David Murray

[The Godfather 71,893]

Again you are making up the history of what happened to suit yourself....

The banks took over because debt levels at MIM, not what we were paying players. He gambled after Kanaus as we had to win the league...i genuniely don't remeber reading a dissenting voice at the time and to be honest i don't think it was our downfall...we were reducing that debt until this season.

He had to sell to Whyte as Lloyds forced him, whyte has inflicted untold damage since taking over.

As i say if we are found guilty over EBT's no one, myself included, will defend him from that charge. It happened on his watch and as chairman he has overall resposability. Last time i looked we don't have a verdict on that. I like to see all the evidence i can before making decisions, i suggest you do the same.

As for having access to the books it was clear we were overspending, everyone knew this but the vast vast majority accepted it...no point in acting wise after the event now as it has gone wrong.

He was forced? Are you serious? If that was the case and he was forced then he could quite easily (The media done it in less time than the whole takeover saga took) to bring up the vast amount of foul play on CW to show he was not fit to take over Rangers, of course Murray done fcuk all and sold for a £1 then was gone only to mutter a few sentences when the shit hit the fan.

You keep going on about EBT’s but that has nothing to do with the debt level he got this club into during his tenure as owner, he was paying ridiculous transfer fees when we all knew Scottish football was in decline, he gave Walter a fortune to bring new players in when in reality we should have been cost cutting. He didn’t want to be the one seen to be making drastic actions at Rangers which would mean falling behind Celtic but look where that has taken us today…

We were reducing debt because of Lloyds not because of Murray and his band of merry men, we had to let go of players like Ferguson, Miller, Boyd, Thomson ect because of the cost structure at the club was farcical in Murrays tenure.

If Murray gave a shit about this club then he would have made changes when it mattered but no he wanted to hide behind his ridiculous policies and left the club in the hands of someone like Whyte because he couldn’t hack being the face of what was round the corner for Rangers FC.

[ScottBF2 3,540]

You get the replies your deserve....if all you bring is abuse to the table all you will get is it back.

To say Sir David "masterminded" the current situation is quite frankly absurd.

Everyone gets the replies they deserve, I've given you yours.

Murray gave the go-ahead for the EBT's, that then resulted in this Legacy Tax Case. The Legacy Tax Case made us an unattractive prospect for potential buyers, we were then lumped with Craig "The Only Show in Town" Whyte and we're in the situation we are now.

The blame for this situation lies, almost exclusively, at the door of David Murray. He fucked us, then sold us up shit creek without a paddle.

But, of course, because I didn't know all of this would happen 12 years ago I don't have an opinion on the matter according to you.

[MrSifter 181]

He told two of his inner sanctum of journos this was the case,...they have confirmed this on live radio.

So Murray has never said he was forced to sell. He has had ample opportunity to do so. You are basing your opinion on hearsay.

Another important point is if your beloved Murray had any feelings for RFC or any sense of decency he'd have provided an indemnity in relation to both tax cases, things that happened on his watch. He chose not to.

My evidence on whyte is solid...as it was in may when i said he was a crook.

Just because people like you backed him,and continue to do so, doesn't change that.

That's not the issue, you have been shrieking about Whyte on here and made the statement you "wait for all the evidence" before making a judgement. Clearly you do not.

As for your last point, show me one post where I have backed Whyte up?

Unlike some, I don't give a monkeys about any businessman or protecting them and their reputation ahead of The Rangers.

[Sobatai 70]

He had to sell to Whyte as Lloyds forced him, whyte has inflicted untold damage since taking over.

Being realistic, while Lloyds may have squeezed him into dealing with Whyte, Murray had been looking for a way out for years ... he knew it was going breasts up and his ego couldn't stand the thought of it happening on his watch.

[GeneralCartmanLee 313]

So Murray has never said he was forced to sell. He has had ample opportunity to do so. You are basing your opinion on hearsay.

Another important point is if your beloved Murray had any feelings for RFC or any sense of decency he'd have provided an indemnity in relation to both tax cases, things that happened on his watch. He chose not to.

That's not the issue, you have been shrieking about Whyte on here and made the statement you wait "for all the evidence" before making a judgement. Clearly you do not.

As for your last point, show me one post where I have backed Whyte up?

Unlike some, I don't give a monkeys about any businessman or protecting them and their reputation ahead of The Rangers.

No i am basing my opinion on the fact he gave the green light for Chic and James traynor to confirm this. I know it to be true. What evidence do you expect in this situation? You choosing not to believe it is your own business and one i quite frankly couldn't care less about

Shrieking, or pointing out he is a crook since May ? Again what you think is of little consequence to me

[MrSifter 181]

No i am basing my opinion on the fact he gave the green light for Chic and James traynor to confirm this. I know it to be true. What evidence do you expect in this situation? You choosing not to believe it is your own business and one i quite frankly couldn't care less about

Shrieking, or pointing out he is a crook since May ? Again what you think is of little consequence to me

No, this simply won't do. "I know it to be true" is not evidence and nor is hearsay evidence. You may want it to be true as it helps with the Murray apologetics but until LBG and David Murray confirm this then you know nothing.

