Extra Money from European run and Hutton's transfer

[nvager 498]

Even if we go no further in EUEFA we will stiill bank 20m + 9m from Hutton and WS did not spend all the money available to him in January, then we should have a decent transfer fund and very little debt?

Am I correct in thinking that we should be in a healthy position of having 10m - 15m to spend plus debts reduced to around 10m?

Will this allow us to keep C Cuellar? Surely we can just say - NOT FOR SALE.

Same goes for Boyd and Thomson and we should be able to afford Davis.

We can sell Sebo, Hemdani, Buffel and may collect another 3m or so?

If we also win the SPL title we go straight into the CL pot without any qualifying being necessary too. This must be worth a future 12m - no?

My hope and prayer is that we achieve all this and more and that we can become even more successful next season.

Are my assumptions sound? Does anyone have a really good or better idea of the financial position?

[ricksen_da_best 2,034]

No, not as simple i remember being told on the board before.

[ShanksRFC 3,870]

Muff posted earlier saying if we win the final its 25mil. On top of that 9mil to spend form Huttons transfer gives us 34mil.

Doubt that will all go on transfers but if Walter wants to buy someone, value below 8mil i reckon he will be given the cash.

[Stuart_RFC 41]

Its not a case of all the money we make on transfers and European runs that Walter will have that amount to spend in the transfer market. He will probably have about 10-15M to spend in the summer IMO..and Walter has insisted that he is only signing players that have the quality to directly improve our first 11. No more utility players to steady the ship..we will be going from strength to strength next season

[ricksen_da_best 2,034]

Muff posted earlier saying if we win the final its 25mil. On top of that 9mil to spend form Huttons transfer gives us 34mil.

Doubt that will all go on transfers but if Walter wants to buy someone, value below 8mil i reckon he will be given the cash.

We have already made £20 million.

it was £17.5 million going into the Bremen second leg.

[ShanksRFC 3,870]

We got 2.5mil going into the semis and another 2.5 if we enter the final.

Remember this wont all go on transfers. Yi ken wit Murrays like.

[Craigy 0]

I'm sure the money for transfers will be set aside with bonuses for further progression.

I think that quite a chunk of the money will be used to reduce the debt and pay off interest on it but even then we should make a healthy profit. Add that to the SPL winners looking set to get a automatic Champions League group stage place then financially we are looking really strong just now.

[Jimenez 1]

From what I understand we started the season £16million in debt.

Murray has always said we need to make the CL stages just to break even.

So only taking in to consideration that we've reached the semi finals that's an extra £9million on top of what we need just to balance the books. Add the Alan Hutton money to that and we should see a profit in the region of £18-19million.

I've no idea if the money spent last summer was taking in to consideration before the £16million was quoted.

If it was then we should have a sizable chunk of cash to clear of some of the debt and add more signings to the squad. That's before whatever monies we receive through players leaving during the summer.

I sincerely hope Cuellar isn't a player moved on but if he is then every penny should go straight back in to the team.

[Thermopylae 15,287]

Do we know if the 9 million for Hutton was up front or to be paid in instalments?

[JohnGalbraith 0]

Walter Smith will get the usual 5 or 6 million to spend in the summer, that will be it.

[Jimenez 1]

Walter Smith will get the usual 5 or 6 million to spend in the summer, that will be it.

He got almost double that amount last season.

[JohnGalbraith 0]

Yeah but he had to rebuild a team.

He's went on record as saying he only really needs 2 or 3 players that will challange for a regular first team place.

[Jimenez 1]

Yeah but he had to rebuild a team.

He's went on record as saying he only really needs 2 or 3 players that will challange for a regular first team place.

And you know the fee that he'll be paying for said players?

[MisterC 12,407]

I was saying in the corkerhill social club beofre the Old firm game that we had about 15m to spend based on Huttons move, money not spent, extra euro money, sale of certain players and what WS would have got anyway and I stand by that.

[Jimenez 1]

I was saying in the corkerhill social club beofre the Old firm game that we had about 15m to spend based on Huttons move, money not spent, extra euro money and what WS would have got anyway and I stand by that.

Unless we sell big in the summer then i doubt we'll spend that amount.

Cuellar goes then possibly, but Murray is working furiously to get the accounts in to the black.

