Walt: I won't wreck Fleck

[Muff 245]

He'll move to a bigger league anyway

[papaguy51 912]

If you were a 17 year old Gers fan playing for your heroes, would hunger be an issue to you?

No, but in a few years time after achieving so much at a young age, he wants to move to a bigger league. Maybe we are trying to keep him for as long as possible?

So, in a sense, you're allowing the management team to try and limit what Fleck could achieve in case he gets a move away from the club?

God help the youngsters if that's our policy.

[rfc_no1fan 13]

Its good management, and I didnt think I would say that about Walter.

Ive said it before and I'll say it again, 3 games in, 2 on the bench. Then bleed Aaron into the team.

Each getting valuable first team experience and learning the game up to a stage where they can both play a big part. Young players form can be erratic and keeping them motivated and hungry is half the battle

If you were a 17 year old Gers fan playing for your heroes, would hunger be an issue to you?

No, but I might think that I have made it after 2-3 good games and start getting lazy

I might give everything that I have and burn myself out quickly

I might try so hard that I failed and never each my potential.

Fleck will be a better player by playing a few games, resting and then coming back again

[NOLUWDC 1]

“For instance, while he had a couple of attempts at goal against Aberdeen there were other times when he was looking to pass to others first, rather than taking on the shot himself.

Sorry Walter but half the team do that.

I do agree with him about Fleck not taking a shot. There was one time he was 20 yards out and decided to pass instead of shooting but I think that was because he had 2 shots just before and didn't want to appear as being greedy. I would play him till the end of the season tbh. He's better than a lot of our squad at the moment and I would love to see him start against Celtic. I've never heard of burn-out after 3 games though.

[RyanMac 185]

If you were a 17 year old Gers fan playing for your heroes, would hunger be an issue to you?

No, but in a few years time after achieving so much at a young age, he wants to move to a bigger league. Maybe we are trying to keep him for as long as possible?

So, in a sense, you're allowing the management team to try and limit what Fleck could achieve in case he gets a move away from the club?

God help the youngsters if that's our policy.

Not how i feel about it, only how i percieve the managements thinking.

Ive never fully understood why you wouldn't play a better player because of the age. Would this happen in any other industry?

[papaguy51 912]

Its good management, and I didnt think I would say that about Walter.

Ive said it before and I'll say it again, 3 games in, 2 on the bench. Then bleed Aaron into the team.

Each getting valuable first team experience and learning the game up to a stage where they can both play a big part. Young players form can be erratic and keeping them motivated and hungry is half the battle

If you were a 17 year old Gers fan playing for your heroes, would hunger be an issue to you?

No, but I might think that I have made it after 2-3 good games and start getting lazy

I might give everything that I have and burn myself out quickly

I might try so hard that I failed and never each my potential.

Fleck will be a better player by playing a few games, resting and then coming back again

By all accounts, we keep being informed that Fleck is the 'once in a decade' player that a youth system rarely produces.

He should be judged on his performances, just as all our players should.

[papaguy51 912]

If you were a 17 year old Gers fan playing for your heroes, would hunger be an issue to you?

No, but in a few years time after achieving so much at a young age, he wants to move to a bigger league. Maybe we are trying to keep him for as long as possible?

So, in a sense, you're allowing the management team to try and limit what Fleck could achieve in case he gets a move away from the club?

God help the youngsters if that's our policy.

Not how i feel about it, only how i percieve the managements thinking.

Ive never fully understood why you wouldn't play a better player because of the age. Would this happen in any other industry?

It's against the law in most other industries.

Age Discrimination or whatever it's called nowadays.

[rfc_no1fan 13]

Its good management, and I didnt think I would say that about Walter.

Ive said it before and I'll say it again, 3 games in, 2 on the bench. Then bleed Aaron into the team.

Each getting valuable first team experience and learning the game up to a stage where they can both play a big part. Young players form can be erratic and keeping them motivated and hungry is half the battle

If you were a 17 year old Gers fan playing for your heroes, would hunger be an issue to you?

