in a text the other day that maybe the Orange Order should become political. Not sure if they've tried this in the past?

The majority of this country needs a voice and leader to counter the RC influence and power and I reckon the OO should be striving to be that leader.

Morning EC

Nope - it would be manipulated as extreme sectarianism on the part of the OO.

That counter you speak of is indeed needed - it should be coming from every fair minded Scots politician and also the Church of Scotland.

[ELNick 0]

Morning EC

Nope - it would be manipulated as extreme sectarianism on the part of the OO.

That counter you speak of is indeed needed - it should be coming from every fair minded Scots politician and also the Church of Scotland.

Do you not think that by involving the Church of Scotland we are lowering ourselves to the the level of those who should not be mentioned?

Fair minded politicians I feel are few and far between and too scared to put their heads above the parapet.. I think OUR club should be driving this forward and tryto put religion behind us?

[SirWalterSmithLegend 206]

Excellent post D

[Gaffbear 4,104]

The vast majority of people in this land need to stand up and be heard.

If your local MP is influenced by the RCC then don't vote for them,vote for someone else..Keep them out of power and that hopefully will start the ball rolling.

People in Scotland vote blindly...oh ma family are Labour so am labour."what's their policies Mr McShamrock"..dunno a just know ma Da telt me they were good Tims.That's the mentality we deal with but Protestants aren't any better.At times we are guilty of voting for who our father voted for without looking deeper into the snowball effects of voting for the likes of Jim Murphy and his ilk will be.

Vote the SNP and Labour out of this country and take the RCC's voice and influence away from them.

[yellowcross 5]

From One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest:

“The flock gets sight of a spot of blood on some chicken and they all go to peckin' at it, see, till they rip the chicken to shreds, blood and bones and feathers. But usually a couple of the flock gets spotted in the fracas, then it's their turn. And a few more gets spots and gets pecked to death, and more and more. Oh, a peckin' party can wipe out the whole flock in a matter of a few hours, buddy, I seen it. A mighty awesome sight...”

Scottish Fitba is in the middle of a 'pecking party' started by the Celtic Minded.

We must be crazy to be in a looney bin like this!

[BLUE CYCLOPS 26]

Excellwnt post DA. Like you I have been feeling a measure of disquiet for some time now about events in

Scotland. I am not Scottish and have no direct knowledge of what is happening but there is a bad smell

coming out of Scottish society.

Last year, the C of E Archbishops in their Christmas message declared that New Labour were "Morally

corrupr".

I remarked some time ago that a very large percentage of New Labours ruling elite were Scottish.

This is not an attack on the Labour Party or Scottish people, but there has been a very noticeable drop in

the morallity of Scottish politics since the New Labour project got going.

That moral dubiousness has spread to Scottish football as well now and the same New Labour opinion formers

are the people in power at the one club at the centre of recent events.

I am very surprised that no one thought to point out the comparisions between Celtic? Catholic view of

events and the reality on the ground.

One event in particular blows all Celtic/ Catholic propaganda out of the water---- the Popes visit.

I watch on TV the Popes arrival in Scotland and his meeting with the faithfull in Glasgow.

What I saw were thousands of Catholics (Scottish and Irish since the crowd contained many Irish tricolours

and Celtic jerseys) walking down a public road in Glasgow to celebrate their faith and culture.

This event was facilitated and funded by the 94% non-Catholic population of the UK.

This crowd was shown on TV to walk the public highway unchallenged, unthreatened and was not attacked.

Compare that with the repeated scenes we see every year on TV when the minority Protestant community in

Ireland want to celebrate their Faith and culture. Every year we see the same Irish tricolours and Celtic

jerseys response to a Protestant parade on the public highway. But no one in the media has the moral

courage to report, or the intelligence to see, the obvious difference between the two events.

Like the OP, I dispair that Scotland seems to have lost its way.

[Bluepeter9 5,167]

One could be forgiven for confusing the scenes surrounding Scottish football in the last few weeks with a scene from One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest. But amidst all the hullabaloo one fact shines above all...a total miscarriage of justice.

Scottish football should be ashamed of itself. No strike that.....the whole of Scotland should wake up tomorrow morning and be utterly ashamed of itself.

Once again we have overreacted to the bullies. Yes Dougie MacDonalds position probably was untenable after he told lies....but ask yourself what kind of pressure has been exerted on our referees by a particular football club that forced him into a position where he felt he had to lie to vindicate himself ?

