Martin Luther 53 Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 Totally agree with Adoniram there is a post on here about a fan agreeing with Brookmyre.I Also thought he spoke in the tense "We" when describing the issues concerning Celtic. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Luther 53 Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 Prof Tom Devine.....why is he always included in such programmes?Do the viewers know his background and who he is related to?Do they know the comments his Brother made about Faith Schools and how they should be abolished?Why did Celtic refuse to take part?Who is he related too and where is his brothers comments.I thought Celtic were represented by their mouthpiece McBacksideRide Laugh I almost paid my licence fee. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nikica Jelavic 41 Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 The singlr most biased programme i have ever seen. How any Rangers fan on this site could watch that and say it was not biased prob sums up why we are in the state we are in terms of the media. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adoniram 1,919 Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 Tom Devine is Brother to Bishop Joe Devine. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrms999 22 Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 The Anglican Church (or Episcopal Church) is governed from the top down to the individual parish, the Presbyterian Church (or Church of Scotland) is governed from the bottom up even if it is the established national church. John Calvin, who first trained as a lawyer, established this form of representative organization in 1541, and John Knox took the idea to Scotland. Thus, Queen Elizabeth sends an observer to the General Assembly once a year, and while she is the Queen of the United Kingdom, she is only a member of the Church of Scotland just like any other member.She is however Supreme Governor of the Church of England a protestant denomination.I 100% agree with the sentiment of your argument.Awesome post man Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adoniram 1,919 Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 Totally agree with Adoniram there is a post on here about a fan agreeing with Brookmyre.I Also thought he spoke in the tense "We" when describing the issues concerning Celtic.Brookmyre - CatholicDevine - CatholicMcBride - CatholicBenjamin(NbM) - UnknownO'Brien - Arch CatholicVery unbiased panel of interviewees Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Luther 53 Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 Cardinal O'Brien was on last night not the first time a churchman has been on the BBC proving he is a hypocrite and moving the goalposts to suit ones self interests.Cardinal O'Brien gets pacemakerCardinal O'Brien has had a heart murmur since his twentiesThe leader of the Roman Catholic Church in Scotland has had a pacemaker fitted following recent heart problems.Cardinal Keith O'Brien was fitted with the device under local anaesthetic at Edinburgh Royal Infirmary.The 70-year-old, who suffers from a heart murmur, had experienced dizzy spells in recent weeks and fainted prior to Palm Sunday mass.Despite the health scare he intends to resume all his current duties and engagements as soon as he is well.Peter Kearney, spokesman for the Catholic Church in Scotland, confirmed that Cardinal O'Brien had been admitted to hospital."He does suffer from a heart murmur which he has had since his twenties and on medical advice had a pacemaker fitted under local anaesthetic this afternoon," he said.The cardinal, who is Archbishop of St Andrews and Edinburgh, intends to keep all his engagements in coming weeks, Mr Kearney added.On Friday he will attend a public meeting to campaign against the government's Fertilisation and Embryology Bill.At his Easter Sunday mass the cardinal accused Prime Minister Gordon Brown of "an unprecedented attack on the sanctity and dignity of human life", and warned the research could lead to experiments of "Frankenstein proportions". Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davie2909 21 Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 Personally i think it portrayed Sellick in a terrible light due to the fact no-one was available to speak to them and also the stats of them banning only 6 people in 6 years it looks as if they arent doing anything about it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
theySTILLKNOW 80 Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 Showing the candlelight vigil in the context bbc scotland did was shocking,in their support of neil lennon they sang "London,Belfast,Donegal soon there will be no Protestants at all" that little ode to ethnic cleansing is the only song that mentions Protestants or catholics in any of the "old firm" songbook and yet they didn't broadcast that,for those who claim "it wasn't that bad"they miss the point,their slanting the reports in favour of celtic,to do anything else,would rightly show them as bigots and defeat the purpose. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Luther 53 Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 Personally i think it portrayed Sellick in a terrible light due to the fact no-one was available to speak to them and also the stats of them banning only 6 people in 6 years it looks as if they arent doing anything about it.Or it could be seen that they dont have a sectarian problem at Celtic park just a "political" one. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TravelingWilBEARy 4,319 Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 That was reasonably balanced. Nutters on here will always find something to be furious about though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluemc 305 Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 Couldnae be arsed watching it knew it would be a load of shite Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davie2909 21 Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 Or it could be seen that they dont have a sectarian problem at Celtic park just a "political" one.We all know they have a huge sectarian problem along with a massive political one so they should be taking action against these people which they are not doing Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TravelingWilBEARy 4,319 Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 Or it could be seen that they dont have a sectarian problem at Celtic park just a "political" one.The program never portrayed that at all - it said Celtic fans were singing Bigoted songs at the Youth Cup Final and showed them belting out an I.R.A tune. