"It's a Grand Old Team" at Goodison yesterday

[cumnockbear 2,446]

So, you're told by me and my 'mate' that it doesn't work like that in Liverpool, and never has, yet to you Everton are still the Catholic team?

Just because Liverpool were founded by people who happened to be orange does not make them a Protestant club. They have never, for example, declined to sign Catholics on the basis of their religion, unlike Rangers. They weren't founded by Protestants for Protestants. So, are you understanding any of this any better now? Everton = not Catholic or Protestant, now or ever. Liverpool = not Catholic or Protestant, now or ever.

There are a number of reasons for the "friendly derby" tag. Firstly the clubs are situated in the north of the City and very close to each other (less than a mile), with only Stanley Park separating the two. Everton actually played at Anfield, now Liverpool's ground, before a rent dispute with the ground owners saw Everton relocate to Goodison Park and the formation of Liverpool F.C. From 1902 to 1932 the two clubs even shared the same matchday programme. Today there are no evident geographical, political, social or religious divides as in other derbies, although for many years a sectarian divide did exist within the city. It is unclear how (if at all) this influenced the support bases of the two clubs and more recent research has indicated that it was more likely to have been a political allegiance that influenced support . During the 1950s and 1960s Everton were coined as the Catholic club mainly as a result of successful Irish players Tommy Eglington, Peter Farrell and Jimmy O'Neill as well as manager Johnny Carey. This in turn caused Liverpool to be thought of as Protestant club, not signing an Irish Catholic until Ronnie Whelan in 1979. However, it should be noted that this notional divide was never seen as a basis for supporting a certain side as is the case with Celtic and Rangers. In truth both teams have strong support from all denominations as well as many fans from Presbyterian North Wales and Catholic Ireland. Most importantly, the actual clubs themselves did not act to strengthen sectarian divides and in fact both clubs stem from a Methodist origin.

So try telling me again that Everton were never a catholic team and Liverpool were never a Protestant team who never signed an Irish Catholic! until 1979....

[scousefc 14]

Have a read at this ScouseFC and tell me what you think.

http://toffeeweb.com/season/09-10/comment/fan/RedBlueGreenOrange.pdf

I've read that a few times mate. I agree that some people will always try to make something of religion in every aspect of Liverpool;- politics, music, football, housing, the lot. The writer concludes that there has never been a football sectarian split, although at times there were more Catholics in Everton's team (like the 50s) and more Protestants in Liverpool's team (their formation when no Liverpool people would play for them). That doesn't make us or them 'the Catholic/Protestant club. We simply don't see football through sectarian eyes, unlike you. You'll see articles like that all over Everton sites if you take a good look. None of them conclude as you would wish.

[scousefc 14]

There are a number of reasons for the "friendly derby" tag. Firstly the clubs are situated in the north of the City and very close to each other (less than a mile), with only Stanley Park separating the two. Everton actually played at Anfield, now Liverpool's ground, before a rent dispute with the ground owners saw Everton relocate to Goodison Park and the formation of Liverpool F.C. From 1902 to 1932 the two clubs even shared the same matchday programme. Today there are no evident geographical, political, social or religious divides as in other derbies, although for many years a sectarian divide did exist within the city. It is unclear how (if at all) this influenced the support bases of the two clubs and more recent research has indicated that it was more likely to have been a political allegiance that influenced support . During the 1950s and 1960s Everton were coined as the Catholic club mainly as a result of successful Irish players Tommy Eglington, Peter Farrell and Jimmy O'Neill as well as manager Johnny Carey. This in turn caused Liverpool to be thought of as Protestant club, not signing an Irish Catholic until Ronnie Whelan in 1979. However, it should be noted that this notional divide was never seen as a basis for supporting a certain side as is the case with Celtic and Rangers. In truth both teams have strong support from all denominations as well as many fans from Presbyterian North Wales and Catholic Ireland. Most importantly, the actual clubs themselves did not act to strengthen sectarian divides and in fact both clubs stem from a Methodist origin.

So try telling me again that Everton were never a catholic team and Liverpool were never a Protestant team who never signed an Irish Catholic! until 1979....

It's getting ridiculous now. Have you actually read this lad? This says that there was a sectarian divide in the city but that there was no evidence that religion influenced who you support, it was more likely politics. There was a sectarian divide in Liverpool and it remains today. However, this didn't extend to the football clubs. It may have been the perception by some that there was a religious discrimination thing going on at the clubs but I can assure you that this is not the case. Everton signed people regardless of religion, so did Liverpool. I don't know or care about Whelan's religion, but he wasn't the first Irishman they signed. Try harder pal.

