Pedro, is he the man to stop the rot ?

[The Dude 20,026]

Just now, Turnberry18 said:

If that's the case then Dude, why did he not go on to bigger and better things after that?

Sometimes you need to take a step back to go forward.

[Smile 26,610]

2 hours ago, Orange Persson said:

You cannot get rid of a guy who has not made a signing. This has to run now through next season. 

 If he has to go, then at least he will have had a chance to implement his ideas with a modified team.  I have doubts about him but time will tell. He was a gamble and we went for this impressive flamboyance once again.  That may have been gullible, but to sack him now and throw a four year salary at him with MW's pathetic team? Can't do that.

 

We did it with McCall.

[Turnberry18 3,204]

2 minutes ago, the_r_sole said:

what I'm saying is that looking at the stats of any manager isn't a way to judge whether they would be successful with us - walter smith was a very successful manager here but his record is not good from everton, so if you look at how he performed when it was for a mid-table team in a more competitive league, it would suggest he's not that great. So looking at the records of managers in isolation doesn't tell you how suitable they would be for this club.

It wasn't me suggesting to use managers previous records to judge them... but it just shows you what some of our better recent managers "records" are outside of us

 

I take your second point, that's fair. As regards Walter's achievements at Everton, in the context of that club at the time it could be argued he brought stability to them when they were in a tough situation.

[Turnberry18 3,204]

1 minute ago, The Dude said:

Sometimes you need to take a step back to go forward.

That's one way of looking at it; but I would assume that if he had got a side performing so well then he may have taken a step up.

[The Dude 20,026]

3 minutes ago, Turnberry18 said:

Just after checking, did Santos not get to the final of that competition the year before he arrived also? That might indicate that he inherited a very good side already. It's still an achievement for them to get to that final, possibly.

They did although inheriting a good side is no guarantee of success if you're a shite manager. Just look at Davie Moyes. Inherited a PL winning team and was sacked before the season was out.

[The Dude 20,026]

2 minutes ago, Smile said:

We did it with McCall.

McCall was an interim manager with a short-term contract.

[the_r_sole 366]

Just now, Turnberry18 said:

I take your second point, that's fair. As regards Walter's achievements at Everton, in the context of that club at the time it could be argued he brought stability to them when they were in a tough situation.

yeah, I know, but that's why judging his record tells you nothing about his quality as a manager - all I'm really saying is that on paper Pedro has a better record than either eck or walter - by christ it would be fuckin tremendous if he could do some good work here!

[Turnberry18 3,204]

2 minutes ago, The Dude said:

They did although inheriting a good side is no guarantee of success if you're a shite manager. Just look at Davie Moyes. Inherited a PL winning team and was sacked before the season was out.

I hope you're right Dude, and I'm wrong. I have my doubts about that though.

[The Dude 20,026]

2 minutes ago, Turnberry18 said:

That's one way of looking at it; but I would assume that if he had got a side performing so well then he may have taken a step up.

A lot of it depends on how everything stands when he was unemployed and his long-term plans. He can't take a job that's not open and from what I can see he doesn't seem the sort who just sits around waiting for the right job to open. Another factor is the fact he was managing in Mexico. With the exception of one or two clubs he's not going to get much bigger or better in North America (Mexican clubs dominate CONCACAF) and South America is much the same. There's a handful of big clubs. Europeans are largely ignorant of football on the other side of the Atlantic

[Turnberry18 3,204]

Just now, The Dude said:

A lot of it depends on how everything stands when he was unemployed and his long-term plans. He can't take a job that's not open and from what I can see he doesn't seem the sort who just sits around waiting for the right job to open. Another factor is the fact he was managing in Mexico. With the exception of one or two clubs he's not going to get much bigger or better in North America (Mexican clubs dominate CONCACAF) and South America is much the same. There's a handful of big clubs. Europeans are largely ignorant of football on the other side of the Atlantic

You're right, and that could be a plausible reason. 

[dougaaley 28]

If he was the miracle worker that people are hoping for he would be at a bigger club.

He can only work with what he has, and MW didn't sign a lot of quality.

I'm optimistic with what I have seen with the Hamilton and Aberdeen games.

He should be given a shot with a squad he chooses

[The Dude 20,026]

1 minute ago, Turnberry18 said:

You're right, and that could be a plausible reason. 

Just a wee example that's kinda related. I was in Chicago last month and went to a Chicago Fire game (wearing a Rangers top) and ended up in amongst the hispanic supporters group 'Sector Latino' and more than a few recognised the shirt and struck up conversations about Caixinha with me. Every one of them said he was a good choice.

Now, if a Mexican was at Ibrox wearing a Monterrey shirt would anyone have a clue what it was, let alone know who they had appointed as manager a few days prior?

[The Tavernator 279]

13 minutes ago, Turnberry18 said:

Just after checking, did Santos not get to the final of that competition the year before he arrived also? That might indicate that he inherited a very good side already. It's still an achievement for them to get to that final, possibly.

I work with a Mexican guy who's a fan of Le Tigres, and he was hoping PC would go to his team when he was still in Mexico as he had such a great reputation. He said he took a team with pretty average players and made them very successful.

He's hardly been in the job here. He's learning what it means to manage Rangers as I'm sure the hatred in Scotland is worse than he's come across anywhere. I'm sure he'll be successful but he doesn't have a magic wand or 20 million to spend. There is no immediate solution.