We can also take it that you withdraw your statement about "waiting for all the evidence" before forming a viewpoint.

No luck with evidence of me "backing up" Whyte either? Thought not.

You've lost the plot.

[MosesMcNeil 1,664]

If we didn't apply the ebt scheme properly under Sir davids watch then he is culpable for that....he isn't to blame for whtes disgusting conduct since taking over....

That Murray promised to only sell The Rangers to a 'fit and proper person' to take our club on indicates he was either lying through his teeth, seriously negligent or promising something he could not deliver.

There's no getting away from that.

[GeneralCartmanLee 313]

No, this simply won't do. "I know it to be true" is not evidence and nor is hearsay evidence. You may want it to be true as it helps with the Murray apologetics but until LBG and David Murray confirm this then you know nothing.

We can also take it that you withdraw your statement about "waiting for all the evidence" before forming a viewpoint.

No luck with evidence of me "backing up" Whyte either? Thought not.

You've lost the plot.

So you don't believe the chairman but would only believe the bank...fair enough your prerogative.

Nope i have the evidence i need since may concerning whyte, Sir david and LBG. You will accept it one day, no doubt claiming it's what you thought all along it's what you do....stick to backing whyte..It suits you

[GeneralCartmanLee 313]

That Murray promised to only sell The Rangers to a 'fit and proper person' to take our club on indicates he was either lying through his teeth, seriously negligent or promising something he could not deliver.

There's no getting away from that.

As in a lot of his statements that are used against him the situation changed from when he made it and the decision to make the sale was effectively removed from him. He had turned down people in the past he thought not fit or proper...this time he couldn't

[GeneralCartmanLee 313]

Everyone gets the replies they deserve, I've given you yours.

Murray gave the go-ahead for the EBT's, that then resulted in this Legacy Tax Case. The Legacy Tax Case made us an unattractive prospect for potential buyers, we were then lumped with Craig "The Only Show in Town" Whyte and we're in the situation we are now.

The blame for this situation lies, almost exclusively, at the door of David Murray. He fucked us, then sold us up shit creek without a paddle.

But, of course, because I didn't know all of this would happen 12 years ago I don't have an opinion on the matter according to you.

Nothing at all wrong with EBT's. If they were applied incorrectly then he does indeed carry the can for that.

[The Godfather 71,893]

I'll stick to backing Murray..It suits me

Fixed that for you.

[CanadianBacon 2,088]

That Murray promised to only sell The Rangers to a 'fit and proper person' to take our club on indicates he was either lying through his teeth, seriously negligent or promising something he could not deliver.

There's no getting away from that.

Teflon Dave (Murray) said many things during his double-decade tenure that proved to be nothing more than complete and utter bullshit.

The man was (is) practiced in the Dark Arts.

[The Godfather 71,893]

He had turned down people in the past he thought not fit or proper...this time he couldn't

Yes he could….

What stopped him from digging up the dirt the Scottish media have on Whyte? That alone would have made any sale virtually impossible.

Fact is he done very little to block the sale to CW and that all points towards Murray not giving a flying fcuk what happened to the club when his hands were washed of us.

[GeneralCartmanLee 313]

Fixed that for you.

It is the only chance you have taking me on in a debate on this subject so i don't blame you for "fixing it" for me...

The fact i said Sir david will be 100% to blame for the EBT's, if we didn't apply them properly, must have escaped that gap between your ears..

[MrSifter 181]

So you don't believe the chairman but would only believe the bank...fair enough your prerogative.

Nope i have the evidence i need since may concerning whyte, Sir david and LBG. You will accept it one day, no doubt claiming it's what you thought all along it's what you do....stick to backing whyte..It suits you

Like I said, you've lost the plot. The above is so far removed from the conversation it is unreal.

I have never "backed" Whyte, if you have evidence to the contrary please do provide a link.

You have had evidence since May concerning Whyte? Really? What evidence? How was it obtained? Did you post all this evidence back in May? You've the cheek to accuse others of 20/20 hindsight where Murray is concerned. You're beyond parody.

Back in May you'd have been crying into your lemonade at the loss of "Sir David" and how it isn't Rangers for you now he's gone.

Why didn't Murray provide an indemnity to any new purchaser in relation to the tax cases? It did afterall happen on his watch.

[GeneralCartmanLee 313]

Yes he could….

What stopped him from digging up the dirt the Scottish media have on Whyte? That alone would have made any sale virtually impossible.

Fact is he done very little to block the sale to CW and that all points towards Murray not giving a flying fcuk what happened to the club when his hands were washed of us.

As i pointed out in the post above you don't seem to understand this...he had to get rangers off of MIM's books...he wasn't in a position to block the same whatever he thought.

He nicknamed whyte after one of the guys who attempted to buy man utd (his name escapes me but the man utd fans protested against him buying the club..and i don't mean Glazier)

[MrSifter 181]

Teflon Dave (Murray) said many things during his double-decade tenure that proved to be nothing more than complete and utter bullshit.

The man was (is) practiced in the Dark Arts.