No, but I might think that I have made it after 2-3 good games and start getting lazy

I might give everything that I have and burn myself out quickly

I might try so hard that I failed and never each my potential.

Fleck will be a better player by playing a few games, resting and then coming back again

By all accounts, we keep being informed that Fleck is the 'once in a decade' player that a youth system rarely produces.

He should be judged on his performances, just as all our players should.

Its a chance for Walter to bring in 2 youngsters Fleck + Aaron and rotate them accordingly.

Fleck should have been played sooner, but this is the situation we find ourselves in at present. It will be good in the long term (If we can hold on to him) but we are all crying out for short term success.

Walter will probably play McCulloch/Adam when Fleck isnt there, which isnt the way forward. Fleck or Aaron from now to the end of the season 2-3 games each and a few sub appearances as well.

Left mid is the easiest position in the Rangers team as we have had some amount of dross playing there for the last 5 years.

[cooper1989 0]

If I was Fleck and I read some of that shite that Walter said... My confidence would be gone. At the very least... Walter is saying he WILL fail at some point -- so might as well take him out of the team.

You're not MOTM at IBROX for nothing (except Barry). But seriously... MOTM at 17. Then the Manager spouts shite about being young and implies failure soon?

Fuck off Walter... You're well past it amigo.

[TexasGers 96]

Fleck is very young, and could be prone to being inconsistent, as most other youngsters are that are thrown into the first team. The question is, if Fleck gets into a prolonged slump, would we want him dropped from the team?

Having Fleck play on a more consistent basis is like having a new signing. I know its very early for knee jerk reactions regarding Fleck, but his presence could be a factor that decides where the title goes this year.

FFS - no pressure on him them. This is a player who has started two games, the second of which he faded badly in. He hasn't scored a goal and wasn't involved in any of the goals in the games he's played in. But suddenly he's going to make the difference in whether we win the title? It's ridiculous to put that sort of pressure on him

Couple of weeks ago most people on here wanted Aaron to get a game - suddenly forgotten it would seem

You have to be able to deal with pressure at a club like Rangers where you are expected to win every single week.

And he has performed better in the 2 games he's started than just about anybody else at left mid all season. He's a creative player, something that will contribute to goals and help us win games.

[ShootSpeedKillLight 0]

Smith added: “We’ll make adjustments to the team which we feel are the right ones.

“We’ll change it for the semi-final — Falkirk play in an entirely different manner from Aberdeen.

I'm quite surprised no-one picked up on this. Evidence, if any were needed, that instead of playing to our own strengths, our method of play is simply to nullify the opposition. Brilliant.

[GeneralCartmanLee 313]

There is a big physical difference between playing u19 football and 1st team

Some of you guys need a reality check, what puts you in a position to know better than the team of coaches we have at Murray park as to how Fleck should develop ?. Are you professionals in this field ? Do you see the boy daily and know the impact it is having on him physically..?

Only at Rangers could a manager be slammed for trying to protect one of our younger players..

[docspiderman 1,243]

There is a big physical difference between playing u19 football and 1st team

Some of you guys need a reality check, what puts you in a position to know better than the team of coaches we have at Murray park as to how Fleck should develop ?. Are you professionals in this field ? Do you see the boy daily and know the impact it is having on him physically..?

Only at Rangers could a manager be slammed for trying to protect one of our younger players..

Some of realise that our manager has no record of developing younger players.

In scottish football the last 20 years has seen the demise of scottish talent going on to play at higher levels because they have been held back too much "in order to protect them". Very, very few players have progressed through the levels in the national set up whereas in all other countries we see first team regulars at 17 and 18, we see internationalists who progressed from the national youth teams through to full level. We see top ten level national teams with teenagers in their first eleven.

Only in Scotland do we have the fear of youth and evidence would point to that being a failing policy.

[McBoyd 355]

Can someone please explain to me how a player can possibly be burned out on half a seasons worth of football?

Only if they're young.

