Lamb to the slaughter

[DadoPrso9 7]

Well, he did sing a sectarian song about being up to his knees in Catholics blood, not hard to see why he was sacked, although wasn't there a courtcase that found the sash NON sectarian, so he got away with that? iunno...

So fenian = catholic does it?

[D'Artagnan 13,319]

Well, he did sing a sectarian song about being up to his knees in Catholics blood, not hard to see why he was sacked, although wasn't there a courtcase that found the sash NON sectarian, so he got away with that? iunno...

Well if we want to be accurate...he sang about Fenian Blood rather than Catholic Blood. Given his comments on record over time....and his commtiment to all things British...I quite believe DF was singing about Fenians in the literal term.

As for the Sash....he didnt get away with anything...he sang a song which is popular with our support...and is certainly popular in the circles I move in. It is not sectarian at all....

[Albahighlander 0]

Well, he did sing a sectarian song about being up to his knees in Catholics blood, not hard to see why he was sacked, although wasn't there a courtcase that found the sash NON sectarian, so he got away with that? iunno...

So fenian = catholic does it?

Unfortunately for many in our society DadoPrso9 it does.

[minstral 5,375]

i knew bauba and wreckedroy would be on with their usual stuff about being paranoid,you seem to have a problem with our fans who stick up for the club and who will defend our support.we are deemed as bigots or people who live in the past,well i will tell you something give me the supporters of the past as they are my people and would stick up for our club until their was no breath left in their body plus all the other member of this forum who would do the same,but you two seem to have a problem against our support from the past and i would rather be in the trenches with them than you two if there was a war.

[D'Artagnan 13,319]

Minstral..

I could cope with RNA (Roy No Answers) occasional interjection...if he had the courage or substance to back up his allegations... I have given him plenty of opportunity to do so....

As you have pointed out there are plenty willing to object or disagree with my posts...and that is fine...its all about discussion and debate after all...

Still not being a middle aged medallion man like him.....perhaps my posts ruined his "perfect day"

[Frankie 505]

Always puzzles me how some bears would rather slag off their own fellow fans rather than certain individuals and organisations who unquestionably treat our club and it's members (including you and I) differently from others.

Paranoia is a perception of injustice without evidence.

D'Artagnan's threads always have evidence and always have some interesting points. I don't think he's paranoid, dull or some sort of let down to our dignity. But, if I did, I just wouldn't open his threads.

Maybe his critics should do the same if they are that offended?

[D'Artagnan 13,319]

Always puzzles me how some bears would rather slag off their own fellow fans rather than certain individuals and organisations who unquestionably treat our club and it's members (including you and I) differently from others.

You are not alone Frankie...it puzzles quite a lot of us.

Particularly when they are unable to substantiate their accusations of "paranoia"

But then again...thats the beauty of being Roy No Answers....

"He who runs and hides away...lives to accuse another day"

[minstral 5,375]

Always puzzles me how some bears would rather slag off their own fellow fans rather than certain individuals and organisations who unquestionably treat our club and it's members (including you and I) differently from others.

Paranoia is a perception of injustice without evidence.

D'Artagnan's threads always have evidence and always have some interesting points. I don't think he's paranoid, dull or some sort of let down to our dignity. But, if I did, I just wouldn't open his threads.

Maybe his critics should do the same if they are that offended?

spot on frankie i think d artagnans is one of the best posters on this forum with great threads and not any bigotry among them and the posts he makes get great debates going. :pipeguy:

[ricardopatrese 0]

Always puzzles me how some bears would rather slag off their own fellow fans rather than certain individuals and organisations who unquestionably treat our club and it's members (including you and I) differently from others.

Paranoia is a perception of injustice without evidence.

D'Artagnan's threads always have evidence and always have some interesting points. I don't think he's paranoid, dull or some sort of let down to our dignity. But, if I did, I just wouldn't open his threads.

Maybe his critics should do the same if they are that offended?

Oh for the love of christ, what a load of shit.

The Donald Findlay story was dealt with LONG ago - or are you just fuckin bored Dart? Anyone with half a fuckin brain realised that someone in DF's position (HE'S A QC FOR FUCK SAKE OR DID THAT ESCAPE YOUR ATTENTION!!! An I don't give a crap about the caps this time mate - this threads a crock!) should not have been up there belting out a song about revelling the fact that he is up to his knees in the blood of slaughtered irishmen.

DF realiseed himself the seriousness of the situation when he resigned his post at RFC within days - he did not have a case to answer - just like your stupid thread.

Move on.

[californiadreamin52 339]

Always puzzles me how some bears would rather slag off their own fellow fans rather than certain individuals and organisations who unquestionably treat our club and it's members (including you and I) differently from others.