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TravelingWilBEARy 4,319 Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 Anti-Rangers agenda.Waste of a watch, Started off promising, then sunk. It even had clips of Celtic fans singing "Oo Ah up the RA" although, that'll be swept under the carpet.Bit hard to sweep it under the carpet seeing as the showed it on TV last night, complete with subtitles. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bud72 117 Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 The thing I got from this BBC documentary was.1. The BBC are very selective in the songs they used from Celtic fans I was at that youth final and I heard derogatory songs containing Orange, H**, Queen and anti British Racism.2. The IRA songs are about the time circa 1916 1920 o.k how does that explain P.I.R.A (the song you couldnt find at tyncastle amongst others. I find it hard you couldnt get you lens cap of for one of the 90 mins of that game because your were more than likely to catch an offensive song sung by Celtic I will provide a list.) The Roll of Honour PIRA members who hunger starved in the 80's did they all have use of a time machine.1:44 Ooh Ahh Up the RA3:08 Roll of Honour6:03 Off to join the IRA10:04 Ooh Ah Up the Ra15:00 Oh the wee h*** are shite38:45 Get the Brits out now44:00 Oh ah Up the RA53:00 - P, P, PIRA55:00 Never Defeat the IRA58:00 Jim Jeffries is a sad orange bastard59:00 - Oh the wee h*** are shite64:00 - IRA All the way, **** the Queen and the UDA66:00 Off to join the IRA72:00 Michael Fagan Shagged the Queen73:00 Go home ya h***87:00 - oh the wee h*** are shite3. Celtic are an all encompassing multi racial non denominational organisation Who sing songs about Fenian terrorism as we have proved above and was proved in the BBC Doc.But If you are a fan of any other football club you cant show your disgust at this by singing Fenian Bastards to said Fenians.4. Nil by mouth instead of looking like an unbiased organisation that has been set up to eradicate sectarian bigotry looked like an organisation set up to avenge the death of a middle class Celtic fan who was killed at the hands of a criminal NED in the east end of Glasgow.5. Even the BBC scotland isnt bigoted and one sided enough to give Phil MacGobbleshite a platform to air his mad conspiracy laden falsehoods.We all know the songs they sing and why they sing them. What if, as they claim, they were only political songs about the old I.A.Who were the old I.A and what did they get up to.Is it possible, through lack of education, that the people singing these songs, glorifying murderers, don't actually know what they were really like.The campaign of terror waged against Protestants in the Bandon valley in County Cork was never in our textbooks, though our classrooms were only a matter of miles away. In fact, I had to wait until a Canadian academic, Peter Hart, produced his exceptional The IRA and its Enemies before I learnt the extent of ethnic cleansing in my own home country.Fergal Keane, OBE, BBC journalist, The Independent (London), May 5, 2001 They will always be in denial of this, but can anyone else explain where half the population of Cork went, and for what reason, during this period.These songs are sectarian, don't let Tom Devine or any other I.A appologist tell you otherwise.Take note Salmond. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrms999 22 Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 What people tend to forget with programmes like these is they are not being addressed to you or i who know a lot more about the intricacies of both sides problems.This is going out to all the liberals and lefties and completely ambivolent neutrals who will simply see that Rangers are Sectaritan Bigots and Celtic are Politically Minded.Brookmyre also spoke in the tense "We" when describing the issues concerning Celtic.Prof Tom Devine.....why is he always included in such programmes?Do the viewers know his background and who he is related to?Do they know the comments his Brother made about Faith Schools and how they should be abolished?Did they see anyone challenge the Celtic fan that there is No anti Protestant feelings at Parkhead.Did the reporter even mention Faith SchoolsDid anyone from the Protestant Community be it in politics,media or the Orange Order comment last night?Were they invited?Why did Celtic refuse to take part?Why were they not condemned for their actions?Why was there no mention of Orange Bastards and Go home ya h*** to the Hearts fansWhy was O'Brien invited to speak shite about Parades and how he wants them all banned.Where was the Moderator of the Church of Scotland? Or the Free Presbytarian Church?A one sided and typically warped and slanted programme from BBC Scotland that gave the impression that Protestants and Rangers fans are the sole perpetrators of Bigotry and Sectarianism.And all this utter fucking shite about the equipment not working on the Celtic fans...do me a favour and wisen the fuck up.Plenty of video evidence exists of their bigotry and sectarianism as well as the fighting they indulged in at Tynecastle but it's the Hearts fans who are bigots not Celtic.Predictable garbage from the BBC that was neither thought provoking or even accurate. It didn't make any attempt to look at the causes of this so called divide at grass roots level and never made any attempt to criticise Lennon's behaviour as a mitigating factor for rising tensions.Another excellent post Ad' thanks Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMMS 27 Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 Totally agree with Adoniram there is a post on here about a fan agreeing with Brookmyre.I Also thought he spoke in the tense "We" when describing the issues concerning Celtic.Brookmyre is a St Mirren fan (no, he really is one) and has created probably the the only positive Rangers supporting lead characters in current Scottish (world) fiction writing. You might not like his writing style or even his stories but his portrayal of Rangers fans has been pretty fair.Edit - he's also head of the Scottish Humanist Society so literally anti religion. