Fans invited to public meeting to discuss plans to scrap football act

[Bears r us 31,350]

36 minutes ago, Jimbeamjunior said:

The saying "better the devil you know" comes to mind here, we might not like the current act, but if tarriers like mason get their way an even more one sided one could pass and good luck getting rid of that one

That would be my fear as well. The bill is shite but many would want it to hit our fans harder and leave their's alone. 

 

[cushynumber 25,178]

29 minutes ago, onwardsupwards said:

Wtf? The guys a fool, he was on last night  using the word "spast*c, something I really have a problem with, he then lies by saying he has a disabled nephew.

believe me anyone with a disabled person in their family genuinely takes offence at that demeaning word it's disgusting 

I believe you have already made your point in another thread. 

[plumbGER 24,518]

24 minutes ago, Sportingintegritymyarse said:

Why don't you two take this to pm so as not to derail another thread.  Might stop one or both of you getting banned to prevent the rest of us being indulged in your petty nursery pish.

I had contributed to the thread initially, it was him who came on starting his nonsense from last night.

If he thinks i am that much of a fool he can easily put me on ignore instead of ruining threads with his name calling and offers to fight.

Back on topic, interesting point someone else made regarding the act getting scrapped.

You can bet your bottom dollar that the replacement act would punish us even more than at present, the agenda has been made clear by Mr Mason himself.

[cushynumber 25,178]

15 minutes ago, Inigo said:

This is something our fans group should start involving itself in. They should start mobilising the support a bit.

If not, then the likes of Mason will continue to dominate the direction of these discussions. Given that unfair targeting of Bears is one of the major problems the support has these days, surely it's something for a fans group to look to get involved in.

Agreed. Groups carry more weight than individuals

Mason should be taken to task for these quotes though as they are shocking. An MP saying its simply there to protect catholics shows he is not the man to be at the forefront of this discussion fighting to keep it. A quick google for charges:

• in the 2013-2014 season  The accused had affiliation with Rangers in 59 (29%) charges and with Celtic in 44 (22%) charges,
• In the  2014-2015 season The accused had an affiliation with Rangers in 58 (30%) charges, Aberdeen in 30 (16%) charges, Celtic 19 (10%) charges.

Given that in the 2011 census only 15.9% of the population registered itself as Roman Catholic, they are over represented  when it comes to getting charged under this act

 

 

 

 

[BridgeIsBlue 66,820]

Whoever goes to this should walk in whistling TBB.

[SeparateEntityMyArse 55,426]

3 minutes ago, BridgeIsBlue said:

Whoever goes to this should walk in whistling TBB.

At the head of a flute band ?

[Virtuoso 27,180]

From a post on FB:

Quote

A Bill borne and created of sectarianism against Rangers Football Club and its support by those now crying crocodile tears about being unable to hate the British in their cesspit of a stadium. They were ably backed by their equally hateful reporters like Graham Spiers and Phil MacGiollabhain in their haste to demonise the Rangers support and their Unionist background, forgetting that in the long haul they would be reeled in as well. The Bill is flawed greatly, but I'll be damned if I support that shower of Anti- British lowlife in trying to have it removed, we'll do that our own way and not standing shoulder to shoulder with IRA sympathisers 

Sums it up perfectly.

[plumbGER 24,518]

8 minutes ago, cushynumber said:

Agreed. Groups carry more weight than individuals

Mason should be taken to task for these quotes though as they are shocking. An MP saying its simply there to protect catholics shows he is not the man to be at the forefront of this discussion fighting to keep it. A quick google for charges:

• in the 2013-2014 season  The accused had affiliation with Rangers in 59 (29%) charges and with Celtic in 44 (22%) charges,
• In the  2014-2015 season The accused had an affiliation with Rangers in 58 (30%) charges, Aberdeen in 30 (16%) charges, Celtic 19 (10%) charges.

