The league must be voided

[Bears r us 30,796]

34 minutes ago, mitre_mouldmaster said:

We would also fall into that category. We would be being denied the opportunity to win the league and have a shot at qualifying for a competition worth about 20m for qualifying.

Yes if we have the courage to fight it. 

[HG5 11,113]

4 minutes ago, The Dude said:

Totally agree. The one I asked privately, I have a lifelong relationship with, so trust they're not 'playing' me with their response. 

The answer is almost certainly the one decided in court in this case. Tbh, I've said all along that it will be open to challenge, although I'm far from convinced any challenge would succeed. 

 

Probably a good opinion in that case - unfortunately the ‘other side’ will probably come up with a good one too🙈

Just have to fight it tooth & nail & hope for the best!

[The Dude 20,026]

Just now, SeparateEntityMyArse said:

But its crucial in terms of number of games in a season or it wouldnt be there. Like you mentioned dates didnt specify exact dates.

If a team win the league when a season ends, and 38 games shall be played in that season then that's simple. If its 38 games shall be played in a season but a season is actually up to 38 games that's contradictory.

I'm sure you see that, cant really explain it, but may indeed not see it as relevant. If it's not them I'm hopeful your folk tomorrow could qualify why the definition of season cant be transposed into a rule specifying a specific number of games.

A Season in normal circumstances is 38 games. Absolutely, however the board can decide that, if circumstances dictate, that can be ended early. 

I've even now directly quoted a sports lawyer saying that the board has the discretion to end the Season early. 

I 100% agree that rules says the Premiership will be 38 games. Totally agree with you on that. But that doesn't negate the board having the discretion to end it early.

With the board having that discretion to end the Season, it then means rule C38 kicks in and the standings are final. 

Again, it's down to the definition of Season, not the actual format of the competition. 

If the SPFL have that position wrong then its up to clubs to challenge that. From the people I've heard from and now seen publicly quoted, I dont think any challenge would be successful, but that would be up to a court to decide. 

[Bad Robot 21,150]

Scottish sports media hacks haven’t got a clue 99% of the time and are only in jobs due to their bs trolling so fk knows why anyone thinks they have got a clue what’s coming out the uefa meeting on Tuesday 😂😂

[Bad Robot 21,150]

1 minute ago, The Dude said:

A Season in normal circumstances is 38 games. Absolutely, however the board can decide that, if circumstances dictate, that can be ended early. 

I've even now directly quoted a sports lawyer saying that the board has the discretion to end the Season early. 

I 100% agree that rules says the Premiership will be 38 games. Totally agree with you on that. But that doesn't negate the board having the discretion to end it early.

With the board having that discretion to end the Season, it then means rule C38 kicks in and the standings are final. 

Again, it's down to the definition of Season, not the actual format of the competition. 

If the SPFL have that position wrong then its up to clubs to challenge that. From the people I've heard from and now seen publicly quoted, I dont think any challenge would be successful, but that would be up to a court to decide. 

Was the lawyer a simple paper gatherer 😂😂

[The Dude 20,026]

1 minute ago, HG5 said:

Probably a good opinion in that case - unfortunately the ‘other side’ will probably come up with a good one too🙈

Just have to fight it tooth & nail & hope for the best!

Thats a big part of why I'm confident in what I've heard. She obviously said it's open to challenge simply given the nature of it being a rulebook and not a legal decision but between the relationship and position professionally, I have zero reason to doubt it. 

Add in a few people at clubs also telling me and colleagues the same (including ones represented on the SPFL board), the weight of believability and credibility falls heavily to one side. 

Im sure another poster said the had heard the same in that the SPFL will be taking the tables as they stand. 

Obviously it could all change with one meeting but, them NOT being awarded the title is very unlikely. 

[The Dude 20,026]

4 minutes ago, Bad Robot said:

Was the lawyer a simple paper gatherer 😂😂

No. FAR from it. 

[The Dude 20,026]

6 minutes ago, Bad Robot said:

Scottish sports media hacks haven’t got a clue 99% of the time and are only in jobs due to their bs trolling so fk knows why anyone thinks they have got a clue what’s coming out the uefa meeting on Tuesday 😂😂

Have any of them said they know what's coming out of the UEFA meeting? 

[HG5 11,113]

2 minutes ago, The Dude said:

Thats a big part of why I'm confident in what I've heard. She obviously said it's open to challenge simply given the nature of it being a rulebook and not a legal decision but between the relationship and position professionally, I have zero reason to doubt it. 

Add in a few people at clubs also telling me and colleagues the same (including ones represented on the SPFL board), the weight of believability and credibility falls heavily to one side. 

Im sure another poster said the had heard the same in that the SPFL will be taking the tables as they stand. 

Obviously it could all change with one meeting but, them NOT being awarded the title is very unlikely. 

