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KingKirk

Honest Mistakes

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4 minutes ago, The Dude said:

Cedric kipre - two red cards. one rescinded. That's the same player sent off multiple times with half of them rescinded.

Here's the Motherwell manager's quote where he said exactly that (clubs have to pay £500 simply to submit an appeal). Even Chris Sutton said that Scott Sinclair dived to get Kipre sent off.

""It's very simple. We have appealed numerous decisions and we've wasted a lot of time and money. Another reason is we want Cedric Kipre totally focused on Wednesday night and Saturday. We've got big, big games."

 

Now you're using Chris Sutton as justification. Hmmm is he not as bad as Spiers.......

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20 minutes ago, The Dude said:

I haven't seen a single post yet give a comparison between the number of red cards issued to other sides and a comparison of the numbers rescinded - or a comparison of the actual challenged that merited the decisions.

Do you think other red cards that were later rescinded or other woeful decisions made by referees didn't change games?

I seen a ref give a yellow when he seen one of our players punched in the Balls. He seen it ffs.

I seen a ref give a yellow for one of the nastiest challenges I’ve ever seen. He was yards away. (Allen)

I don’t even know where to start with Hibs at Ibrox. Hubs could have had 3 reds that day  2 of them easy to give.  Who walked ?

Show me anyone in our game in the last few years get a face like Cardoso - your off your head if you think that, I dunno let’s say Jack wouldn’t have seen red had that been his elbow  

I accept that over the year penalties will be given and not, off sides will be seen and not and yup some you win some you don’t - however we are talking about blatant major flash points here and I’d say in those moments refs find it easier to award against us.  

Tell you what bud, if you call it different that’s up to you however I think your bonkers to dismiss that notion as it cost us last year and it’s a matter of time before it costs us significantly, imo.   Then again it’ll be another honest mistake. 

 

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8 minutes ago, The Dude said:

I haven't seen a single post yet give a comparison between the number of red cards issued to other sides and a comparison of the numbers rescinded - or a comparison of the actual challenged that merited the decisions.

Do you think other red cards that were later rescinded or other woeful decisions made by referees didn't change games?

Absolutely. Red cards obviously change games. The thing is wether or not the red cards were deserved. They majority of ours (mainly aimed at one player), have not been

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2 minutes ago, Paulbrian11 said:

I think every club in the U.K. think all refs are against them.  They can’t all be right.

I don’t think any other club can claim to play in the type of environment we do.  Not one.  

 

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12 minutes ago, Sportingintegritymyarse said:

You're backing that argument. Justify it, tell us the games they influenced and the points they cost their teams and why. I'm interested in Rangers by default, you seem to have a hard on for everyone but us.

Or should we go out and research your argument. The same way as when I said our treatment was worse than others unless proven to the contrary you suggested I go look at every other incident and foul at every other team to find it out for myself. "Review every decision made by referees all season" or some shite ??

When you're comparing how Rangers are refereed in relation to other sides it's probably worth having an idea what happened with them that would back up your argument. We're apparently being refereed to a 'different standard' but there doesn't seem to be any idea that the standard is just as bad in other games as it is ours.

I've pointed to examples of managers citing referees making mistakes consistently involving them, others who have sent numerous players off from one club only to get more than half of them wrong, decisions that have massively changed games (none of them involving us).

Then there's the ones that went in our favour. Two pena red cards, offside goal, McCrorie dodging a red etc.

I genuinely don't think there's been a top-flight club not complained about officials this season.

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26 minutes ago, The Dude said:

The first post in the thread literally say we have been refereed "to a different standard" - a phrase you also used. So this "different standard" is it accidental?

We have been held to a different standard, that’s blatantly obvious by the decisions over the season. 

Do I think all the Refs sat down and came with a plan to fuck us over, NO. 

But we have definitely been treated differently, you can call that subconscious bias or just plain they are shit scared of the backlash they get if they are seen to give us any benefit of the doubt. 

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14 minutes ago, Negri's lovechild said:

Absolutely. Red cards obviously change games. The thing is wether or not the red cards were deserved. They majority of ours (mainly aimed at one player), have not been

Again, the very same applies to motherwell. three of five red cards issues by Craig Thomson. Two were rescinded and the third (Sinclair's dive in the league cup final) should never have been a red either.

We had two of six overturned by my count. (two for Jack stood as well as Holt's and McCrorie's)

 

 

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1 hour ago, The Dude said:

No idea. Cedric Kipre might have but can’t remember off the top of my head. There’s been plenty gone in our favour too. Pena could have had reds against St Johnstone and Hamilton but didn’t for example.