Given that in the 2011 census only 15.9% of the population registered itself as Roman Catholic, they are over represented  when it comes to getting charged under this act

 

 

 

 

Thats a ridiculously high number for them giving the attendances they had been getting until we came back.

That said i would imagine most of their arrests would be from away games where the Iraoake is played out every week.

In that case the figures should be a lot higher.

[Bad Robot 21,513]

1 hour ago, onwardsupwards said:

Wtf? The guys a fool, he was on last night  using the word "spast*c, something I really have a problem with, he then lies by saying he has a disabled nephew.

believe me anyone with a disabled person in their family genuinely takes offence at that demeaning word it's disgusting 

Wrong as it was, there's no point derailing another thread for an issue you've already said your piece on it. 

[Bad Robot 21,513]

An idea would be to use this thread as evidence to show the lack of parity and to compare and contrast the way the Act is being implemented and the ludicrous court decisions.

The school teacher for a start who never recieved jail time:

http://www.<No links to this website>/news/ira-supporting-primary-teacher-pleads-7947075

IRA supporting primary teacher pleads guilty to posting sectarian rants on social media

16:03, 11 MAY 2016

UPDATED 16:45, 11 MAY 2016

BY RON MOORE

ANNE-MARIE Clements' career is in tatters after she admits bigoted insults on Twitter

 

 

 

 

2185SHARES

P7 teacher Anne-Marie Clements 

A teacher who glorified IRA terrorists and posted bigoted insults on social media has been left with her career in ruins.

Anne-Marie Clements, 25, a primary seven teacher at St Mark’s Primary in Barrhead , launched a string of offensive posts on her Twitter account where she praised the actions of the Provisional IRA and made hate-filled comments about protestants.

Paisley Sheriff Court hard that Clements, posting under her account ‘x annemarie,’ last 18 November wrote: “So called refugees...think there’s a bigger issue. What’s being done about the protestants?”

In another rant on November 24 Clements included a picture of a masked IRA gun man holding a rifle with the caption: “Every day is a RA day.”

READ MORE: Teacher arrested following probe into claims she praised the IRA on social media

While on November 26, the teacher wrote: “C’mon Celtic! This is the one. Get into these Sons of William Orange B**tards.” She also wrote: “Roaming in the gloaming’ with Ronnie’s F**ians.”

Fiscal Depute John Penman told the court that Clements, of Buller Crescent in Blantyre, was pleading guilty to offences of posting grossly offensive and sectarian remarks on social media, which took place at her home address, in Perth, and while she was at St Mark’s Primary in Barrhead.

MORE PAISLEY NEWS: Paisley opens its heart to give homes and hope to child refugees

The teacher had 3,000 followers and was followed by 2,500 other people when she made the posts, which were then re-tweeted or forwarded by other Twitter users.

Mr Penman said: “A witness Mr Jones was at home on his computer when he came across material which he found extremely offensive and was of a sectarian nature.

“When he looked at the history of the account he established the account holder was employed as a teacher at St Mark’s Primary in Barrhead.”

Career in tatters: Anne Marie Clements 

The prosecutor told how the witness took screen shots of Clements’ hateful Twitter posts, and saved these as attachments, which were forwarded to education bosses at the teacher’s work, East Renfrewshire Council , along with an email explaining their sectarian nature.

PAISLEY DAILY EXPRESS: Live news as it happens

School bosses hauled Clements in for a meeting about her posting sectarian comments on social media, which she brazenly denied.

Mr Penman added: “The accused initially denied any knowledge. When pressed on the matter she said, ‘I have never put any comments about the IRA.’

“Her superiors were upset about this. They asked to bring up her account on the computer. The accused brought up her account and began deleting posts in front of the witnesses. She was told to stop doing it.”

She subsequently attended a disciplinary interview where she was formally suspended from her teaching duties and the offences were reported to police.

The court was told when Clements attended her interview with police she remained silent and gave no comment throughout the process. She was told she was being reported to the procurator fiscal.

