KingKirk 25,647 Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 Of when we will hear a decision from HMRC...I get the feeling their loving making us sweat. Also what's in our best interests with regards to an outcome.In my opinion I feel it may be better if we don't win it.. As mad as it sounds I think its important we move on..winning the case may not allow this to happen, as HMRC will automatically appeal, could that run for another 18 months?What's in The Rangers best interests?Opinions Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
54andcounting 627 Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 FFs!!!!! Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ylfb 21 Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 Am totally lost with everything thats going on now Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
spireblue 229 Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 Of when we will hear a decision from HMRC...I get the feeling their loving making us sweat. Also what's in our best interests with regards to an outcome.In my opinion I feel it may be better if we don't win it.. As mad as it sounds I think its important we move on..winning the case may not allow this to happen, as HMRC will automatically appeal, could that run for another 18 months?What's in The Rangers best interests?OpinionsThe decision is not coming from HMRC it is coming from the three judges who heard the case,HMRC will be sweating on the outcome the same as us,but obviously not to such a great degree.HMRC DO NOT HAVE A DECISION TO MAKE.Their decision wil be whether to accept the judges ruling or not. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
4MenHadADream 122 Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 Of when we will hear a decision from HMRC...I get the feeling their loving making us sweat. Also what's in our best interests with regards to an outcome.In my opinion I feel it may be better if we don't win it.. As mad as it sounds I think its important we move on..winning the case may not allow this to happen, as HMRC will automatically appeal, could that run for another 18 months?What's in The Rangers best interests?OpinionsThe decision is not coming from HMRC, but the First Tier Tribunal judges have as long as they need to make a decision, so theoretically it could be months yet . On your other point, I agree, I think the best case scenario for us now would be a minor loss, in the region of £10m, one where the issue would be sorted, but we should hopefully be able to agree a CVA, as opposed to the potential for further months of uncertainty.The short answer is that I don't think anyone knows when a decision will be forthcoming, other than those directly involved with the FTT Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxdoblo 26 Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 I'm might be wrong but I'm sure at the time of the tribunal in January I read that the judges had to make their decision within 90 days. And the 90 days are up tomorrow. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RFC55 108,937 Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 I'm might be wrong but I'm sure at the time of the tribunal in January I read that the judges had to make their decision within 90 days. And the 90 days are up tomorrow.90 days were up on the 17th mate! However the fact that it hasn't been settled now tells me that HMRC's case is not as clear cut as many papes hoped Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikhailichenko 90 Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 As far as I am aware the only party that has raised the idea of HMRC automatically appealing if we win is a certain Mr Craig Whyte Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxdoblo 26 Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 90 days were up on the 17th mate! However the fact that it hasn't been settled now tells me that HMRC's case is not as clear cut as many papes hopedEven if HMRC's case is not strong it surely doesn't take 3 judges 90days to come to a verdict?! Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RFC55 108,937 Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 If its anything like criminal law, if there is a shred of doubt then they can't find us guilty, SDM, AJ and shyte were all confident of winning so here's hoping!After this I can get back to singing no nuns priests nor holy water Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bakbear 3,586 Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 I fundamentally cannot understand how any buyer can reach an agreement to buy the club until this BTC is resolved.If the buyer agrees a CVA pot of 20 million and then they are awarded ownership of Rangers, their 20 Million is gone to creditors. If the Tribunal judges then find in favour of the HMRC we are back to square one. If we reach agreement through a CVA with HMRC that addresses the BTC and leave us with no future liability then fine but surely with all the people that are due money from us, all the creditors are not going to be able to reach a settlement out of 20 million after HMRC have had their say. Plus why should we pay out against a case that has not been resolved? Why would any legitimate creditor accept a reduced share of the CVA pot due to us settling with HMRC for a case that we might yet win....confused.comI really don't see how we can move forward without the BTC being closed out Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxdoblo 26 Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 I think this is why it's taken the administrators so long. I think they thought a decision would have been reached by now. How can they possibly get a new owner if they don't know the result of the BTC. I fundamentally cannot understand how any buyer can reach an agreement to buy the club until this BTC is resolved.If the buyer agrees a CVA pot of 20 million and then they are awarded ownership of Rangers, their 20 Million is gone to creditors. If the Tribunal judges then find in favour of the HMRC we are back to square one. If we reach agreement through a CVA with HMRC that addresses the BTC and leave us with no future liability then fine but surely with all the people that are due money from us, all the creditors are not going to be able to reach a settlement out of 20 million after HMRC have had their say. Plus why should we pay out against a case that has not been resolved? Why would any legitimate creditor accept a reduced share of the CVA pot due to us settling with HMRC for a case that we might yet win....confused.comI really don't see how we can move forward without the BTC being closed out Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spectre 1,663 Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 If its anything like criminal law, if there is a shred of doubt then they can't find us guilty, SDM, AJ and shyte were all confident of winning so here's hoping!After this I can get back to singing no nuns priests nor holy water It's not unfortunately. The decision has to be made only on the balance of probabilities, not beyond reasonable doubt. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
iconicman 8 Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 It's not unfortunately. The decision has to be made only on the balance of probabilities, not beyond reasonable doubt.I don't believe that is strictly true. Yes, in general civil cases the burden of proof is on the balance of probabilities and not beyond reasonable doubt.However, tax law is something else. It might look like a duck, quack like a duck and smell like a duck, but if you've got the legal letter that says it's a swan....Tax specialists make their money by making ducks not be ducks. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MosesMcNeil 1,664 Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 Of when we will hear a decision from HMRC...I get the feeling their loving making us sweat. Also what's in our best interests with regards to an outcome.In my opinion I feel it may be better if we don't win it.. As mad as it soundsAre you taking drugs? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spectre 1,663 Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 I don't believe that is strictly true. Yes, in general civil cases the burden of proof is on the balance of probabilities and not beyond reasonable doubt.However, tax law is something else. It might look like a duck, quack like a duck and smell like a duck, but if you've got the legal letter that says it's a swan....Tax specialists make their money by making ducks not be ducks.Talk of ducks aside, the standard of proof at a first tier tax tribunal is on the balance of probabilities. I wasn't putting forward a guess or an opinion. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gillete 1,338 Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 90 days were up on the 17th mate! However the fact that it hasn't been settled now tells me that HMRC's case is not as clear cut as many papes hopedWe have been saying that for over a year Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricky_ 893 Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 anyone know why is tking so fucking long?are the judges going over EVERY single contract & payment from the EBT's with a fine tooth comb?could it be they are making a decision on each and every payment individually then tallying it all up to see how much is owed? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blumhoilann 6,712 Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 Two thoughts on this.Should Rangers lose the BTC,can the Club sue it's financial advisors?How many clubs have squeaky bums?...including themmins across town. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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