I can see us spending around £9million on three players and a couple of Bosmans.

[MisterC 12,407]

I was saying in the corkerhill social club beofre the Old firm game that we had about 15m to spend based on Huttons move, money not spent, extra euro money and what WS would have got anyway and I stand by that.

Unless we sell big in the summer then i doubt we'll spend that amount.

Cuellar goes then possibly, but Murray is working furiously to get the accounts in to the black.

I can see us spending around £9million on three players and a couple of Bosmans.

Hey Jiminez hows it going? You have a valid point there mate, Murrays a typical tightwad Edinburgh bastard at times and for WS to receive as little as that would not surprise me. However, have faith, I have all season and look where its got us!

[JohnGalbraith 0]

Yeah but he had to rebuild a team.

He's went on record as saying he only really needs 2 or 3 players that will challange for a regular first team place.

And you know the fee that he'll be paying for said players?

No-one knows what fee he will be paying, not even Walter himself.

I am going by past experience.

Every year people say "well we never spent anything in January so couple that with X amount we got for Mr X" etc etc

When the bottom line is we probably wont spend big.

[nvager 498]

My guess is we will spend on three quality players plus 2 Bosmans and that 1 player - either Cousin or Cuellar will leave. Hopefully not Cuellar.

[Bluedell 14]

We started off the year with a debt of £16.5m after making a loss of over £6m last season. We then spent in excess of £10m on Cousin, Cuellar, Whittaker, McCulloch and Naismith. This is largely met by the sale of Hutton. Based on the half year accounts, we were looking at making a loss in excess of £2m before the sale of Hutton and the UEFA cup run. If the UEFA cup run has brought us £8m then we are looking at the debt being reduced down to around £10m, still higher than it was in June 2006.

Back of the envelope stuff as I have no idea about the timing of the cash for transfers in and out.

Murray took a risk by spending big last summer without a guaranteed return of CL football. Was he banking on the sale of Hutton, even then? It will be interesting to see if he continues down that route by spending big again, as the cash generated from this season isn't as much as the headlines would lead you to believe.

[dundeebear3 0]

We started off the year with a debt of ?16.5m after making a loss of over ?6m last season. We then spent in excess of ?10m on Cousin, Cuellar, Whittaker, McCulloch and Naismith. This is largely met by the sale of Hutton. Based on the half year accounts, we were looking at making a loss in excess of ?2m before the sale of Hutton and the UEFA cup run. If the UEFA cup run has brought us ?8m then we are looking at the debt being reduced down to around ?10m, still higher than it was in June 2006.

Back of the envelope stuff as I have no idea about the timing of the cash for transfers in and out.

Murray took a risk by spending big last summer without a guaranteed return of CL football. Was he banking on the sale of Hutton, even then? It will be interesting to see if he continues down that route by spending big again, as the cash generated from this season isn't as much as the headlines would lead you to believe.

Some sense.

I doubt Walter will get much over 10 million to spend this summer. 12 million at the very most(if Cousin is sold).

[Bluepeter9 5,167]

I think some of the figuers here are way off the mark and hopelessly optomistic.

The Champions league money is split with Celitc - and is likely to be £5-6M not £10M we all quote - Its about £10M if there is only one team getting the money.

The UEFA Cup Run - cant see it generating £2.5M per stage, more like £1M (Home gate and TV Money - I know the German TV paid about £450k - we turned down bigger money to change KO time.

Yes there is the Hutton cash - not sure how that turns out in cash flow - but if its in stages that must be the norm and we can by in stages so that doea addd £9M.

SDM will use a chunk to reduce debt. (£6M) so we probably have about £10M to spend - but when you look at Cousin, Marcus de Beasley and JCD they did NOT cost the earth and increased the quality. Next seasons cash wont come into it as if we do make CL automatically that cash will be used for the season after to reduce debt buy players.

With WS going on record as looking to add 2 -3 playes of quality that IMPROVE the team and some replacements of utility player likely to go (Hemdani and Buffel for sure, and some deadwood, Faye for one). (I think it is well recognised now that a large pool of players is required) So even although I disagree with some of the figures quoted I do see there being enough cash to improve the quality of the team and reduce the debt. Please remember reducing the debt is a key to making us stronger financialy (and thus on the park) in the future and SDM is correct to reduce the debt while taking care of the team for next year.