Motherwell believe Craig Thomson got 3 of 5 red cards he issued them wrong. 

http://boards.footymad.net/showthread.php?t=38216269

ST. Johnstone think Andrew Dallas is out to get them https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/42931745

 

 

A genuine question for you. 

Do you accept or not that based on your historical knowledge of the game in this country that the consequences of a referee giving a big decision in our favour are far more significant than other wise?

Considerinng the reaction of other clubs and the media in this country in particular. 

If you answer that honestly there is only one answer and imo once you accept that you have to accept that their decision making cannot be impartial.

A mistake against Rangers goes away quickly. A mistake in our favour makes you headline news and I’d bet has consequences off the field. 

How on Earth with everything that has went on with us do you find it so hard to believe that that has had an impact on refs?  

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31 minutes ago, Negri's lovechild said:

That's the frustration i have with debating with some. They have the blinkers on,and that if you say we are held to a different standard, they trot out the paranoid line and that we are looking at conspiracy theories. 

The posts i have seen have been well measured and researched. The decisions against us haven't just been little ones here and there, they have changed games. 

They tell us to prove our point and push for better refereeing, we prove the point and when we then talk about the club writing to the SFA we are called taigs. ??

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23 minutes ago, The Dude said:

Cedric kipre - two red cards. one rescinded. That's the same player sent off multiple times with half of them rescinded.

Here's the Motherwell manager's quote where he said exactly that (clubs have to pay £500 simply to submit an appeal). Even Chris Sutton said that Scott Sinclair dived to get Kipre sent off.

""It's very simple. We have appealed numerous decisions and we've wasted a lot of time and money. Another reason is we want Cedric Kipre totally focused on Wednesday night and Saturday. We've got big, big games."

 

So they have big big games but they can’t be arsed spending £500 to get one of their main players on the pitch. ??

Again did they moan like fuck when Kipre put Jack out for the season, the same Kipre that’s ran around kicking everything in sight all season but only been sent off twice. 

Can you imagine the uproar if he played for us, had put one of them out for the season and didn’t even see a yellow card. ??

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3 minutes ago, markem said:

A genuine question for you. 

Do you accept or not that based on your historical knowledge of the game in this country that the consequences of a referee giving a big decision in our favour are far more significant than other wise?

Considerinng the reaction of other clubs and the media in this country in particular. 

If you answer that honestly there is only one answer and imo once you accept that you have to accept that their decision making cannot be impartial.

A mistake against Rangers goes away quickly. A mistake in our favour makes you headline news and I’d bet has consequences off the field. 

How on Earth with everything that has went on with us do you find it so hard to believe that that has had an impact on refs?  

What were the consequences of the two missed red cards for Carlos Pena?

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5 minutes ago, Courtyard Bear said:

We have been held to a different standard, that’s blatantly obvious by the decisions over the season. 

Do I think all the Refs sat down and came with a plan to fuck us over, NO. 

But we have definitely been treated differently, you can call that subconscious bias or just plain they are shit scared of the backlash they get if they are seen to give us any benefit of the doubt. 

This sums up my take on it, the refs don't have a plan to do us over but as someone else said, they seem to find it easy to make big decisions against us.  I can only guess why that should be, perhaps it goes back to Liewell's complaint about them or maybe it's a subconscious attempt to join the rest of the haters in trying to kick us when we were down, but I think there is something that stops us getting a fair deal on the park.

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5 hours ago, NamibianBear said:

In this case, the paranoia is justified.

.... sorry but I disagree - refereeing is shocking but most teams could create videos like this with no problems - and I mean just about anywhere not just in Scotland! 

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7 minutes ago, Courtyard Bear said:

So they have big big games but they can’t be arsed spending £500 to get one of their main players on the pitch. ??

Again did they moan like fuck when Kipre put Jack out for the season, the same Kipre that’s ran around kicking everything in sight all season but only been sent off twice. 

Can you imagine the uproar if he played for us, had put one of them out for the season and didn’t even see a yellow card. ??

Except, that's not what he said at all. His suspension won't take effect until they begin their League Cup campaign after the summer. The "big, big games" were the ones immediately after the LCF and they didn't want the distraction of an appeal going on.

I thought you only cared about facts and not what fans think? Funny how it matters what they think now that it suits your point.

http://forum.rangersmedia.co.uk/topic/316438-honest-mistakes/?do=findComment&comment=1064754028

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4 minutes ago, The Dude said:

What were the consequences of the two missed red cards for Carlos Pena?