But it gets worse. Far worse. So Hugh Dallas forwarded an e-mail which poked fun at the visiting pontiff....suddenly according to Peter Kearney, director of the Scottish Catholic Media Office, the e-mail was an example of "deep, wide and vicious anti-Catholic hostility".

Once again Scotland has acquiesced to the paranoia of Celtic Football and the Catholic Church. And there lies our shame as a nation.

How long are we going to allow them to perpetuate these myths ?

Rangers football club and their support have all too often been victims of these two organisations paranoia. Who can forget Cardinal Keith O'Briens opening statement at the anti-sectarian summit a few years ago when he accused Protestants of indulging in a fictious game of "Punch a pape" ?

This is the same Cardinal who suggested Catholic priests guilty of child abuse were in need of "spiritual counselling" rather face the law of the land. He is also the same fellow who suggested that gays were akin to paedophiles. Those in glass houses.....

This paranoia and myth has been perpetuated, and more importantaly tolerated, for far too long in this country.

Unfortunately for Kearney and O'Brien the facts do not fit squarely with the picture they are trying to paint. Those in the academic world have taken their accusations and totally destroyed them, much to the dismay of those who jumped on MaConnell's phoney "Scotlands Secret Shame", such as Nil By Mouth. Prof Steve Bruce of Aberdeen University has demonstrated through academic study and research that this myth is nothing other than a complete fabrication.

http://news.scotsman...rian.2603272.jp

What is even more alarming was a Sunday Herald survey a few years back in Holyrood which showed that 91% of Scottish MSP's felt the Catholic Church had an unhealthy influence in Scottish politics.

Why do we allow this Church such an influential say in our matters of state ? Why do we continue to buckle to their demands ?

More importantly why was Hugh Dallas forced to resign ? Why was Kearney allowed to demand his resignation.

At times I wonder if our whole nation is in a state of total unconsciousness.

This was a joke about the leader of a church which across 2 continents has been involved in the systematic abuse, and cover up of children. Furthermore when the victims started to come forward they were subjected to bullying, intimidation and manipulation in order to keep them silent.

http://www.boston.co...potlight/abuse/

http://www.guardian....and-child-abuse

However on a personal level the subject of the Dallas e mail is himself accused by several hundred victims of being complicit in a cover up.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/8587082.stm

So just how does Kearney or anyone else from the Catholic Church for that matter, feel they can take any kind of moral high ground ? The apologies they have made publicly to the thousands of victims of their abuse are considerably shallow when you realise they have often failed to take action against even those convicted of child abuse.

http://thelede.blogs...priests-in-u-k/

Lies, cover ups, child abuse, silencing victims, cruelty across 2 continents of our world and yet they seem to retain some kind of moral authority in this small country of ours. What an utter embarrassment. Im ashamed to be a Scotsman.

But it doesn't stop there. For in a 3rd continent they have spreading lies which have resulted in the deaths of thousands of Africans, and such lies were the subject of a BBC Panaroma documentary.

http://news.bbc.co.u...ama/3844945.stm

Can there be anything more despicable than the crimes this organisation have carried out across 3 continents of our world ?

Lorraine Boettner in her book Calvinism in History said "Knox made Calvinism the religion of Scotland, and Calvinism made Scotland the moral standard for the world."

If we are the "moral standard" then God help the rest of the world.

... I agree with all the sentimemnts expressed against the Catholic church in your article.

I also agree the actions of sacking Hugh Dallas was a gross overreaction.

But this article and the power the Church weilds or tries to weild strengthens my conviction that footballl and religions dont mix and Scotland is the only country in the world where the boundaries are allowed to be so blurred. I am sure you came on to discuss the stupidness of the SFA in its actions and the unsportsman like behavior of Celtic... but you turned it into a rant (justified or not) against the Catholic Church.

Its why we need to widen the gaps between religion and football. Its why I advocate a change in our support to get away from the religios ties - it does the sport nor our club any good. The Catholic church should be brought to task for its many ills - but not in the name of Football and not in the name of Rangers.

[caseyjones 3,009]

Voting for Labour or the SNP is a vote for the increase in influence wielded by the RC church. The Scottish people have got the society that they elected.

Thank God I don't live in that shitty country anymore.

[gunslinger 270]

things like this where they moralise and exert influence in normal life will alienate them.

they are already a dying race worldwide and things like this only accelerate it.

