I see Jim McColl Clyde Blowers is backing snp ?

[outlaw69uk 123]

You insult the intelligence of the people of our country if you think we couldnt organise all the things that are needed to be independent.

The thing is, if people dont like Salmond, or his policies, then its not difficult to vote him out after we are independent. The reason he has so much power at the moment is because none of the english based parties give two fucks for Scotland. An independent Scotland would have to spawn new political parties, to compete with the snp, hopefully we might finally have a true democracy in our little land, instead of feeding off the scraps of englands table.

Sadly, all the SNP wants is more power under the umbrella of the UK, i doubt they care much for total independence, hence the talk of a choice of three options.

No i dont, its a simple fact! look at our media? pathetic. Or are you also confused as to where I am from?

you have a truly strange view on things, and, seem to think its all so easy, I take it you have either been studying it for years, and undertand economic, business, politics etc, or, you simply believe the pamphlets. You are so wide of the mark its not actually funny

[ray 105]

No i dont, its a simple fact! look at our media? pathetic. Or are you also confused as to where I am from?

you have a truly strange view on things, and, seem to think its all so easy, I take it you have either been studying it for years, and undertand economic, business, politics etc, or, you simply believe the pamphlets. You are so wide of the mark its not actually funny

Just seen you're from Sheffield, is the Priory Hotel still on the go, think a German guy had it when we stayed there, pictures of Bannockburn and Scotland all over the walls, Scots guy owned it originally I believe. We had some rerr terrs in there, 24 hour bar fuckin ace.

[nachothelegend 1,932]

So what currency will all our MOD pensions be paid in?Another unanswered Q.Since it was the UK I served and if that is gone who will pay and it willlose money for sure.

It will have to be changed from pound sterling to whatever ,and veterans will lose Thousands per person changing exchange rates.

If this stupid scheme was to happen, then there will most certainly be more losers than Winners, thats for sure.

[ray 105]

So what currency will all our MOD pensions be paid in?Another unanswered Q.Since it was the UK I served and if that is gone who will pay and it willlose money for sure.

It will have to be changed from pound sterling to whatever ,and veterans will lose Thousands per person changing exchange rates.

If this stupid scheme was to happen, then there will most certainly be more losers than Winners, thats for sure.

I wouldn't worry to much everything will be fine, looks like westmidden has everything under control, the westmidden mob take no shit they are in charge..

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/banksandfinance/9536997/UK-banks-could-be-shut-down-or-forced-into-bail-outs-by-Brussels.html

[1690 Posts 71]

I agree, but, based on pretty much every proper vote on it, they dont. For me, the whole "can survive" thing is the crux, sure, it might, but, why survive when you can flourish? Thats the difference. If you look back historically, we are also absolutely shite at looking after ourselves, how many wars did we lose through infighting? indecisiveness? Yep, all the ones they teach you about in primary school.

You would have to create a new foreign policy, a new military, a new economy, a new government. How much do you think that would cost? Trade/export agreements, income and export tax levels, a form of national insurance or do we have to start paying for healthcare? how about public transport?

There are so many things need to be taken into account, yet, cant be because its all a fantasy at the moment. What will you do if the new foreign policy is to embrace republicanism? Herr Salmond is very cosy with McGuiness isnt he? hmm? I dont like that.

Flourish? You call the UK consistently languishing miles behind the Scandinavian countries in the standard of living index as "flourishing"? Bizarre stuff. Scotland would be run on a similar model to Scandinavia and would easily be placed higher than England and Wales on the standard of living index.

Sure we'd have to create a few things but that's not something to either be afraid of or something to avoid. What we would avoid is the almost nazi like approach of successive Westminster governments when it comes to foreign countries and taking one in the ass from Republican maniacs in the USA so we can remain their bestest fweinds.

[theiconicman 2,994]

Flourish? You call the UK consistently languishing miles behind the Scandinavian countries in the standard of living index as "flourishing"? Bizarre stuff. Scotland would be run on a similar model to Scandinavia and would easily be placed higher than England and Wales on the standard of living index.

Sure we'd have to create a few things but that's not something to either be afraid of or something to avoid. What we would avoid is the almost nazi like approach of successive Westminster governments when it comes to foreign countries and taking one in the ass from Republican maniacs in the USA so we can remain their bestest fweinds.