MORE PAISLEY NEWS: Blaze rips through award winning chippy

Her defence agent Mr Millar told the court his client’s career was finished as she had lost her job, she would be removed from the register by the General Teaching Council following her conviction, and her professional life was over barely after it had started.

He said the impact of the Twitter comments had been “catastrophic” on the life of “an otherwise excellent teacher, but whose actions had destroyed that career.”

He urged leniency for her, and added that as a first offender, she was currently unemployed, with no real career prospects. He also provided the court with many character references praising her abilities as a young teacher.

Sentencing her, Sheriff Susan Sinclair said: “The comments which were posted were wholly offensive, completely unacceptable and wholly inappropriate.

“It has brought home to you the catastrophic effect it has had on your career and employment.”

But she added she had to balance the interests of justice with that of the public interest and decided to fine Clements £600, reduced from £900, because of her early plea of guilty before trial.

[Virtuoso 27,180]

11 minutes ago, Bad Robot said:

An idea would be to use this thread as evidence to show the lack of parity and to compare and contrast the way the Act is being implemented and the ludicrous court decisions.

The school teacher for a start who never received jail time:

http://www.<No links to this website>/news/ira-supporting-primary-teacher-pleads-7947075

UVF supporting primary teacher pleads guilty to posting sectarian rants on social media

16:03, 11 MAY 2016

UPDATED 16:45, 11 MAY 2016

BY RON MOORE

ANNE-MARIE Clements' career is in tatters after she admits bigoted insults on Twitter

A teacher who glorified UVF terrorists and posted bigoted insults on social media has been left with her career in ruins.

Anne-Marie Clements, 25, a primary seven teacher at St Mark’s Primary in Barrhead , launched a string of offensive posts on her Twitter account where she praised the actions of the UVF and made hate-filled comments about catholics.

Paisley Sheriff Court hard that Clements, posting under her account ‘x annemarie,’ last 18 November wrote: “So called refugees...think there’s a bigger issue. What’s being done about the catholics?”

In another rant on November 24 Clements included a picture of a masked UVF gun man holding a rifle with the caption: “Every day is a UVF day.”

While on November 26, the teacher wrote: “C’mon Rangers! This is the one. Get into these Fenian B**tards.”

Fiscal Depute John Penman told the court that Clements, of Buller Crescent in Blantyre, was pleading guilty to offences of posting grossly offensive and sectarian remarks on social media, which took place at her home address, in Perth, and while she was at St Mark’s Primary in Barrhead.

But she added she had to balance the interests of justice with that of the public interest and jailed Clements for six months, reduced from nine, because of her early plea of guilty before trial.

....just saying if this had been the case ^^^

[Blue Nosed Babe 21,459]

I find Mason's comments to be inappropriate, unhelpful and frankly disturbing. By saying what he did he seems to condone anti-British racism and anti-Protestantism. That is just my reading of it.

Also plenty of c****c fans arrested and going through courts after last Old Firm for their banners. Not aware of any Rangers fans going through. 

Put that in your pipe and smoke it Mason and Dornan. Sectarianism is about EVERY religion, not just a part of one. 

[Virtuoso 27,180]

How many Rangers fans have been allowed to pay an £800 bond to overturn a ban whilst awaiting trial? An £800 bond that was allegedly paid by FAC ffs.

Maybe it's because we don't have supporters being offered deals to grass, but regardless it fucking stinks.

[MayboleLoyal_atb 4,087]

Filled in the club 1872 form thing on this last night. Have a personal ongoing case with this law so would like it scrapped.

[Courtyard Bear 41,357]

That last paragraph sums up just what we are up against in this country. 

[Bad Robot 21,513]

38 minutes ago, Blue Nosed Babe said:

I find Mason's comments to be inappropriate, unhelpful and frankly disturbing. By saying what he did he seems to condone anti-British racism and anti-Protestantism. That is just my reading of it.

Also plenty of c****c fans arrested and going through courts after last Old Firm for their banners. Not aware of any Rangers fans going through. 