You’ve totally avoided answering my question.  I’m genuinely interested if you see fit. 

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5 hours ago, theclothmonster said:

Prove it

:lol: - just ask any fan of any team about refereeing ‘bias’ and they will nearly all agree that refs are biased against their team. 

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Just now, Bluepeter9 said:

:lol: - just ask any fan of any team about refereeing ‘bias’ and they will nearly all agree that refs are biased against their team. 

Your opinion on this has come as a real shock. 

 

 

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7 hours ago, Bluepeter9 said:

I suspect most teams could compile a similar video. Don’t feed the paranoia! 

I knew youd be on I can think of 3 occasions when we could say we got away with one

Alves kickout in semi v well

Alves two footed challenge on the lad from Dundee

Bates handball v hibs

No fuckin paranoia here lad

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4 minutes ago, Bluepeter9 said:

It’s because I am consistent! :pipe: 

I doubt you’d get many arguments against that. 

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31 minutes ago, The Dude said:

When you're comparing how Rangers are refereed in relation to other sides it's probably worth having an idea what happened with them that would back up your argument. We're apparently being refereed to a 'different standard' but there doesn't seem to be any idea that the standard is just as bad in other games as it is ours.

I've pointed to examples of managers citing referees making mistakes consistently involving them, others who have sent numerous players off from one club only to get more than half of them wrong, decisions that have massively changed games (none of them involving us).

Then there's the ones that went in our favour. Two pena red cards, offside goal, McCrorie dodging a red etc.

I genuinely don't think there's been a top-flight club not complained about officials this season.

And every single club has likely been on the right and wrong end of incorrect decisions. Because refereeing IS shite.

But many are saying many blatant, game changing, incomprehensible ones have gone against us in numbers far in excess of balancing out or at levels other clubs have experienced.

I've seen examples 're other clubs but nothing on the scale of that which has been imposed on us.

And neither you with your IRA poster thread or anyone else gas come close to putting up evidence of any other club suffering such questionable refereeing conduct. If anyone has this evidence, they should simply post to allow comparison to the video in this thread.

Anyone?

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22 minutes ago, Bluepeter9 said:

.... sorry but I disagree - refereeing is shocking but most teams could create videos like this with no problems - and I mean just about anywhere not just in Scotland! 

Could but haven't, unless you can provide otherwise.

Funny that with all the fans forums other teams have there's none we can compare ours against. How unlucky for us is that, that despite them being done out of points etc they've not got round to it... 

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45 minutes ago, markem said:

I seen a ref give a yellow when he seen one of our players punched in the Balls. He seen it ffs.

I seen a ref give a yellow for one of the nastiest challenges I’ve ever seen. He was yards away. (Allen)

I don’t even know where to start with Hibs at Ibrox. Hubs could have had 3 reds that day  2 of them easy to give.  Who walked ?

Show me anyone in our game in the last few years get a face like Cardoso - your off your head if you think that, I dunno let’s say Jack wouldn’t have seen red had that been his elbow  

I accept that over the year penalties will be given and not, off sides will be seen and not and yup some you win some you don’t - however we are talking about blatant major flash points here and I’d say in those moments refs find it easier to award against us.  

Tell you what bud, if you call it different that’s up to you however I think your bonkers to dismiss that notion as it cost us last year and it’s a matter of time before it costs us significantly, imo.   Then again it’ll be another honest mistake. 

 

 I watched Carlos Pena elbow Greg Docherty and go in for a brutal challenge on Dougie Imrie. No action taken. Referee seen both of them too.

I've seen Morelos get away with countless things he could've walked for this season.

Show you a footballer get a broken nose in a game? Because that's all it was. Ref got the decision wrong but a broken nose is hardly a rarity in football. Go watch lower league games you'll see stuff like that happen.

Poor ref decisions did cost us, but they also cost others too and I don't for a second buy that refs find it easier to award against us - particularly at Ibrox.

 

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22 minutes ago, The Dude said:

Except, that's not what he said at all. His suspension won't take effect until they begin their League Cup campaign after the summer. The "big, big games" were the ones immediately after the LCF and they didn't want the distraction of an appeal going on.

I thought you only cared about facts and not what fans think? Funny how it matters what they think now that it suits your point.

http://forum.rangersmedia.co.uk/topic/316438-honest-mistakes/?do=findComment&comment=1064754028

?? Yip facts, Jack sent off 4 times 2 rescinded and out for the season by the same idiot you claim has been treated just as badly. 

 

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