[Bluedell 14]

I think some of the figuers here are way off the mark and hopelessly optomistic.

The Champions league money is split with Celitc - and is likely to be £5-6M not £10M we all quote - Its about £10M if there is only one team getting the money.

The UEFA Cup Run - cant see it generating £2.5M per stage, more like £1M (Home gate and TV Money - I know the German TV paid about £450k - we turned down bigger money to change KO time.

Yes there is the Hutton cash - not sure how that turns out in cash flow - but if its in stages that must be the norm and we can by in stages so that doea addd £9M.

SDM will use a chunk to reduce debt. (£6M) so we probably have about £10M to spend - but when you look at Cousin, Marcus de Beasley and JCD they did NOT cost the earth and increased the quality. Next seasons cash wont come into it as if we do make CL automatically that cash will be used for the season after to reduce debt buy players.

With WS going on record as looking to add 2 -3 playes of quality that IMPROVE the team and some replacements of utility player likely to go (Hemdani and Buffel for sure, and some deadwood, Faye for one). (I think it is well recognised now that a large pool of players is required) So even although I disagree with some of the figures quoted I do see there being enough cash to improve the quality of the team and reduce the debt. Please remember reducing the debt is a key to making us stronger financialy (and thus on the park) in the future and SDM is correct to reduce the debt while taking care of the team for next year.

But does the £10m CL cash not include gate receipts?

As for the UEFA Cup, in the QF if we we had 50,000 at £35.00+ then that's £1.75m plus TV money, related commercial cash and UEFA prize money then it's well abiove your £1m.

[Bluepeter9 5,167]

I think some of the figuers here are way off the mark and hopelessly optomistic.

The Champions league money is split with Celitc - and is likely to be £5-6M not £10M we all quote - Its about £10M if there is only one team getting the money.

The UEFA Cup Run - cant see it generating £2.5M per stage, more like £1M (Home gate and TV Money - I know the German TV paid about £450k - we turned down bigger money to change KO time.

Yes there is the Hutton cash - not sure how that turns out in cash flow - but if its in stages that must be the norm and we can by in stages so that doea addd £9M.

SDM will use a chunk to reduce debt. (£6M) so we probably have about £10M to spend - but when you look at Cousin, Marcus de Beasley and JCD they did NOT cost the earth and increased the quality. Next seasons cash wont come into it as if we do make CL automatically that cash will be used for the season after to reduce debt buy players.

With WS going on record as looking to add 2 -3 playes of quality that IMPROVE the team and some replacements of utility player likely to go (Hemdani and Buffel for sure, and some deadwood, Faye for one). (I think it is well recognised now that a large pool of players is required) So even although I disagree with some of the figures quoted I do see there being enough cash to improve the quality of the team and reduce the debt. Please remember reducing the debt is a key to making us stronger financialy (and thus on the park) in the future and SDM is correct to reduce the debt while taking care of the team for next year.

But does the £10m CL cash not include gate receipts?

As for the UEFA Cup, in the QF if we we had 50,000 at £35.00+ then that's £1.75m plus TV money, related commercial cash and UEFA prize money then it's well abiove your £1m.

It is in terms of turnover but not in terms of Profit - and its only the profit we can spend NOT the whole lot - thus I dont think a UEFA leg will add more than £1M to transfer kiity/debt reduction. I just wanted to dampen the thoughts that there was £20M - £25M kicking about (so to speak) for transfers / debt reduction - I dont think it is nearly that high - but still very healthy!

[Bluedell 14]

I think some of the figuers here are way off the mark and hopelessly optomistic.

The Champions league money is split with Celitc - and is likely to be £5-6M not £10M we all quote - Its about £10M if there is only one team getting the money.

The UEFA Cup Run - cant see it generating £2.5M per stage, more like £1M (Home gate and TV Money - I know the German TV paid about £450k - we turned down bigger money to change KO time.

Yes there is the Hutton cash - not sure how that turns out in cash flow - but if its in stages that must be the norm and we can by in stages so that doea addd £9M.