Put that in your pipe and smoke it Mason and Dornan. Sectarianism is about EVERY religion, not just a part of one. 

I know innocent until proven guilty but it would be good to know the actual figures for cases pending in regards to the act in regards to the charges that are offensive/religiously aggravated.

The convicted stats would also assist if you can possible point to source of these figures

As far as I've read Racism is ten times the problem as sectarianism but it's just not a vote winner or a paper seller which is also so wrong.

[Blue Nosed Babe 21,459]

I hope someone goes and lets them know about these MSPs comments.

[ForeverAndEver 73,954]

Fuck FAC.

[Virtuoso 27,180]

2 minutes ago, ForeverAndEver said:

Fuck FAC.

[Rangersfansmediawatch 1,055]

Don't know why people are surprised about what Mason wrote at the end,I have seen written proof that this bill was purely set up to protect Irish and Catholics from Mason himself and fail to understand why not one person has took this up with the Scottish government and challenged it.

It was set up to protect one set of people only and gives the impression that sectarian hatred is a one way attack on anyone who is Irish or Catholic which quite clearly isn't the case at all.

Mason totally ignores any form of sectarian hatred towards anyone who isn't Irish or a Catholic and just adding fuel to the fire.... Nothing more than a devious little man. 

[BridgeIsBlue 66,820]

How can it be deemed anti Irish "racism" when the nappy rippers aren't Irish?

[dougie76 15,479]

I stay just down the road so think l may pop along, don't want it to turn into a wee fenian love in?

Heads up for anyone not clued up about that shithole, prepare to see what the snp have in store for the rest of the country, there is no coincidence that this area is being used. 

[.Williamson. 87,421]

Nothing but a load of paedos 

[Rangersfansmediawatch 1,055]

Here you go,This is the full conversation between Mason and Jeanette Findlay...Note Mason's comments especially.

 

Came across this earlier and given i don't know a lot about this act and open to be educated on it,I found myself becoming quite disturbed by what i was reading from John Mason MSP and Findlay...Was this act predominantly set up to protect Irish and Catholics ? It seems reading it that if it is the case it seems to have backfired on them with having their own fans arrested and they don't like it and maybe the reason why they want rid of it... How on earth can an act be set up to protect one section of society while completely ignoring the other side(us) who will also be subjected to abuse under this act.

The highlighted item below i found quite ironic when most of the ones complaining about our singing and want the book thrown at us are in no doubt the same ones who want rid of this act,But say this.


And for the avoidance of doubt, we oppose this Act in its entirety and are happy to offer support to fans of any club charged under it, as we have done. This is not about sectarianism, it is not about Celtic and Rangers, it is not about the practice of singing songs about the history of the conflict between Britain and Ireland and it is

And here is the same John Mason


Motion S4M-12020: John Mason, Glasgow Shettleston, Scottish National Party, Date Lodged: 08/01/2015
Freedom of Speech That the Parliament notes with great sadness the deaths at the French satirical magazine, Charlie Hebdo; considers that, while hatred of any group in society should be opposed, freedom of speech must be supported and protected; strongly believes that in a healthy society it should be possible for politicians and religions to be ridiculed and satirised however uncomfortable that might be for those who are the subject matter, and considers all deities and prophets well able to handle criticism and ridicule without human intervention.

Twitter conversation between John Mason and Findlay

John Mason MSP　‏
OBAF Act is pro Catholic and pro Irish. It is because so many Irish and Catholics were victims that the Act was brought in. It is there to help Irish and Catholics

Jeanette Findlay　‏
By stopping Hamilton fans singing ‘f**k yer ‘well’? By stopping people singing Irish songs? This is nonsense. Point me to one single statement by any Minister which set this out as an aim of the Act.

John Mason MSP　‏
I am more interested in what Act says and does than what minister said.

Jeanette Findlay　‏
You said it was brought in to protect the Irish/Catholics – that suggests an explicit intention. Who else would express that? But ok point me to any statistic or other evidence that shows that the Act is protecting the Irish/Catholic community.