Fortunately we are individuals with differing opinions

Paranoia is a perception of injustice without evidence.

I thought it was only tims who were paranoid

D'Artagnan's threads always have evidence and always have some interesting points. I don't think he's paranoid, dull or some sort of let down to our dignity. But, if I did, I just wouldn't open his threads.

Same old hoary chestnut recycled for the umpteenth time

Maybe his critics should do the same if they are that offended?

[Frankie 505]

It maybe is an old story but it's yet another symptom of differing ways certain issues are treated my certain sections of the media. That makes it interesting im my book especially considering the media impartiality topic is often high on the agenda in every Rangers forum I visit.

That's the thing about forums. They are there for people to talk about things that appeal to them.

Obviously, at the same time, no-one forces anyone to talk/read about anything they don't want to.

[minstral 5,375]

Always puzzles me how some bears would rather slag off their own fellow fans rather than certain individuals and organisations who unquestionably treat our club and it's members (including you and I) differently from others.

Paranoia is a perception of injustice without evidence.

D'Artagnan's threads always have evidence and always have some interesting points. I don't think he's paranoid, dull or some sort of let down to our dignity. But, if I did, I just wouldn't open his threads.

Maybe his critics should do the same if they are that offended?

Oh for the love of christ, what a load of shit.

The Donald Findlay story was dealt with LONG ago - or are you just fuckin bored Dart? Anyone with half a fuckin brain realised that someone in DF's position (HE'S A QC FOR FUCK SAKE OR DID THAT ESCAPE YOUR ATTENTION!!! An I don't give a crap about the caps this time mate - this threads a crock!) should not have been up there belting out a song about revelling the fact that he is up to his knees in the blood of slaughtered irishmen.

DF realiseed himself the seriousness of the situation when he resigned his post at RFC within days - he did not have a case to answer - just like your stupid thread.

Move on.

if you dont like the post dont read it,if the man was in a private club singing then it has nothing do do with anybody,and it was a so called rangers fan who went to the papers with the story.

[D'Artagnan 13,319]

Always puzzles me how some bears would rather slag off their own fellow fans rather than certain individuals and organisations who unquestionably treat our club and it's members (including you and I) differently from others.

Paranoia is a perception of injustice without evidence.

D'Artagnan's threads always have evidence and always have some interesting points. I don't think he's paranoid, dull or some sort of let down to our dignity. But, if I did, I just wouldn't open his threads.

Maybe his critics should do the same if they are that offended?

Oh for the love of christ, what a load of shit.

The Donald Findlay story was dealt with LONG ago - or are you just fuckin bored Dart? Anyone with half a fuckin brain realised that someone in DF's position (HE'S A QC FOR FUCK SAKE OR DID THAT ESCAPE YOUR ATTENTION!!! An I don't give a crap about the caps this time mate - this threads a crock!) should not have been up there belting out a song about revelling the fact that he is up to his knees in the blood of slaughtered irishmen.

DF realiseed himself the seriousness of the situation when he resigned his post at RFC within days - he did not have a case to answer - just like your stupid thread.

Move on.

Pardon me Ricardo for interjecting on your rant....

But Donald himself regrets his resignation.

[Frankie 505]

Always puzzles me how some bears would rather slag off their own fellow fans rather than certain individuals and organisations who unquestionably treat our club and it's members (including you and I) differently from others.

Fortunately we are individuals with differing opinions

Paranoia is a perception of injustice without evidence.

I thought it was only tims who were paranoid

D'Artagnan's threads always have evidence and always have some interesting points. I don't think he's paranoid, dull or some sort of let down to our dignity. But, if I did, I just wouldn't open his threads.

Same old hoary chestnut recycled for the umpteenth time

Maybe his critics should do the same if they are that offended?

1. Yes, and we should afford each other the respect of those different opinions without reporting to swear words and personal insults...

2. No, it's not only tims that are paranoid. Id say many Rangers fans are - but I'd also say many fans including D'Artagnan make many valid points with the evidence to show that they are NOT paranoid.

3. Yes, and it's just as valid. Do you like 'Loose Women' on ITV? Probably not, so I bet you don't watch it.

[D'Artagnan 13,319]

California...the floor is yours...

Tell me what same old hairy chestnut manifests itself and I promise to answer.

[ricardopatrese 0]

Always puzzles me how some bears would rather slag off their own fellow fans rather than certain individuals and organisations who unquestionably treat our club and it's members (including you and I) differently from others.

Paranoia is a perception of injustice without evidence.

D'Artagnan's threads always have evidence and always have some interesting points. I don't think he's paranoid, dull or some sort of let down to our dignity. But, if I did, I just wouldn't open his threads.

