Statement released by former RST Secretary

[Ace 3,556]

Can i ask a serious question here ?

If the RST want to be seen as an open and honest organisation, especially in light of the recent "stramash", why doesn't it hold an EGM which is open to the general public ?

Nothing exposes hypocrisy and dodgy dealing more than shining a big public searchlight into the darkness that is claim & counter claim.

I am sure there will be responses of "It would be invaded by the scum" ... well, the SCUM's own trust is about to host it's own AGM whgich is a public forum for all, including non-members (as detailed on KDS .. that's how i know BTW !!), so they seem to have no fear of the reverse and why would you want to anyway.

I love the idea of the trust, i love the idea of fans getting together to put the supporters point of view directly to the club via an elected body (I, personally, am the chair of my son's school Parent Council so appreciate the working of committee's).

This organisation has the power to be a force for good for the fans but at the moment it is myred in a swamp of insinuations, claims, counterclaims, myths & a very poor reputation within the body of the people it claims to represent.

I would actually love to attend a meeting of this organisation, i would love to hear the passion of open debate where those who have real issues can put their points to those who they have those issue's with. That is the only way to stop this inscecent bickering that is travelling across 4 major Rangers forums representing 1,000's of us normal fans.

Please RST (there are obviously people on here from there), i would love an honest answer to this.

[Poetry_In_Blue 1,043]

In the same way that downloading a torrent, giving out a copy of a DVD etc is, only less severe.

Pretty flimsy imo.

Such a flimsy post to once again try and deflect from the real issues which people had been wanting answered.

It feels like there is a tag team going on here, one person starts to post responses then they die away and then someone else starts.

[BeasleysBaccyPipe 0]

Such a flimsy post to once again try and deflect from the real issues which people had been wanting answered.

It feels like there is a tag team going on here, one person starts to post responses then they die away and then someone else starts.

I just don't understand why the thread is still going on. We're talking about fellow fans doing voluntary work in their own time and slamming them for mistakes that have been born out of goodwill.

In no small part down to the rivalry between the sites in question etc.

I also posted in the thread to get an answer to my questions to Wilhelm/Adoniram as well.

[Dennis 1,011]

In the same way that downloading a torrent, giving out a copy of a DVD etc is, only less severe.

Pretty flimsy imo.

you did'nt know if it was illegal, well you have just been told it is.

The difference is, If I "download a torrent", that is my responsibility. If the board of the RST do something illegal, then all the RST members suffer and are more than entitled to ask questions, no matter how toe curling they are.

[Orangeclement 580]

I just don't understand why the thread is still going on. We're talking about fellow fans doing voluntary work in their own time and slamming them for mistakes that have been born out of goodwill.

In no small part down to the rivalry between the sites in question etc.

I also posted in the thread to get an answer to my questions to Wilhelm/Adoniram as well.

tell you what answer the following ,

WHY WAS THE MONEY HIDDEN FROM THE ACCOUNTS FOR 2 YEARS ?

SImple question and i bet you can't provide a SIMPLE answer ...

[BeasleysBaccyPipe 0]

On the first point i'm not sure if that is an excuse? Someone with knowledge on the law of bounced cheques may be able to enlighten me.

On the second point that is fair enough and perhaps honourable, but some of the mistakes that have happened, innocent or not, are below the standard expected of board members of an organisation that hold funds of thousands of pounds.

But you'll accept that the inferences throughout this thread from the people who are unhappy with the Trust members in question have mostly been that something underhanded was afoot?

For the record, I think change in the RST/fan groups is essential, I'm not in complete disagreement about all the comments in this thread.

[Poetry_In_Blue 1,043]

I just don't understand why the thread is still going on. We're talking about fellow fans doing voluntary work in their own time and slamming them for mistakes that have been born out of goodwill.

In no small part down to the rivalry between the sites in question etc.

I also posted in the thread to get an answer to my questions to Wilhelm/Adoniram as well.