Have to hope there’s a way through to getting the league concluded, then.

Make the bastards work for it, at least.

[The Dude 20,026]

25 minutes ago, Dave Hedgehog said:

The season should 100% be null and void. 

You simply cannot give to one and take away from another.

It is then based on an unbalanced system which would have no integrity and will turn fans away from paying their hard earned money into a sham.

You can't void it then. You'd be giving to one and taking away from another. 

[SeparateEntityMyArse 53,723]

4 minutes ago, The Dude said:

A Season in normal circumstances is 38 games. Absolutely, however the board can decide that, if circumstances dictate, that can be ended early. 

I've even now directly quoted a sports lawyer saying that the board has the discretion to end the Season early. 

I 100% agree that rules says the Premiership will be 38 games. Totally agree with you on that. But that doesn't negate the board having the discretion to end it early.

With the board having that discretion to end the Season, it then means rule C38 kicks in and the standings are final. 

Again, it's down to the definition of Season, not the actual format of the competition. 

If the SPFL have that position wrong then its up to clubs to challenge that. From the people I've heard from and now seen publicly quoted, I dont think any challenge would be successful, but that would be up to a court to decide. 

Where does it say in the rules in normal circs? It is within rules and regs specifically determining a number of games, the number mentioned is unequivocal, its apparently the definition which alters this.

I hear and read what you and the legal guy say. He may or may not have said it in isolation basee on the definition only.

Where does it say c38 kicks in over C13?

Basic English is that a definition of a noun should fit into a sentence containing that noun not contradict it. I'm asking for clarification as it's not a pissy rule it's pretty central to the debate given it mentions a number of games to be played in a season.

It shouldn't be difficult to explain it in layman's terms for me and given c13 is being quoted on here and all over SM it should be explained to us. If you've the opportunity, why wouldn't you.

[The Dude 20,026]

Just now, SeparateEntityMyArse said:

Where does it say in the rules in normal circs? It is within rules and regs specifically determining a number of games, the number mentioned is unequivocal, its apparently the definition which alters this.

I hear and read what you and the legal guy say. He may or may not have said it in isolation basee on the definition only.

Where does it say c38 kicks in over C13?

Basic English is that a definition of a noun should fit into a sentence containing that noun not contradict it. I'm asking for clarification as it's not a pissy rule it's pretty central to the debate given it mentions a number of games to be played in a season.

It shouldn't be difficult to explain it in layman's terms for me and given c13 is being quoted on here and all over SM it should be explained to us. If you've the opportunity, why wouldn't you.

A3. 

 

[Tomatasauce 1,253]

15 minutes ago, The Dude said:

A Season in normal circumstances is 38 games. Absolutely, however the board can decide that, if circumstances dictate, that can be ended early. 

I've even now directly quoted a sports lawyer saying that the board has the discretion to end the Season early. 

I 100% agree that rules says the Premiership will be 38 games. Totally agree with you on that. But that doesn't negate the board having the discretion to end it early.

With the board having that discretion to end the Season, it then means rule C38 kicks in and the standings are final. 

Again, it's down to the definition of Season, not the actual format of the competition. 

If the SPFL have that position wrong then its up to clubs to challenge that. From the people I've heard from and now seen publicly quoted, I dont think any challenge would be successful, but that would be up to a court to decide. 

I didn’t know you could win 3/4 of a title but I suppose anything is possible these days as long as it benefits the tarriers

[GA1972 9,556]

We all know what will happen, SFA will put it to a vote to wash their hands of the situation 

10 clubs will vote for the league table to stand 

Us and Hearts will vote against 

[MurrayWilson 3,393]

15 minutes ago, The Dude said:

You can't void it then. You'd be giving to one and taking away from another. 

No youre not , you cant have something taken off you that you never had.

[The Dude 20,026]

Just now, MurrayWilson said:

No youre not , you cant have something taken off you that you never had.

Teams had however many points they had won this season. Inverness had a cup final to look forward to. So did Partick. 

[Dickie 12,905]

I don’t know when you last posted on here before this virus thread but I do know it’s the most you’ve posted on here in all my time on this forum and it’s exclusively you defending the right of the scum to be crowned champions. Even if I believed they deserved to be champions I would argue to until the cows come home that it didn’t happen. You are obviously not stupid so should you not be better off looking at laws to stop these cunts being crowned champions rather than agreeing with everything that a tarrier controlled football organization tells you?  Your podcast pissed me off but I now think you’re either at the cunt or are the worst type off Uncle Tom.

[writingranger 1,413]

51 minutes ago, The Dude said:

Because their belief is that there won't be an opportunity to play in July. The consensus seems to be around clubs that it's August at the earliest. 