Didn't have any qualms about playing McCulloch/Adam/Dailly/Weir constantly last year, did he?

They weren't 17

[papaguy51 912]

There is a big physical difference between playing u19 football and 1st team

Some of you guys need a reality check, what puts you in a position to know better than the team of coaches we have at Murray park as to how Fleck should develop ?. Are you professionals in this field ? Do you see the boy daily and know the impact it is having on him physically..?

Only at Rangers could a manager be slammed for trying to protect one of our younger players..

To put it bluntly, I don't really care about how experienced a manager Walter is in this case - his record of bringing through youth is simply abhorrent.

I agree with protecting players but not in the archaic way that he seems to think is right. The whole 'He WILL get dropped after a few games' line was the one that got me.

As I said previous, imagine being wee Flecky and reading that. No matter how you play, the manager will drop you after x games because he thinks you're too young. Utterly demoralising.

If Walter tried a system of rotation between Fleck and Aaron for the position then that would make brilliant sense as it would be developing two youngsters, but the chances are that Adam will play or Lafferty will be shoe-horned into left mid on his return. Which is sad, because neither are half as good as Fleck in the role.

[biotechnology 2]

Lets all be honest. Walter has no track record whatever of developing and nurturing youngsters as they transition into being a major personality in a side. If I were one of John Fleck's relations, much as I love Rangers, I would be encouraging him to look at the development and advice he is getting.

Now, the counter to that is that JF has made it this far through our system and while Walter is not reassuring, there may be others behind the scenes doing and capable of more.

If none of our "big 5" go what is the chances of Man Utd putting in a £3/4 Mill bid for him as they are very sweet on him.

Would dread this but I can remember SAF saying he likes to get all the best Scottish talent to Manchester as they will reach a higher standard of play through better coaching & will hopefully be a better bet for the national team.

Darren Fletcher is one to start but there are three at Man U just now

David Peter Gray (born 4 May 1988 in Edinburgh) is a Scottish footballer who plays for Plymouth Argyle, on loan from Manchester United. He was brought up through the ranks by Heart of Midlothian until the age of 16, when he signed for United for a fee of £50,000.[1]

During the 2005-06 season, Gray broke into the reserve team, being deployed mainly at right-back, coming from the bench. On 25 October 2006, Gray made his debut for the senior team in a League Cup match against Crewe Alexandra. He started the game at right-back, but late in the second half, he was substituted for Kieran Lee who went on to score the winning goal in extra time.

In January 2007, he was sent on loan to Royal Antwerp to gain match experience. However, after just two games, he suffered an injury which sidelined him for the rest of the season. In November 2007, he again went on loan, this time to Crewe Alexandra for a month, as cover for the club's injured players.

On 1 January 2009, Gray completed a loan switch to Championship club Plymouth Argyle, due to last until the end of the 2008–09 season

Daniel Galbraith was at Hearts & Man U bought him for £100000

and there is another-Liam McClair-Obviously Brian's son.

[GeneralCartmanLee 313]

There is a big physical difference between playing u19 football and 1st team

Some of you guys need a reality check, what puts you in a position to know better than the team of coaches we have at Murray park as to how Fleck should develop ?. Are you professionals in this field ? Do you see the boy daily and know the impact it is having on him physically..?

Only at Rangers could a manager be slammed for trying to protect one of our younger players..

To put it bluntly, I don't really care about how experienced a manager Walter is in this case - his record of bringing through youth is simply abhorrent.

I agree with protecting players but not in the archaic way that he seems to think is right. The whole 'He WILL get dropped after a few games' line was the one that got me.

As I said previous, imagine being wee Flecky and reading that. No matter how you play, the manager will drop you after x games because he thinks you're too young. Utterly demoralising.

If Walter tried a system of rotation between Fleck and Aaron for the position then that would make brilliant sense as it would be developing two youngsters, but the chances are that Adam will play or Lafferty will be shoe-horned into left mid on his return. Which is sad, because neither are half as good as Fleck in the role.