[bluenose_n1 536]

The problem is that what this group of players require can't be provided by any manager

they are spineless shitebags

to lightweight for our game up here so no manager can help that

no desire no manager can help that

no self respect to go out and not embarrass themselves again no manager can help that

warburton bought a certain type of player to play a certain type of way and it was fundamentally flawed for the game up here

if it was me in charge I would've went 451 miller up front himself and flood the midfield as I'm a believer that's where the game is won or lost 

 

 

[Turnberry18 3,204]

Just now, The Dude said:

Just a wee example that's kinda related. I was in Chicago last month and went to a Chicago Fire game (wearing a Rangers top) and ended up in amongst the hispanic supporters group 'Sector Latino' and more than a few recognised the shirt and struck up conversations about Caixinha with me. Every one of them said he was a good choice.

Now, if a Mexican was at Ibrox wearing a Monterrey shirt would anyone have a clue what it was, let alone know who they had appointed as manager a few days prior?

A great story that, I love hearing that kind of thing; and it's happened with family members, where people recognise the shirt/t-shirt etc and want to chat about the club.  He might find it hard being so ruthless in our game, that concerns me a little, and maybe there are indications that there may be discontent with his methods already?

[Turnberry18 3,204]

4 minutes ago, The Tavernator said:

I work with a Mexican guy who's a fan of Le Tigres, and he was hoping PC would go to his team when he was still in Mexico as he had such a great reputation. He said he took a team with pretty average players and made them very successful.

He's hardly been in the job here. He's learning what it means to manage Rangers as I'm sure the hatred in Scotland is worse than he's come across anywhere. I'm sure he'll be successful but he doesn't have a magic wand or 20 million to spend. There is no immediate solution.

Hopefully we can agree that if he is to be here for any great length of time then he will need backing of some sort for an immediate impact.

[The Dude 20,026]

2 minutes ago, Turnberry18 said:

A great story that, I love hearing that kind of thing; and it's happened with family members, where people recognise the shirt/t-shirt etc and want to chat about the club.  He might find it hard being so ruthless in our game, that concerns me a little, and maybe there are indications that there may be discontent with his methods already?

If there's discontent with his methods (based purely on my own interactions with some of the players and seeing them 'work' at Auchenhowie pre-Caixinha) I'd be inclined to believe that's more about the players' mentality and dedication than Caixinha's methods.

[cushynumber 25,178]

Just now, The Tavernator said:

I work with a Mexican guy who's a fan of Le Tigres, and he was hoping PC would go to his team when he was still in Mexico as he had such a great reputation. He said he took a team with pretty average players and made them very successful.

He's hardly been in the job here. He's learning what it means to manage Rangers as I'm sure the hatred in Scotland is worse than he's come across anywhere. I'm sure he'll be successful but he doesn't have a magic wand or 20 million to spend. There is no immediate solution.

I'm not expecting an immediate solution. I'm expecting not to suffer our our worst home defeat in a gazillion years.

[Turnberry18 3,204]

4 minutes ago, The Dude said:

If there's discontent with his methods (based purely on my own interactions with some of the players and seeing them 'work' at Auchenhowie pre-Caixinha) I'd be inclined to believe that's more about the players' mentality and dedication than Caixinha's methods.

He might need many of these players on board though. I thought he gave slightly implicit criticism of them yesterday, slightly similar to the reason you have gave. It will be interesting how that particular aspect of his role plays out.

[cushynumber 25,178]

Just now, The Dude said:

If there's discontent with his methods (based purely on my own interactions with some of the players and seeing them 'work' at Auchenhowie pre-Caixinha) I'd be inclined to believe that's more about the players' mentality and dedication than Caixinha's methods.

Nowadays is a symbiotic relationship. If the players don't want to work for you, your time is up. Tactics and formations seem secondary to getting the team on your side. I don't envy his job,  but I see little to suggest he is the answer.

I'm starting to think he has the job more because of his contacts than anything else.

[MisterBlueSky 259]

Give Pedro at least 18 months.

He has a massive job to do.

Even when he signs new players it will take time to settle in and adjust.

We won't be winning the league next season it will be another 20 points plus. It's just where we are.

[KingKirk 25,647]

Alot of people seem to be given pedro a lot of stick over yesterday. Its one of two things for me Either you believe pedro was magic or you believe this squad was better than they really where 

Fact is this squad isn't up to it mentally or ability wise no amount of tactical work will change that fact until the gaffer gets his own lads in then he can't be judged 

[The Dude 20,026]

Just now, cushynumber said:

Nowadays is a symbiotic relationship. If the players don't want to work for you, your time is up. Tactics and formations seem secondary to getting the team on your side. I don't envy his job,  but I see little to suggest he is the answer.

I'm starting to think he has the job more because of his contacts than anything else.

I largely agree with that but, like most things with me there's a but, when you take over someone else's squad and don't get an opportunity to make changes for several months it'll normally be stretched out over a longer period and they'll get a grace period to make changes and bring their own guys in. If they STILL don't want to work for you then a managerial change will happen. I think too that, with this squad, there's a certain complacency with them as many don't face any direct competition for their place. They can be utter gash most weeks and, barring bringing a kid up from the 20s ahead of 'schedule', they wont be replaced.

[ForeverAndEver 71,502]

1 hour ago, The Dude said:

Which 'known' manager should we have went after?

edit: I take it by know you mean the lazy, on our doorstep answer?

Frank De Boer, Harry Redknapp, Gary Rowett.

[The Dude 20,026]

Just now, ForeverAndEver said:

Frank De Boer, Harry Redknapp, Gary Rowett.

So Rowett that's achieved nothing yet, Redknapp who hasn't exactly been a roaring success (not to mention his dodgy tax practices), FdB wasn't interested in even speaking to Rangers unless we'd let him sit on his arse for a few months first then take charge a couple weeks before the Europa League qualifiers.