Maybe his critics should do the same if they are that offended?

Oh for the love of christ, what a load of shit.

The Donald Findlay story was dealt with LONG ago - or are you just fuckin bored Dart? Anyone with half a fuckin brain realised that someone in DF's position (HE'S A QC FOR FUCK SAKE OR DID THAT ESCAPE YOUR ATTENTION!!! An I don't give a crap about the caps this time mate - this threads a crock!) should not have been up there belting out a song about revelling the fact that he is up to his knees in the blood of slaughtered irishmen.

DF realiseed himself the seriousness of the situation when he resigned his post at RFC within days - he did not have a case to answer - just like your stupid thread.

Move on.

if you dont like the post dont read it,if the man was in a private club singing then it has nothing do do with anybody,and it was a so called rangers fan who went to the papers with the story.

If I don't like the thread then don't read it?

Are you being serious?

My, what objective conversation we would get on here then wouldn't we?

Is that a bit like "if you don't like lyrics like 'up to your knees in fenian blood' then don't got to Rangersa games?"

Cant wait.

[ricardopatrese 0]

Always puzzles me how some bears would rather slag off their own fellow fans rather than certain individuals and organisations who unquestionably treat our club and it's members (including you and I) differently from others.

Fortunately we are individuals with differing opinions

Paranoia is a perception of injustice without evidence.

I thought it was only tims who were paranoid

D'Artagnan's threads always have evidence and always have some interesting points. I don't think he's paranoid, dull or some sort of let down to our dignity. But, if I did, I just wouldn't open his threads.

Same old hoary chestnut recycled for the umpteenth time

Maybe his critics should do the same if they are that offended?

1. Yes, and we should afford each other the respect of those different opinions without reporting to swear words and personal insults...

2. No, it's not only tims that are paranoid. Id say many Rangers fans are - but I'd also say many fans including D'Artagnan make many valid points with the evidence to show that they are NOT paranoid.

3. Yes, and it's just as valid. Do you like 'Loose Women' on ITV? Probably not, so I bet you don't watch it.

Frankie, Im sure if you ever had a point to make, I would find it offensive.

:pipeguy:

[leftyger 0]

What has the statement of A Roman Catholic Bishop got to do with Donald Findlay and Rangers?

The Billy Boys didn't just become sectarian and offensive when UEFA said it was. It has always been a sectarian song. The dictionary definition of Fenian includes:

3. (Derogatory, offensive) an Irish Catholic or a person of Irish Catholic descent Collins dictionary

Donald Findlay knew this as well as the next man. He also knew sectarian songs were unacceptable at Ibrox - only few weeks before the incident he had an article in the Rangers News condemning fans for altering the words to simply the best and explaining this was why the club had to drop it.

He should have resigned because of hypocrisy , let alone sing sectarian songs.

Hey listen ....lets have some real bigotted comments........just so we know the difference.

"O’Brien warns of ‘moral collapse’

Gillian Bowditch and Kathleen Nutt

DEVOLUTION is causing the moral disintegration of Scotland, with the passing of gay rights legislation a potential “slippery slope†to the legalisation of paedophilia and bestiality, according to the leader of the country’s Roman Catholics.

Cardinal Keith O’Brien has launched his most outspoken attack yet on Jack McConnell’s government, accusing it of presiding over the moral “destruction of societyâ€.

He blames ministers, equipped with the freedom devolution has given them, to pass laws for which they have no mandate. He claims measures such as gay adoption and same-sex civil partnerships are opposed by the majority of Scots.

“I would certainly say we are working towards the destruction of any sort of moral standards,†he said. “It doesn’t seem to be going at quite the same speed in other places.

“We don’t want this in our country. We’ve gone far enough and we can’t go any further with the destruction of society. The moral tone of our country has gone downhill.â€

O’Brien said he raised the issue of gay legislation with a group of MSPs at Holyrood recently, adding: “One person contradicted me and said, ‘No. That’s it now, we can’t go any worse’. I said, ‘What about paedophiles? There’s a paedophile party on the Continent. What if that is what everybody likes?’

“What if a man likes little girls? Can he adopt a little girl then and just have a little girl at home? Where are we going with this?’ I even mentioned bestiality. This is of intense worry to me. We’re just going down a slippery slope.â€

The cardinal’s remarks reflect a growing chasm between the Catholic Church and the Labour party, just weeks after he gave his backing to independence.

Tim Hopkins, a policy worker at the Equality Network, said: “Comparing homosexuality with paedophilia and bestiality is just an absurd, disgusting and inhuman thing to say about his fellow citizens and he should be thoroughly ashamed himself.â€

Peter Tatchell, spokesman for Outrage!, the gay human rights group, said: “The cardinal is a very sad, sick man. His scaremongering and demonisation, comparing gay couples to paedophiles and animal abusers, is deeply immoral.