SDM will use a chunk to reduce debt. (£6M) so we probably have about £10M to spend - but when you look at Cousin, Marcus de Beasley and JCD they did NOT cost the earth and increased the quality. Next seasons cash wont come into it as if we do make CL automatically that cash will be used for the season after to reduce debt buy players.

With WS going on record as looking to add 2 -3 playes of quality that IMPROVE the team and some replacements of utility player likely to go (Hemdani and Buffel for sure, and some deadwood, Faye for one). (I think it is well recognised now that a large pool of players is required) So even although I disagree with some of the figures quoted I do see there being enough cash to improve the quality of the team and reduce the debt. Please remember reducing the debt is a key to making us stronger financialy (and thus on the park) in the future and SDM is correct to reduce the debt while taking care of the team for next year.

But does the £10m CL cash not include gate receipts?

As for the UEFA Cup, in the QF if we we had 50,000 at £35.00+ then that's £1.75m plus TV money, related commercial cash and UEFA prize money then it's well abiove your £1m.

It is in terms of turnover but not in terms of Profit - and its only the profit we can spend NOT the whole lot - thus I dont think a UEFA leg will add more than £1M to transfer kiity/debt reduction. I just wanted to dampen the thoughts that there was £20M - £25M kicking about (so to speak) for transfers / debt reduction - I dont think it is nearly that high - but still very healthy!

So what are the costs that reduce the turnover of, say, £2.5m to a profit of £1m? They must be minimal, and nowhere near £1.5m you are suggesting.

I certainly agree that there isn't £20-£25m floating around for transfers/debt reduction as I pointed out in my initial post in this thread, but each round in the UEFA is worth more than £1m.

[dundeebear3 0]

I think some of the figuers here are way off the mark and hopelessly optomistic.

The Champions league money is split with Celitc - and is likely to be £5-6M not £10M we all quote - Its about £10M if there is only one team getting the money.

The UEFA Cup Run - cant see it generating £2.5M per stage, more like £1M (Home gate and TV Money - I know the German TV paid about £450k - we turned down bigger money to change KO time.

Yes there is the Hutton cash - not sure how that turns out in cash flow - but if its in stages that must be the norm and we can by in stages so that doea addd £9M.

SDM will use a chunk to reduce debt. (£6M) so we probably have about £10M to spend - but when you look at Cousin, Marcus de Beasley and JCD they did NOT cost the earth and increased the quality. Next seasons cash wont come into it as if we do make CL automatically that cash will be used for the season after to reduce debt buy players.

With WS going on record as looking to add 2 -3 playes of quality that IMPROVE the team and some replacements of utility player likely to go (Hemdani and Buffel for sure, and some deadwood, Faye for one). (I think it is well recognised now that a large pool of players is required) So even although I disagree with some of the figures quoted I do see there being enough cash to improve the quality of the team and reduce the debt. Please remember reducing the debt is a key to making us stronger financialy (and thus on the park) in the future and SDM is correct to reduce the debt while taking care of the team for next year.

But does the £10m CL cash not include gate receipts?

As for the UEFA Cup, in the QF if we we had 50,000 at £35.00+ then that's £1.75m plus TV money, related commercial cash and UEFA prize money then it's well abiove your £1m.

It is in terms of turnover but not in terms of Profit - and its only the profit we can spend NOT the whole lot - thus I dont think a UEFA leg will add more than £1M to transfer kiity/debt reduction. I just wanted to dampen the thoughts that there was £20M - £25M kicking about (so to speak) for transfers / debt reduction - I dont think it is nearly that high - but still very healthy!

So what are the costs that reduce the turnover of, say, £2.5m to a profit of £1m? They must be minimal, and nowhere near £1.5m you are suggesting.

I certainly agree that there isn't £20-£25m floating around for transfers/debt reduction as I pointed out in my initial post in this thread, but each round in the UEFA is worth more than £1m.

Wages, win bonuses, tax, interest repayments on our debt, player accomodation, travelling expenses for away legs, policing, stewarding and...............................Andy Cameron.

I remember the year Celtic got to the final. There next years financial results werent great. Consensus was that getting all the way to the UEFA final was the financially equivalent to a poorish champions League season. We have had only 4 rounds compared to Celtics umpteen, including 2 moneyspinners against English clubs.