It's got nothing to do with rivalry between sites, far from it, people just want proper transparent answers so possibly the RST can be saved from it's own failings.

Again an irony and a swerving from the real issues, no-one should be bouncing cheques (which I actually believe itself might be illegal) and then trying to hide it from the exact same people who pay their fees to the RST, did MD ask the RST members if they were happy for him to do this? It is after all their money, their investment he is messing around with.

[Frankie 505]

I just don't understand why the thread is still going on. We're talking about fellow fans doing voluntary work in their own time and slamming them for mistakes that have been born out of goodwill.

What goodwill is there in hiding important financial information from their board colleagues?

What goodwill is there in hiding important financial information from their paying members?

What goodwill is there in hiding important financial information from their auditors?

What goodwill is there in board members posting malicious lies about former colleagues?

What goodwill is there in an organisation refusing to even consider debate outwith one single forum?

At what point do people take responsibility for their mistakes instead of absolving themselves then unfairly criticising those that dare to complain?

[Bluedell 14]

In the same way that downloading a torrent, giving out a copy of a DVD etc is, only less severe.

Pretty flimsy imo.

While the lending of the credit card machine to a charity is laudable, it does break the contract between the merchant and the RST. This could lead to the machine being removed if the merchant finds out, which isn't that unlikely if someone contacts their credit card company not knowing why their card has been charged by the RST, an organisation that they know nothing about. It could therefore limit the RST's ability to collect cash at their own functions in the future.

It also exposes the Trust financially. What happens if an amount collected by the RST and paid over to the charity is then reversed several months later? Would the charity be in a position to refund the cash to the RST? Doubtful. Who then suffers the loss?

[BlueIsTheColour 35]

I just don't understand why the thread is still going on. We're talking about fellow fans doing voluntary work in their own time and slamming them for mistakes that have been born out of goodwill.

In no small part down to the rivalry between the sites in question etc.

I also posted in the thread to get an answer to my questions to Wilhelm/Adoniram as well.

I think a public fans' body illegally using a credit card machine is a little more severe than downloading a torrent.

And as for the cheques being cashed, do you really believe that the RST treasurer would keep a cheque for over 2 grand lying around for a while before cashing it? That's just silly. And, of course, still doesn't explain why it happened a second time.....

This thread is still going on because there still isn't any definitive answers to the important questions on this issue.

[BeasleysBaccyPipe 0]

Sorry Wilhelm, here's what I'm referring to....

[trevelyan 44]

You mean your other username on here. Funny how the two of you always show up at the same time on here with the same posting style.

I know for a fact that they are two completly different people. The reason I know is because they both recently participated an IQ test and SOW came out tops

[BeasleysBaccyPipe 0]

What goodwill is there in hiding important financial information from their board colleagues?

'Hiding'.....how did they hide it?

What goodwill is there in hiding important financial information from their paying members?

That's just silly, lending the card machine was the goodwill I refer to.

What goodwill is there in hiding important financial information from their auditors?

Proof?

What goodwill is there in board members posting malicious lies about former colleagues?

Proof?

What goodwill is there in an organisation refusing to even consider debate outwith one single forum?

This I 100% agree with. No arguments.

At what point do people take responsibility for their mistakes instead of absolving themselves then unfairly criticising those that dare to complain?

Maybe who is complaining and why is the biggest issue? (not necessarily yourself)

[AMMS 27]

What you describe as 'views', others would call smears and abuse. As I've pointed out, I think it is ultimately counter-productive.

Without a semblance of a filtering process eventually you will find that only a handful of people are interested.

As for criticism or 'concern' about the RST, what I would like to know is why no-one has turned up at an AGM to mount their case and/or stand for election.

I fully accept that some people might find it impossible to attend but surely not everyone.