[Pete_Rangers 9]

Excellwnt post DA. Like you I have been feeling a measure of disquiet for some time now about events in

Scotland. I am not Scottish and have no direct knowledge of what is happening but there is a bad smell

coming out of Scottish society.

Last year, the C of E Archbishops in their Christmas message declared that New Labour were "Morally

corrupr".

I remarked some time ago that a very large percentage of New Labours ruling elite were Scottish.

This is not an attack on the Labour Party or Scottish people, but there has been a very noticeable drop in

the morallity of Scottish politics since the New Labour project got going.

That moral dubiousness has spread to Scottish football as well now and the same New Labour opinion formers

are the people in power at the one club at the centre of recent events.

I am very surprised that no one thought to point out the comparisions between Celtic? Catholic view of

events and the reality on the ground.

One event in particular blows all Celtic/ Catholic propaganda out of the water---- the Popes visit.

I watch on TV the Popes arrival in Scotland and his meeting with the faithfull in Glasgow.

What I saw were thousands of Catholics (Scottish and Irish since the crowd contained many Irish tricolours

and Celtic jerseys) walking down a public road in Glasgow to celebrate their faith and culture.

This event was facilitated and funded by the 94% non-Catholic population of the UK.

This crowd was shown on TV to walk the public highway unchallenged, unthreatened and was not attacked.

Compare that with the repeated scenes we see every year on TV when the minority Protestant community in

Ireland want to celebrate their Faith and culture. Every year we see the same Irish tricolours and Celtic

jerseys response to a Protestant parade on the public highway. But no one in the media has the moral

courage to report, or the intelligence to see, the obvious difference between the two events.

Like the OP, I dispair that Scotland seems to have lost its way.

Spot on mate.

[covenanter 158]

Voting for Labour or the SNP is a vote for the increase in influence wielded by the RC church. The Scottish people have got the society that they elected.

Thank God I don't live in that shitty country anymore.

The up and coming leading light in the Scottish Tory party is Paul McBride QC. Yep, that Paul McBride QC that was all over the BBC on Monday, claiming to be close to ra Sellik board and articulating their quiet vindication.

It's not about a particular political party. Pick any party and do what the guys in Pumpherston did, join the local party in power and work to deselect the sitting Yahoo MP, MSP, MEP, Counsellor. Jim Devine would provide testement to the effectiveness of such a method.

As for Dart's post, nail on the head.

[CanadianBacon 2,088]

Excellent post D'Artagnan. It looks like both you and Bro Leggat are singing from the same hymn sheet.

I agree with others who say that the Orange Order needs to become a political animal.

They'd better dive in before its too late - the next move will be to stop them parading at any time and the freedoms our forefathers fought for will be no more.

Sadly the Church of Scotland has lost its way and its 'let's be pals together' stance with the largest paedophile organisation in the world is sickening in the extreme.

The Covenanters will be spinning in their graves.

[TravelingWilBEARy 4,319]

I think Dallas would have been sacked even without the intervention from the Catholic Church in Scotland. His utter stupidity made his position untenable.

[royalbluebell 38]

I think Dallas would have been sacked even without the intervention from the Catholic Church in Scotland. His utter stupidity made his position untenable.

The Roman Catholic Church weren't leaving anything to chance though were they?

[TravelingWilBEARy 4,319]

The Roman Catholic Church weren't leaving anything to chance though were they?

It had absolutely no class about it. He was already on the way out, no need to hit him with that final punch. They should take a leaf out of Muhammad Ali's book.

[royalbluebell 38]

You've got to hand it to them though. They are masters at turning things around full circle and laying the blame at the feet of others when they've been under the spotlight. In this instance with the referees and with the child rape cases etc. To the Roman Catholic Church it's seems to be far worse to comment or criticise the abusers or those responsible for the cover up than the actual offence.

[D'Artagnan 13,319]

I think Dallas would have been sacked even without the intervention from the Catholic Church in Scotland. His utter stupidity made his position untenable.

Can I ask you TWB why you think his position was untenable. The charge made by Kearney against him is erroneous.

Compare his actions with the likes of Patrick Kielty the comedian/compere. He did a stand up routine for ten minutes where he continually referred to the Catholic church as "the church of kiddyfiddlers" and the pope as the leader of the kiddyfiddlers. The couldnt play the sectarian card against Kielty given he was Roman Catholic.