John Mason MSP　　　
Main victims of abuse are Catholics & Irish. Act challenges such abuse. So main beneficiaries are intended to be Catholics & Irish

Jeanette Findlay
We had legislation for that. What the Act makes criminal is ‘offensiveness’ as defined by political police & political COPFS.

John Mason MSP　　　
No. It is offensive as defined by a reasonable person. Previous legislation was not working.

Jeanette Findlay　‏
No John, read the Joseph Cairns appeal, it is explicitly not the reasonable person but the more ‘volatile’ person. Please spell out for me precisely how the existing legislation didn’t work and the OB Act does.

John Mason MSP　‏
Breach of Peace has been accepted to be unsatisfactory. Modern legal requirements and human rights need more specific offences.

Jeanette Findlay　‏
You haven’t given me any evidence that the pre-existing legislation didn’t work and the OB Act does. In what way does it work? As to your reference to Human Rights and the requirement to be specific, the OB Bill was condemned by every legal association in Scotland for being precisely the opposite! This Act is anything but specific.

John Mason MSP　　
Well clearly it wasn’t working because so many Catholics & Irish were subject to abuse. We had to do something to help these folk.

Jeanette Findlay　‏　
These folk? Do you mean people like me John and many of my community who find the Act discriminatory and oppressive? I’ll ask one more direct question. Name one Irish or Catholic group who have said they support the Offensive Behaviour Act?

John Mason MSP　‏　
I mean we as a society & parliament had duty to help the victims of offensive behaviour. And the main victims were Irish/Catholic.

Jeanette Findlay　‏　
So I ask again, cite a single piece of evidence to show that this is what the Act is doing? Just give me a straight answer.

John Mason MSP　‏　
The evidence is that most victims of offensive behaviour are Catholic/Irish so Act is clamping down on that behaviour.

Jeanette Findlay　‏　
12 hours and that was your best shot? You are closed-minded and impervious to reason. You have avoided every direct request for evidence and frankly I find your feigned willingness to debate, simply dishonest
.
John Mason MSP　　　
Thanks for that! I have responded but I guess you do not like my response.

Jeanette Findlay　‏　
No John, you either gave ludicrous responses or none at all eg name a single Catholic/Irish organisation who support this Act. Do you at least accept that your view of what the Act is for is not accepted by the community you claim to be protecting?

John Mason MSP ‏
Agree

Jeanette Findlay
Agreed what? That the Act should be abolished?

John Mason MSP ‏
Agreed that the Act is not accepted. We need to work on that!

Jeanette Findlay ‏
You think that actually the Act is protecting us but we just don’t understand it and just need to be convinced. Incredible!

John Mason MSP ‏ 
Football is main aspect of sectarianism. Marches should be dealt with next.

Jeanette Findlay ‏
You say you’re more interested in facts than opinions yet quote ‘surveys’ about opinions rather than stats. Regardless of what people think the stats show that only a tiny percentage of sectarian acts happen at football

John Mason MSP ‏
Football is rated number one issue when people are asked about sectarianism.

Jeanette Findlay ‏
Yes, hardly surprising when that is the message hammered out by the media and politicians but official crime stats show that this is not the case. So is it facts or opinions you prefer?

John Mason MSP ‏
Fact is 84% of charges were for anti-Catholic behaviour.

Jeanette Findlay
Yes and every single one of those could have been, and arguably would have been, dealt with under the existing legislation.

Jeanette Findlay ‏
John, your government has been reported to the UN Human Rights Commission specifically for this Act and the concern that it is infringing religious and civil liberties. What do you have to say about that?

John Mason MSP ‏
I do not think it is infringing civil liberties but courts can decide. Human rights are always a balance between competing rights.

Jeanette Findlay
So no shame at all then? Well I hope the UN HRC has a better grasp of the concept than you appear to have. I think we’ll leave it there for now John. You crack on with defending my community by criminalising us.

 

 

[.Williamson. 87,421]

I fucking hate their "community"