[cumnockbear 2,446]

It's getting ridiculous now. Have you actually read this lad? This says that there was a sectarian divide in the city but that there was no evidence that religion influenced who you support, it was more likely politics. There was a sectarian divide in Liverpool and it remains today. However, this didn't extend to the football clubs. It may have been the perception by some that there was a religious discrimination thing going on at the clubs but I can assure you that this is not the case. Everton signed people regardless of religion, so did Liverpool. I don't know or care about Whelan's religion, but he wasn't the first Irishman they signed. Try harder pal.

You're the one who said "Everton = not Catholic or Protestant, now or ever. Liverpool = not Catholic or Protestant, now or ever." i think these stories written say otherwise. by the way i never said Irishman, the first Irish Catholic.

[.Williamson. 82,253]

Cumnockbear should you not be round yer mother in laws talking to Casper or some shite?

Everton are an alright club. I have a couple of mates serving in the army support them and back us over Celtic.

Anyone that basis's their support of anything going on religion is a fucking moron

[scousefc 14]

You're the one who said "Everton = not Catholic or Protestant, now or ever. Liverpool = not Catholic or Protestant, now or ever." i think these stories written say otherwise. by the way i never said Irishman, the first Irish Catholic.

Which is exactly what your link says, there was no discrimination. Your link also says that people of Irish descent played for Liverpool in the early days after they'd moved to Scotland. You have still not provided anything to say that we or them discriminated on the grounds of religion. I'm not sure how old you are, as you seem to rely on wiki as opposed to your own experience or knowledge, but Liverpool simply wasn't a football club you would cross the road to join pre 1959, let alone the Irish Sea. That is the reason why not many Irish people came to play for them, Catholic or Protestant. Look up Steve Heighway on your computer mate and tell me where his town of birth is. I'm a mate of Steve's and he'll enjoy this nonsense.......

[King Jela 20,364]

Cumnockbear should you not be round yer mother in laws talking to Casper or some shite?

Everton are an alright club. I have a couple of mates serving in the army support them and back us over Celtic.

Anyone that basis's their support of anything going on religion is a fucking moron

This. Religion, really ? Its a lot of fucking bullshit.

There isn't some man in the sky called God watching us.

[King Jela 20,364]

For the record, Liverpool are the worst club in England.

[cumnockbear 2,446]

Cumnockbear should you not be round yer mother in laws talking to Casper or some shite?

Everton are an alright club. I have a couple of mates serving in the army support them and back us over Celtic.

Anyone that basis's their support of anything going on religion is a fucking moron

Naw a should be round your maws pumpin her, Everton are a shit club.

[cumnockbear 2,446]

Which is exactly what your link says, there was no discrimination. Your link also says that people of Irish descent played for Liverpool in the early days after they'd moved to Scotland. You have still not provided anything to say that we or them discriminated on the grounds of religion. I'm not sure how old you are, as you seem to rely on wiki as opposed to your own experience or knowledge, but Liverpool simply wasn't a football club you would cross the road to join pre 1959, let alone the Irish Sea. That is the reason why not many Irish people came to play for them, Catholic or Protestant. Look up Steve Heighway on your computer mate and tell me where his town of birth is. I'm a mate of Steve's and he'll enjoy this nonsense.......

This wasn't from wiki it was from Everton/Liverpool the history, not wiki nonsense that can be edited.

[scousefc 14]

This wasn't from wiki it was from Everton/Liverpool the history, not wiki nonsense that can be edited.

Deal with what I said then. We can all do cut and pastes. What about Steve Heighway?

[cumnockbear 2,446]

Deal with what I said then. We can all do cut and pastes. What about Steve Heighway?

What about him ? he's from Dublin ... ok, big deal ? i mentioned Irish Catholic in the bit i took from Everton/Liverpool the history, i never said anything about Irishmen, not all Irishmen are Catholic, so your point is ? one of two are talking shit then, either you or the website that's supposed to be from so called scouse fans, so what one is it ?

[scousefc 14]

What about him ? he's from Dublin ... ok, big deal ? i mentioned Irish Catholic in the bit it took from Everton/Liverpool the history, i never said anything about Irishmen, not all Irishmen are Catholic, so your point is ? one of two are talking shit then, either you or the website that's supposed to be from so called scouse fans, so what one is it ?