He has more knowledge of it than me or you though, and also has a host of trained professionals behind him, I will trust there judgement of yours, mine or anyone else on here.

I knew Charlie miller when he stepped up to play for the 1st team, after one of his first game splaying up front with hateley at pittodre he found it physically and

mentally exhausting and saw it as a massive step up. Clearly so did fleck as although the service was poor he didn’t appear for the second half, he was totally anonymous and not looking for the ball as often as he did in the first half. That isn’t a criticism of the boy it’s exactly what I would expect with him stepping up from u19’s to the 1st team. Established foreign players find them SPL tough physically so why shouldn’t a 17 year old boy (however physically you think he is developed). ?

Walter is said he won’t burn him out and you are criticising him for protecting what may become our most valuable asset, I find this bizarre at best. Seems to me you just want a stick to beat the manager with……

[minstral 5,375]

There is a big physical difference between playing u19 football and 1st team

Some of you guys need a reality check, what puts you in a position to know better than the team of coaches we have at Murray park as to how Fleck should develop ?. Are you professionals in this field ? Do you see the boy daily and know the impact it is having on him physically..?

Only at Rangers could a manager be slammed for trying to protect one of our younger players..

To put it bluntly, I don't really care about how experienced a manager Walter is in this case - his record of bringing through youth is simply abhorrent.

I agree with protecting players but not in the archaic way that he seems to think is right. The whole 'He WILL get dropped after a few games' line was the one that got me.

As I said previous, imagine being wee Flecky and reading that. No matter how you play, the manager will drop you after x games because he thinks you're too young. Utterly demoralising.

If Walter tried a system of rotation between Fleck and Aaron for the position then that would make brilliant sense as it would be developing two youngsters, but the chances are that Adam will play or Lafferty will be shoe-horned into left mid on his return. Which is sad, because neither are half as good as Fleck in the role.

He has more knowledge of it than me or you though, and also has a host of trained professionals behind him, I will trust there judgement of yours, mine or anyone else on here.

I knew Charlie miller when he stepped up to play for the 1st team, after one of his first game splaying up front with hateley at pittodre he found it physically and

mentally exhausting and saw it as a massive step up. Clearly so did fleck as although the service was poor he didn’t appear for the second half, he was totally anonymous and not looking for the ball as often as he did in the first half. That isn’t a criticism of the boy it’s exactly what I would expect with him stepping up from u19’s to the 1st team. Established foreign players find them SPL tough physically so why shouldn’t a 17 year old boy (however physically you think he is developed). ?

Walter is said he won’t burn him out and you are criticising him for protecting what may become our most valuable asset, I find this bizarre at best. Seems to me you just want a stick to beat the manager with……

we dont need a stick to beat walter with, he knows how to do that himself.

[papaguy51 912]

He has more knowledge of it than me or you though, and also has a host of trained professionals behind him, I will trust there judgement of yours, mine or anyone else on here.

I knew Charlie miller when he stepped up to play for the 1st team, after one of his first game splaying up front with hateley at pittodre he found it physically and

mentally exhausting and saw it as a massive step up. Clearly so did fleck as although the service was poor he didn’t appear for the second half, he was totally anonymous and not looking for the ball as often as he did in the first half. That isn’t a criticism of the boy it’s exactly what I would expect with him stepping up from u19’s to the 1st team. Established foreign players find them SPL tough physically so why shouldn’t a 17 year old boy (however physically you think he is developed). ?

Walter is said he won’t burn him out and you are criticising him for protecting what may become our most valuable asset, I find this bizarre at best. Seems to me you just want a stick to beat the manager with……

And it seems to me that you constantly hide behind the 'manager knows best' line. If that's the case why don't all 10,000 of us just go home instead of debating on this site?

The service to Fleck was absolutely shite in the 2nd half, I wouldn't say he was looking jaded or anonymous at all. It's a good excuse to defend Walter for substituting him, although I did say to my dad before the kickoff on Saturday that Fleck would be taken off between 65-75 minutes for Novo. That's how predictable we really are.