Yes, lets hold up the Scandinavian countries as a model (remember it was the 'tiger' economies of Ireland and Iceland Mr Salmond...) When it all goes tits up we can join the Scandinavians high suicide rate.

[Edmiston Drive 3,846]

Flourish? You call the UK consistently languishing miles behind the Scandinavian countries in the standard of living index as "flourishing"? Bizarre stuff. Scotland would be run on a similar model to Scandinavia and would easily be placed higher than England and Wales on the standard of living index.

Sure we'd have to create a few things but that's not something to either be afraid of or something to avoid. What we would avoid is the almost nazi like approach of successive Westminster governments when it comes to foreign countries and taking one in the ass from Republican maniacs in the USA so we can remain their bestest fweinds.

Yet a few years ago all the talk was , being run on a similar model to roi..............so what changed then?

[Bluepeter9 5,167]

"The emergency administration, which is meant to govern Italy until elections are due in 2013, is made up of bankers, lawyers and university professors but not a single elected official – an extraordinary development for a Western democracy."

There's much more to the story than covered in that article alone. If you're aware of it at all, then you would know how it came to be that Italy is presided over by appointed (non-elected) technocrats.

When did self-determination provide for unelected governments? Is this a policy the SNP are planning to implement?

Still waiting on that link or some back up to your assertion that this interim government was appointed by other countries - you know - your proof that Italy is no longer a soverign state?

Seems such a momentous news story you would think it would be easy to find some reference to it on the internet - but I cant (might be my fault of course ) - so either you were just having another typo-fart - or the news that Italy had its government appointed by other contry (or countries) has been obliterated from the internet.

[sonofbear 398]

Flourish? You call the UK consistently languishing miles behind the Scandinavian countries in the standard of living index as "flourishing"? Bizarre stuff. Scotland would be run on a similar model to Scandinavia and would easily be placed higher than England and Wales on the standard of living index.

Sure we'd have to create a few things but that's not something to either be afraid of or something to avoid. What we would avoid is the almost nazi like approach of successive Westminster governments when it comes to foreign countries and taking one in the ass from Republican maniacs in the USA so we can remain their bestest fweinds.

Oh that's great - I'll really look forward to spending over £10 pounds for a pint then eh

High standard of living my ass. Have you ever been to the Scandinavian countries ?

[outlaw69uk 123]

Flourish? You call the UK consistently languishing miles behind the Scandinavian countries in the standard of living index as "flourishing"? Bizarre stuff. Scotland would be run on a similar model to Scandinavia and would easily be placed higher than England and Wales on the standard of living index.

Sure we'd have to create a few things but that's not something to either be afraid of or something to avoid. What we would avoid is the almost nazi like approach of successive Westminster governments when it comes to foreign countries and taking one in the ass from Republican maniacs in the USA so we can remain their bestest fweinds.

So, you dont like Nazis and Republicans, yet, want to embrace the SNP who are having serious difficulties in differentiating between independence and republicanism themselves. Cosy chats with Sinn Fein, "nazi" like now laws that only effect a certain group of the population, utter hatred of England for no apparent reason, but hey! If thats what floats your boat, then knock yourself out. Some of your comments make me think you were dropped on your head a few times as a kid

[nachothelegend 1,932]

I wouldn't worry to much everything will be fine, looks like westmidden has everything under control, the westmidden mob take no shit they are in charge..

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/banksandfinance/9536997/UK-banks-could-be-shut-down-or-forced-into-bail-outs-by-Brussels.html

Is that the standard Nat answer dont worry ita nae bother.

Pathetic .

Yeh when this Independant fiasco is over then we should turn our focus on the EU and get out of it.

[outlaw69uk 123]

Just seen you're from Sheffield, is the Priory Hotel still on the go, think a German guy had it when we stayed there, pictures of Bannockburn and Scotland all over the walls, Scots guy owned it originally I believe. We had some rerr terrs in there, 24 hour bar fuckin ace.

I'm from Glasgow mate, but I live down here now. Priory Lodge Hotel? Thats still around yep, havent been in for years though haha

[outlaw69uk 123]

Oh that's great - I'll really look forward to spending over £10 pounds for a pint then eh

High standard of living my ass. Have you ever been to the Scandinavian countries ?