“It is not what we expect from someone who claims to be motivated by the gospel of Jesus Christ of love and compassion.

“Since England and Wales allowed same-sex couples to jointly adopt and foster since 2003, there have been no complaints, no abuse and no problems.

“Lesbian and gay couples have provided loving and caring homes for children in desperate need. The cardinal should think about children first and forget his own miserable prejudices.â€

O’Brien has been a persistent critic of the Holyrood bill proposing to allow same-sex couples to adopt jointly. The bill is due to have its final reading in parliament on Thursday, and is set to come into force next spring. A number of amendments are due to be lodged against the proposal allowing same-sex adoption, but with Labour and Liberal Democrat party whips expected to instruct their MSPs to support the bill, it is unlikely to meet sufficient opposition.

O’Brien’s predecessor, Cardinal Thomas Winning, described gay sex as “perverted†and was instrumental in the campaign to block the repeal of section 28, which banned the promotion of homosexuality in schools.

A spokesman for Jack McConnell, the first minister, said: “The cardinal is entitled to his views. He has made them known to MSPs and in return MSPs have made theirs known to the cardinal in a number of meetings.â€

But alas...suprisingly I cant offer you any witchhunt on this one.

But dont believe me....go and do a google search...

Type in Cardinal O'Brien and then do the same search on Donald Findlay...

Tell me which set of results features the word bigot more....

[Frankie 505]

Well then, let's make a constructive attempt at debate.

1. Why did the media treat the Hartson/Pearson issue differently?

2. Why didn't Celtic fine their players?

3. Why didn't their players resign in the same way as Donald Findlay?

A topic doesn't have to be brand new to be worth dicussing again and approaching from a different angle. How many times do we read posts about favorite players and what have you?

Most of us ignore them without the same grief and insults.

[Frankie 505]

Frankie, Im sure if you ever had a point to make, I would find it offensive.

:pipeguy:

Sorry you've lost me?

Are you saying I have never had a point to make on here? And if I did, it was offensive?

[D'Artagnan 13,319]

If I don't like the thread then don't read it?

Are you being serious?

Lets be honest Ricardo....you are a D'Artagnan groupie.

You could not have a rant without me.

[ricardopatrese 0]

Well then, let's make a constructive attempt at debate.

1. Why did the media treat the Hartson/Pearson issue differently? Did you see the video? I did. They didn't sing. Anyone that tells you they did is lying - the two of them were models of self-restraint much as I hate to admit. And they were surrounded by sellick fans. I had to admire it in them - twats.

2. Why didn't Celtic fine their players? They didn't sing. Anyone that tells you they did is lying - the two of them were models of self-restraint much as I hate to admit. And they were surrounded by sellick fans. I had to admire it in them - twats.

3. Why didn't their players resign in the same way as Donald Findlay? They didn't sing. Anyone that tells you they did is lying - the two of them were models of self-restraint much as I hate to admit. And they were surrounded by sellick fans. I had to admire it in them - twats.

A topic doesn't have to be brand new to be worth dicussing again and approaching from a different angle. How many times do we read posts about favorite players and what have you? Yes it does if it was full of shit the first time and not worth repeating.

Most of us ignore them without the same grief and insults.

Tough.

[Frankie 505]

Tough.

So, Stephen Pearson didn't cup his hand and shout IRA...? And the 2 players, acted very well - standing there instead of walking off stage disgusted - most restrained of them!

[ricardopatrese 0]

If I don't like the thread then don't read it?

Are you being serious?

Lets be honest Ricardo....you are a D'Artagnan groupie.

You could not have a rant without me.

that's why i spend so much time on the old firm board!

[D'Artagnan 13,319]

What has the statement of A Roman Catholic Bishop got to do with Donald Findlay and Rangers?

The Billy Boys didn't just become sectarian and offensive when UEFA said it was. It has always been a sectarian song. The dictionary definition of Fenian includes:

3. (Derogatory, offensive) an Irish Catholic or a person of Irish Catholic descent Collins dictionary

Donald Findlay knew this as well as the next man. He also knew sectarian songs were unacceptable at Ibrox - only few weeks before the incident he had an article in the Rangers News condemning fans for altering the words to simply the best and explaining this was why the club had to drop it.

He should have resigned because of hypocrisy , let alone sing sectarian songs.

Fenian

1. a member of an Irish revolutionary organization founded in New York in 1858, which worked for the establishment of an independent Irish republic.

2. (in late Irish legends) a member of a group of warriors always ready to defend Ireland against its enemies.

Not the dictiionary I looked up Lefty.