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Luther 53 Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 We all know the songs they sing and why they sing them. What if, as they claim, they were only political songs about the old I.A.Who were the old I.A and what did they get up to.Is it possible, through lack of education, that the people singing these songs, glorifying murderers, don't actually know what they were really like.The campaign of terror waged against Protestants in the Bandon valley in County Cork was never in our textbooks, though our classrooms were only a matter of miles away. In fact, I had to wait until a Canadian academic, Peter Hart, produced his exceptional ‘The IRA and its Enemies’ before I learnt the extent of “ethnic cleansing” in my own home country.Fergal Keane, OBE, BBC journalist, The Independent (London), May 5, 2001 They will always be in denial of this, but can anyone else explain where half the population of Cork went, and for what reason, during this period.These songs are sectarian, don't let Tom Devine or any other I.A appologist tell you otherwise.Take note Salmond."During the Irish War of Independence, Bandon’s Protestant population, which was largely unionist, suffered from Irish Republican Army (IRA) reprisals.Between 1911 and 1926 the non-Catholic population of Bandon dropped by 45.5%"And they want the Queen to apologise to them. What about their state apologising for the ethnic cleansing of members of their own country. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Luther 53 Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 Brookmyre is a St Mirren fan (no, he really is one) and has created probably the the only positive Rangers supporting lead characters in current Scottish (world) fiction writing. You might not like his writing style or even his stories but his portrayal of Rangers fans has been pretty fair.Edit - he's also head of the Scottish Humanist Society so literally anti religion.I never cast aspersions on this mans creed. He was still siding with Celtic IMHO. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adoniram 1,919 Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 Neil Doncaster made it clear that clubs would be targeted unless they were 'doing all that they reasonably can' to stop fans singing certain songs.The programme, having previously shown a large number of Celtic fans chanting IRA songs, then went on to reveal that only 6 Celtic fans had been banned from the stadium in the past 6 seasons, while no-one from Celtic was available to talk about it.In my opinion, it came across that Celtic were a club in denial, while Rangers, having arrested more, and co-operated with the filming of the show, were doing 'all that they reasonably can'.So why not say that then.In our opinion it seems that both clubs have a section of hardline fans but it is Rangers who are doing everything in their power to eradicate this problem.Celtic on the other hand stand accused of looking like a club in denial? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
WVB 2,560 Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 That was reasonably ballanced. Nutters on here will always find something to be furious about though.I'm furious that taxpayers money was wasted on your education. Learn to spell. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TravelingWilBEARy 4,319 Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 I'm furious that taxpayers money was wasted on your education. Learn to spell. Mugs. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bud72 117 Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 Neil Doncaster made it clear that clubs would be targeted unless they were 'doing all that they reasonably can' to stop fans singing certain songs.The programme, having previously shown a large number of Celtic fans chanting IRA songs, then went on to reveal that only 6 Celtic fans had been banned from the stadium in the past 6 seasons, while no-one from Celtic was available to talk about it.In my opinion, it came across that Celtic were a club in denial, while Rangers, having arrested more, and co-operated with the filming of the show, were doing 'all that they reasonably can'.They would put the low amount of arrests down to the fact that,in there opinion, they don't have a sectarian problem.People have already got off with singing songs about the ira,supported by 'sectarian experts' like Tom Devine.They were considered polital, rather than sectarian.Is ethnic cleansing of a country political or sectarian.I am sure, in the opinion of the people who created the last changes to the criminal justice act Scotland, it is just political.Just hope Salmond listens to Steve Bruce rather than Tom Devine.The Celtic Tiger that Mr Salmond so fondly speaks of, was a 'protestant man' eating tiger in the 1920's. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Luther 53 Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 They would put the low amount of arrests down to the fact that,in there opinion, they don't have a sectarian problem.People have already got off with singing songs about the ira,supported by 'sectarian experts' like Tom Devine.They were considered polital, rather than sectarian.Is ethnic cleansing of a country political or sectarian.I am sure, in the opinion of the people who created the last changes to the criminal justice act Scotland, it is just political.Just hope Salmond listens to Steve Bruce rather than Tom Devine.The Celtic Tiger that Mr Salmond so fondly speaks of, was a 'protestant man' eating tiger in the 1920's.Somehow I think Tom Devine would even sumo wrestle children in attempt to get his biased feet under that table Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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