"The bit took from Everton/Liverpool the history". So you know Whelan's religion because it's on the computer but not Heighway's because it's not on the computer? Your time's up lad. You know nothing about Everton or Liverpool. Spread your lies and poison by all means, but you're sussed.

[RFC55 108,971]

"The bit took from Everton/Liverpool the history". So you know Whelan's religion because it's on the computer but not Heighway's because it's not on the computer? Your time's up lad. You know nothing about Everton or Liverpool. Spread your lies and poison by all means, but you're sussed.

Yet it's funny how you can spread your lies about Rangers not signing Catholics, stick to stealing stereos ya roaster

[cumnockbear 2,446]

"The bit took from Everton/Liverpool the history". So you know Whelan's religion because it's on the computer but not Heighway's because it's not on the computer? Your time's up lad. You know nothing about Everton or Liverpool. Spread your lies and poison by all means, but you're sussed.

Obviously if it doesn't mention Heighway's religion then obviously i won't know My time is up ? i've been sussed it's your websites that are telling the so called history so what's lies and poison about it ?

[cumnockbear 2,446]

What you really mean is your own fans don't know your clubs history, regarding player signings and what religion they are etc ? it's your own fans that write these blogs on the clubs history, so tell me how i am in the wrong, this is where i got the info from.

[scousefc 14]

Obviously if it doesn't mention Heighway's religion then obviously i won't know My time is up ? i've been sussed it's your websites that are telling the so called history so what's lies and poison about it ?

You didn't even know Heighway existed until an hour ago! Read through what I have been saying, and what you have been quoting. Nowhere does it say that we discriminated at any point in favour of or against Catholics or Protestants. Find out where it does and I'll apologise to you. You won't and I won't have to. We are not bigots down here at Everton or Liverpool.

[RFC55 108,971]

You didn't even know Heighway existed until an hour ago! Read through what I have been saying, and what you have been quoting. Nowhere does it say that we discriminated at any point in favour of or against Catholics or Protestants. Find out where it does and I'll apologise to you. You won't and I won't have to. We are not bigots down here at Everton or Liverpool.

You're both a shower of manky fucks though.

[scousefc 14]

What you really mean is your own fans don't know your clubs history, regarding player signings and what religion they are etc ? it's your own fans that write these blogs on the clubs history, so tell me how i am in the wrong, this is where i got the info from.

Are you for real? We don't care what religion they are! Never have! What I really mean is I know what I am on about and you're quoting things off websites that the likes of you could have written.

[cumnockbear 2,446]

You didn't even know Heighway existed until an hour ago! Read through what I have been saying, and what you have been quoting. Nowhere does it say that we discriminated at any point in favour of or against Catholics or Protestants. Find out where it does and I'll apologise to you. You won't and I won't have to. We are not bigots down here at Everton or Liverpool.

I quoted above where it said there was a sectarian divide in the city for long enough and that Everton were coined as the Catholic team, i rest my case, look above at the top of the page and you will see.

[cumnockbear 2,446]

You're both a shower of manky fucks though.

Aye this, take your shite back to your Everton toffee board or what ever the fuck it's called.

[cumnockbear 2,446]

Are you for real? We don't care what religion they are! Never have! What I really mean is I know what I am on about and you're quoting things off websites that the likes of you could have written.

The difference is.... i never write it, Everton fans did

[scousefc 14]

I quoted above where it said there was a sectarian divide in the city for long enough and that Everton were coined as the Catholic team, i rest my case, look above at the top of the page and you will see.

They were 'coined' or nicknamed it but it wasn't true. We were also called 77 Sunset Strip and the Millionaire Club for similar reasons. Nicknames do not equate to facts. I told you before that there was and is a sectarian divide in the city. Not disputing that. That it never came to football is not disputed in this city. You can't compare Merseyside teams to yours, religion wise. There is no comparison. You know it now too.

[cumnockbear 2,446]

They were 'coined' or nicknamed it but it wasn't true. We were also called 77 Sunset Strip and the Millionaire Club for similar reasons. Nicknames do not equate to facts. I told you before that there was and is a sectarian divide in the city. Not disputing that. That it never came to football is not disputed in this city. You can't compare Merseyside teams to yours, religion wise. There is no comparison. You know it now too.

I never said there was a comparison to our derby and never will be because your's is shit compared to ours, if the sectarian element wasn't football related then what was it ? at the end of the day it's still sectarian.

[scousefc 14]

Aye this, take your shite back to your Everton toffee board or what ever the fuck it's called.

You'll be an expert in them. You've been misunderstanding them for two days now