The man was a complete and utter cancer on our Club. Words cannot fully express or describe what a loathsome, back stabbing yellow rat bastard he is.

He still has his fans as GCL is evidence of. I mean this turnip thinks you can't quote any of Murray's bluster against him, it's just not fair to expect poor "Sir David" to be true to his words.

"Judge me on Europe." By Christ David, I did and you failed, failed massively.

[The Godfather 71,893]

It is the only chance you have taking me on in a debate on this subject so i don't blame you for "fixing it" for me...

The fact i said Sir david will be 100% to blame for the EBT's, if we didn't apply them properly, must have escaped that gap between your ears..

Here you go again with this EBT issue…this is a potential debt I am going on about the actual debt this man got the club into during his tenure…you still dodge this issue because you have no way of backing the man you defend to the death. He had the chance to block the Whyte deal but chose not to as it was in HIS best interests to sell up now rather than lead the club into the fire.

You then go on about debt being reduced before Whyte yet fail to understand or open your eyes to the fact this was reduced due to Lloyds taking over and making cost cutting measures.

Come on GCL let’s hear your thoughts on these issues instead of constantly conveniently dodging these issues.

Debate?

You don't even know the meaning of the word.

[GeneralCartmanLee 313]

Like I said, you've lost the plot. The above is so far removed from the conversation it is unreal.

I have never "backed" Whyte, if you have evidence to the contrary please do provide a link.

You have had evidence since May concerning Whyte? Really? What evidence? How was it obtained? Did you post all this evidence back in May? You've the cheek to accuse others of 20/20 hindsight where Murray is concerned. You're beyond parody.

Back in May you'd have been crying into your lemonade at the loss of "Sir David" and how it isn't Rangers for you now he's gone.

Why didn't Murray provide an indemnity to any new purchaser in relation to the tax cases? It did afterall happen on his watch.

I knew what was coming with whyte back in may but i of course didn't know how he was going to do it...if i did i would have alerted the police or relevant authorities. He has done the same thing his whole business life.

You think Sir David was in a position to offer an indemnity to a new owner..if he was the club wouldn't have been sold in the first place....

You can keep saying "you have lost the plot" but like most of your fantasies...it doesn't make it true

[Edmiston Drive 3,846]

The man was a complete and utter cancer on our Club. Words cannot fully express or describe what a loathsome, back stabbing yellow rat bastard he is.

He still has his fans as GCL is evidence of. I mean this turnip thinks you can't quote any of Murray's bluster against him, it's just not fair to expect poor "Sir David" to be true to his words.

"Judge me on Europe." By Christ David, I did and you failed, failed massively.

Well he did get the troops home by xmas.

[The Godfather 71,893]

As i pointed out in the post above you don't seem to understand this...he had to get rangers off of MIM's books...he wasn't in a position to block the same whatever he thought.

He nicknamed whyte after one of the guys who attempted to buy man utd (his name escapes me but the man utd fans protested against him buying the club..and i don't mean Glazier)

Don’t you understand what we have been posting since this thread began?

Of course he could have stopped the sale as CW’s background alone would not stand up if enough digging was done, are you so blind you cannot see he sold up because it was in David Murray’s best interest to do so…it had nothing to do with what was best for Rangers (Something he lied about countless times).

Deflect, Sweep or close your eyes GLC…the truth must really hurt.

[MrSifter 181]

I knew what was coming with whyte back in may but i of course didn't know how he was going to do it...if i did i would have alerted the police or relevant authorities. He has done the same thing his whole business life.

You think Sir David was in a position to offer an indemnity to a new owner..if he was the club wouldn't have been sold in the first place....

You can keep saying "you have lost the plot" but like most of your fantasies...it doesn't make it true

You walked to the precipice and just leapt over it! Brilliant stuff above, absolutely brilliant.

I mean, where to start.

What evidence against Whyte did you have back in May? You said you had it, present it. Why didn't you provide it in May?

[effindelicious 10]

Whyte's fan club are surely out in force today. I posted a few times that Whyte is a crook; it will be interesting to see if the Paisley gangsters get mentioned when discussing Whyte in the coming weeks and months (eg: they negotiated Broadfoot's latest contract...). Don't let the revisionists get you down GCL, they mocked me when I identified Whyte as a full-blown crooked low-life. He, and Murray, might wish to consider visiting a well known Swiss clinic...

[ScottBF2 3,540]

Whyte's fan club are surely out in force today. I posted a few times that Whyte is a crook; it will be interesting to see if the Paisley gangsters get mentioned when discussing Whyte in the coming weeks and months (eg: they negotiated Broadfoot's latest contract...). Don't let the revisionists get you down GCL, they mocked me when I identified Whyte as a full-blown crooked low-life. He, and Murray, might wish to consider visiting a well known Swiss clinic...

Fanclub? Read the thread before you comment. Noone's defending Whyte.

[The Godfather 71,893]

Whyte's fan club are surely out in force today.

Who in this thread has defended Whyte?

Is it because this thread is about Murray and his wrong doings while in charge at Rangers that we all must be Whyte fan boys?

Please explain your post as to me it makes no sense whatsoever.