With nine rounds of games left, there will also be worries over players fitness trying to cram those games in, then going straight into the new league season 

Fair enough. Although there could be agreement for a truncated season of 19 matches.

On balance though, I can see the logic of simply ending the season.

[MurrayWilson 3,393]

5 minutes ago, The Dude said:

Teams had however many points they had won this season. Inverness had a cup final to look forward to. So did Partick. 

Nobody as of yet have won anything other than the league cup. Its tough, but there you go.

[SeparateEntityMyArse 53,723]

19 minutes ago, The Dude said:

A3. 

 

Each Rule shall be construed separately and, if any Rule or provision in these Rules may prove to be illegal, invalid or unenforceable for any reason, such illegality, invalidity or unenforceability shall not affect the remaining Rules which shall continue in full force and effect.

 

But which rule is invalid, illegal or unenforceable based on your definitions and interpretations?

If none so far according to you are wrong then why would c38 supercede c13?

Why couldnt the definition be unenforceable with c13 enforceable?

 

[The Dude 20,026]

3 minutes ago, Dickie said:

I don’t know when you last posted on here before this virus thread but I do know it’s the most you’ve posted on here in all my time on this forum and it’s exclusively you defending the right of the scum to be crowned champions. Even if I believed they deserved to be champions I would argue to until the cows come home that it didn’t happen. You are obviously not stupid so should you not be better off looking at laws to stop these cunts being crowned champions rather than agreeing with everything that a tarrier controlled football organization tells you?  Your podcast pissed me off but I now think you’re either at the cunt or are the worst type off Uncle Tom.

Couple of days ago was the last time I was on. Certainly not the most i've posted on here since you joined in 2013. You must've missed the many blog or podcast threads. Almost certain the MOH/no show one will have been another one.

It's not the SPFL directly who have told me but people at clubs and someone independent of it all has agreed that interpretation is the correct one. There's now been another lawyer quoted saying the same.

As I've said time and again, I couldn't particularly care less if they get the title this season. I do think it would be unfair on more clubs down the ladder to void the season.

Having had a look at the rules, I've not seen anything in them that convinces me more than the 'expert' (for want of a better word) opinion I've heard from someone I trust implicitly.

 

[Bad Robot 21,150]

33 minutes ago, The Dude said:

Have any of them said they know what's coming out of the UEFA meeting? 

Were you not posting earlier about uefa 

[Howsitgoing 4,281]

5 minutes ago, SeparateEntityMyArse said:

Each Rule shall be construed separately and, if any Rule or provision in these Rules may prove to be illegal, invalid or unenforceable for any reason, such illegality, invalidity or unenforceability shall not affect the remaining Rules which shall continue in full force and effect.

 

But which rule is invalid, illegal or unenforceable based on your definitions and interpretations?

If none so far according to you are wrong then why would c38 supercede c13?

Why couldnt the definition be unenforceable with c13 enforceable?

 

“In contract law, a severable contract is a contract that is actually composed of several separate contracts concluded between the same parties, so that failing (breaching) one part of such a 'severable' contract does not breach the whole contract.“

Are what they are trying to claim that C13 isn’t enforceable so will be breached but the other rules will still be held to account.

How then can it be enforceable to end a season on the premise that they are considering, the rule of 38 games shall be played is fundamental to the final winner. 

 

 

[The Dude 20,026]

1 minute ago, SeparateEntityMyArse said:

Each Rule shall be construed separately and, if any Rule or provision in these Rules may prove to be illegal, invalid or unenforceable for any reason, such illegality, invalidity or unenforceability shall not affect the remaining Rules which shall continue in full force and effect.

 

But which rule is invalid, illegal or unenforceable based on your definitions and interpretations?

If none so far according to you are wrong then why would c38 supercede c13?

Why couldnt the definition be unenforceable with c13 enforceable?

 

Let's work on the basis here that the remaining games will not be rescheduled - which is the current position the SPFL are taking.

C13 is now unenforceable as there is no way the clubs will play the 38 games. Agreed?

"The remaining rules which shall continue in full force and effect."

So now it's on to C38 and how the final rankings and Champion Clubs are determined.  The Champion Club has most points at the end of the Season (this is where the league's definition of Season comes in and the 'or otherwise determined' phrase).

There's no way the season can end on the date of the final league game as it will never take place so the SPFL will determine, let's say Tuesday, as the final day of the Season.

celtic will have the most points (or be in first or whatever the specific wording is in C38 (on my phone so can't c&p it)) at the end of the Season and Hearts will have the fewest, and so on down all four divisions.

 

 

[The Dude 20,026]

10 minutes ago, Bad Robot said:

Were you not posting earlier about uefa 

I posted earlier what I think they'll do based on various media reports, speaking to various people and my own opinion. Never once claimed that's what they are definitively doing or that I know UEFA's position on domestic competitions.