I've not posted on FF much really since I discovered this place, but I'm still a member and still pop back from time to time. For me FF had become an echo chamber, I'm not sure if that was due to the moderating or simply it attracting very similarly minded people despite the diversity of topics. RM has a broader collection of views, views that are aired strongly, too strongly sometimes, but that's the internet for you.

For what its worth I broadly agree that the 2 issues (the late repayment of table ticket costs and the lending of a credit card machine) aren't in themselves very important. I can sympathise if the person in question struggled to pay for these, we're living in difficult times. The amount is now paid, everyone knows about it, procedure can be tightened to ensure it doesn't happen again because however innocent it was it can look bad when viewed from outside. So they lend their credit card machine out, big deal. Lawyers or accountants might find fault with that, i'm more relaxed about it. I think a lot has been made of these two issues on here that feels opportunistic and I said as much 10 or 20 pages back.

However Frankie further explained to me that this is only the case if these issues are viewed in isolation. When added to other past issues then criticism is surely due. I would agree with that too.

From your point of view I can see why this thread feels like a virtual lynching, for some involved it might well be that, but that's a shame because it hides what should be a real issue for you and others involved with the RST. You clearly have problems reaching out to the greater support, there is mistrust and wariness from people who probably share similar aims to yourself. As a body you will eventually have to address this. It seems there are personalities involved in this who are polarising, and those who dismiss this as petty are missing the point.

[MisterC 12,445]

I know for a fact that they are two completly different people. The reason I know is because they both recently participated an IQ test and SOW came out tops

Doesnt say much for BB then

[GeneralCartmanLee 313]

Weren't all of these questions covered on FF last week?

The trusts VISA card machine was lent to a board member who was an SLC employee to collect payments for charity at a charity night they had, then the monies raised were credited from the Trust to the SLC. Nothing underhanded about that.

Also, how do you know that Mark Dingwall knew the money wasn't there in his account from the bounced cheques?

If Dingwall never took the debt on in the first place, it would've been money lost to the Trust.

I'm not lover of everything about FF, the Trust or it's admins...but I'm also not a fan of people trying to put a slant on things like this to suit their own ends.

Your argument and questioning of the Trust/FF etc has been tied in knots yet it's still carrying on over here?

Given you have are on a quest for truth, do you care to answer why you posted the contents of a private email between you and I and present it as a chopped post from FF??

I have asked privately btw and had no response.

did poor jocky need a hand....

[BeasleysBaccyPipe 0]

I've never had another username here btw, admin can prove that I'm sure.

[north_east_bear 0]

Sorry Wilhelm, here's what I'm referring to....

That was a direct cut & paste from a post on FF.

[nemisis 358]

One thing this thread has done has raised RM and their admin staff way way up in my estimation.

[GeneralCartmanLee 313]

I've never had another username here btw, admin can prove that I'm sure.

You are reading from the same hymn book as jocky so you could understand people for being mistaken .....

[BeasleysBaccyPipe 0]

That was a direct cut & paste from a post on FF.

No it wasn't.

I ASKED whoever was answering the VG emails the question because I didn't know at the time.

It is a direct cut and paste from an email I sent them, the content of the post was in a link further up the email.

[dirtybill 0]

One thing this thread has done has raised RM and their admin staff way way up in my estimation.

Why?

[BeasleysBaccyPipe 0]

Maybe goodwill yes but as I said before 'some of the mistakes that have happened, innocent or not, are below the standard expected of board members of an organisation that hold funds of thousands of pounds.'

Can't that fairly be measured out by him taking on a 3k undertaking which has since saved the Trust further loss in the first place?

[Allanger 625]

Who were the people wined and dined at Mark Dingwalls two tables and why did they think they were on a freebie?

[nemisis 358]

Can't that fairly be measured out by him taking on a 3k undertaking which has since saved the Trust further loss in the first place?

Oh its all clear now, there was nothing underhand or anything, he was actually the saviour of the trust

Do they all get given a script of what to write before they are sent over here?