Haha, indeed! Have a few friends in Sweden and Finland, and, hmmm, cant say I fancy it for more than a visit

[ray 105]

Is that the standard Nat answer dont worry ita nae bother.

Pathetic .

Yeh when this Independant fiasco is over then we should turn our focus on the EU and get out of it.

You better tell slippery and all the other robbin' bastards at westmidden, I fear you may be told to "get tae fuck"

[Bluepeter9 5,167]

Oh that's great - I'll really look forward to spending over £10 pounds for a pint then eh

High standard of living my ass. Have you ever been to the Scandinavian countries ?

Someone on here earlier was wondering how the post independant NHS in Scotland could cope, one of the ways would be to copy the Public Health initiative in Finland that has run and taken their health as a nation from one of the worst to one of the best - if paying more for alcohol is one of the prices we have to pay for a healthier nation then I would have no real issues with it.

Scandinavia, overall has a much better health record than the UK.

Oh and I also have been to those countries (often) and they are great places to be - not perfect but pretty good.

THere are also other countries of a similar size to ours doing OK in the EU.

Oh and name one country that has NO issues ? Independance wont create a utopia - but it will give us a greater degree of control over our own lives and a chance to look at some of our issues (like health) and provide more targeted solutions.

[MosesMcNeil 1,664]

Still waiting

Please hold your breath. I'm not your research assistant.

However, this is but one example of the information available to anyone interested.

"Indeed, the European Central Bank had demanded austerity measures be implemented by the governments of Greece, Ireland, Portugal, and Italy, and when Berlusconi submitted to the mandate from the central bankers, he complained that it made his administration look like “an occupied government.”

A leading liberal MP in Italy, Antonio Di Pietro, said that, “Italy is under the tutelage of the EU, and a country under tutelage is not a free and democratic one.”

An Irish MEP (Member of the European Parliament), Paul Murphy, stated that there had been a “massive shift away from democratic accountability since the start of the crisis,” and that: “There needs to be a check on the enormous power of the ECB, which is unelected, and has basically held a government to ransom.”

That it was an international story of such import that you missed it, and now can't be arsed checking the details surrounding the imposition of unelected technocrats tells more of your idiocy than anything else.

Additional, personal declarations of your rank stupidity are as welcome as they are expected.

[theiconicman 2,994]

Scandinavia, overall has a much better health record than the UK.

Yep healthier than us right up until they commit suicide.

[keithgersbear 3,225]

Oh and name one country that has NO issues ? Independance wont create a utopia - but it will give us a greater degree of control over our own lives and a chance to look at some of our issues (like health) and provide more targeted solutions.

And what currency will you use? The Euro? It is falling apart.

[MosesMcNeil 1,664]

And what currency will you use? The Euro? It is falling apart.

It would be easier to sell an empty glass to a man dying of thirst than the Euro to voting Scots.

Salmond and his nation breakers know this.

And so they are begging for the Sterling - and with it a complete acceptance that matters such as setting interest rates and money supply will be controlled by another country.

Or, more simply, they cannot attain independence in any meaningful sense. And they know it.

[Edmiston Drive 3,846]

It would be easier to sell an empty glass to a man dying of thirst than the Euro to voting Scots.

Salmond and his nation breakers know this.

And so they are begging for the Sterling - and with it a complete acceptance that matters such as setting interest rates and money supply will be controlled by another country.

Or, more simply, they cannot attain independence in any meaningful sense. And they know it.

The See You Jimmy Tanner

[Bluepeter9 5,167]

Please hold your breath. I'm not your research assistant.

However, this is but one example of the information available to anyone interested.

"Indeed, the European Central Bank had demanded austerity measures be implemented by the governments of Greece, Ireland, Portugal, and Italy, and when Berlusconi submitted to the mandate from the central bankers, he complained that it made his administration look like "an occupied government."

A leading liberal MP in Italy, Antonio Di Pietro, said that, "Italy is under the tutelage of the EU, and a country under tutelage is not a free and democratic one."

An Irish MEP (Member of the European Parliament), Paul Murphy, stated that there had been a "massive shift away from democratic accountability since the start of the crisis," and that: "There needs to be a check on the enormous power of the ECB, which is unelected, and has basically held a government to ransom."

That it was an international story of such import that you missed it, and now can't be arsed checking the details surrounding the imposition of unelected technocrats tells more of your idiocy than anything else.

Additional, personal declarations of your rank stupidity are as welcome as they are expected.

So, basically, you have NOTHING to back up your assertions - nothing ya da - How sad - lying AGAIN to make a point and squirming like fk when caught AGAIN - Love it!

[Bluepeter9 5,167]

Yep healthier than us right up until they commit suicide.

It aint that much difference - especially if you exclude the Inuit based people - who have an issue all over the Northern Countries - now I wonder when you add up deaths from suicide and deaths from bad health - I wonder what that would say !

Anyway as I said no country is a Utopia - every country has issues - its the ability to tackle those problems that I think we can start to address post independance.

[MosesMcNeil 1,664]

So, basically, you have NOTHING to back up your assertions - nothing ya da - How sad - lying AGAIN to make a point and squirming like fk when caught AGAIN - Love it!

That's incredible

Can't you read? Did you simply refuse to acknowledge the content of my post? Especially the quotes from the Italian minister? Just how much of a void rests between the ears on your fat head?

Perhaps a paper of no less import than the Financial Times will suffice.

"In early November, as democratically-elected governments in Greece and Italy were replaced with unelected and unaccountable technocratic governments, essentially run by and for the European Union and global banks, Tony Barber, writing in the Financial Times, suggested that this is but one of several responses to the economic crisis.

Specifically, this response “involves the surgical removal of elected leaders in Greece and Italy and their replacement with technocratic experts, trusted within the EU to pass economic reforms deemed appropriate by policymakers in Berlin, the bloc’s top paymaster, and at EU headquarters in Brussels.”

Nothing was it?

Prick

[will_1974 204]

I've always been equally proud to be both Scottish and British. My political views have changed considerably over the past few months. The campaign to destroy Rangers has exposed the level of influence individuals and groups of a certain persuasion have over so much of Scotland. I fear this will continue to evolve and grow to the point where I would feel like an unwelcome guest in my own country. My outlook on independence now is that it would be disastrous for the people of Scotland. Continued devolution with perhaps a bit more power would be my preferred choice.

[Bluepeter9 5,167]

That's incredible

Can't you read? Did you simply refuse to acknowledge the content of my post? Especially the quotes from the Italian minister? Just how much of a void rests between the ears on your fat head?

Perhaps a paper of no less import than the Financial Times will suffice.

"In early November, as democratically-elected governments in Greece and Italy were replaced with unelected and unaccountable technocratic governments, essentially run by and for the European Union and global banks, Tony Barber, writing in the Financial Times, suggested that this is but one of several responses to the economic crisis.

Specifically, this response "involves the surgical removal of elected leaders in Greece and Italy and their replacement with technocratic experts, trusted within the EU to pass economic reforms deemed appropriate by policymakers in Berlin, the bloc's top paymaster, and at EU headquarters in Brussels."

Nothing was it?

Prick

My goodness you do like to twist a quote and squirm - anything but back up what you said - nothing in what you post in anyway backs up what you have said.

These technocrat Governments were NOT appointed by other countries. These technocrat governments are the way these countries deal with / are dealing with the fact that there is a power vacuum after their leaders resigned - because it was either resign or pull out of the Euro (which they could have done as Sovereign countries) instead they decided (i.e. under their OWN) control to resign and until new elections are held these interim governments are in place.

The only part of the quotes that comes even close to helping you - (i.e. the part you are clinging to) is ".... essentially run by and for the European Union and global banks ...." which is an opinion of the out come of what happened as part of the ongoing Euro crisis. The interim Governments are an acknowledgement that these countries want to stay withing the Euro but the leadership that resigned could not deliver or would not deliver the reforms required to do so - and fell upon their swords. That's it.

Your assertion was the Italian Government was APPOINTED by another country (or countries) and you just wiggle on the hook as this is a WRONG statement and you have NOTHING to back it up - nada - fk all. Squirm all you want, contrive all you want but as of yet you have not backed up your statement.