And to be honest, from what I've seen of Fleck in the flesh and on RTV, he's got about a hundred times more potential than Miller.

[Polo 1,435]

If none of our "big 5" go what is the chances of Man Utd putting in a £3/4 Mill bid for him as they are very sweet on him.

Would dread this but I can remember SAF saying he likes to get all the best Scottish talent to Manchester as they will reach a higher standard of play through better coaching & will hopefully be a better bet for the national team.

Darren Fletcher is one to start but there are three at Man U just now

David Peter Gray (born 4 May 1988 in Edinburgh) is a Scottish footballer who plays for Plymouth Argyle, on loan from Manchester United. He was brought up through the ranks by Heart of Midlothian until the age of 16, when he signed for United for a fee of £50,000.[1]

During the 2005-06 season, Gray broke into the reserve team, being deployed mainly at right-back, coming from the bench. On 25 October 2006, Gray made his debut for the senior team in a League Cup match against Crewe Alexandra. He started the game at right-back, but late in the second half, he was substituted for Kieran Lee who went on to score the winning goal in extra time.

In January 2007, he was sent on loan to Royal Antwerp to gain match experience. However, after just two games, he suffered an injury which sidelined him for the rest of the season. In November 2007, he again went on loan, this time to Crewe Alexandra for a month, as cover for the club's injured players.

On 1 January 2009, Gray completed a loan switch to Championship club Plymouth Argyle, due to last until the end of the 2008–09 season

Daniel Galbraith was at Hearts & Man U bought him for £100000

and there is another-Liam McClair-Obviously Brian's son.

Played football against him when on holiday in France - he was only about 8 or 9 at the time and I was 14. He was better than most of the older guys on the pitch. Cocky little shitebag though, even if he was only 8!

[GeneralCartmanLee 313]

He has more knowledge of it than me or you though, and also has a host of trained professionals behind him, I will trust there judgement of yours, mine or anyone else on here.

I knew Charlie miller when he stepped up to play for the 1st team, after one of his first game splaying up front with hateley at pittodre he found it physically and

mentally exhausting and saw it as a massive step up. Clearly so did fleck as although the service was poor he didn’t appear for the second half, he was totally anonymous and not looking for the ball as often as he did in the first half. That isn’t a criticism of the boy it’s exactly what I would expect with him stepping up from u19’s to the 1st team. Established foreign players find them SPL tough physically so why shouldn’t a 17 year old boy (however physically you think he is developed). ?

Walter is said he won’t burn him out and you are criticising him for protecting what may become our most valuable asset, I find this bizarre at best. Seems to me you just want a stick to beat the manager with……

And it seems to me that you constantly hide behind the 'manager knows best' line. If that's the case why don't we all 10,000 of us just go home instead of debating on this site?

The service to Fleck was absolutely shite in the 2nd half, I wouldn't say he was looking jaded or anonymous at all. It's a good excuse to defend Walter for substituting him, although I did say to my dad before the kickoff on Saturday that Fleck would be taken off between 65-75 minutes for Novo. That's how predictable we really are.

And to be honest, from what I've seen of Fleck in the flesh and on RTV, he's got about a hundred times more potential than Miller.

I think the manager and coaching staff will know far better than you or me about flecks conditioning and the effect playing for the first team has on him. You are basing your opinion on he looks old for his age and they are monitoring everything about him on a daily basis, doesn’t mean you can’t offer an opinion but I know which one I would be more inclined to believe.

I am definitely not criticising the boy as I thought he played well in the first half, he was our only danger and I recognised service was poor (for the whole game not just the 2nd half) but he stopped looking for the ball as much and faded quickly and was rightly pulled after 70 mins. No shame in that, none at all.

The comparison to miller was because he made the step up at a similar age, was an absolute stand out in the youth team and was physically a bit more developed than those he was playing with. You can refuse to accept it’s a massive step up physically if you want, all the evidence will point out you are wrong.

Who would you have brought on for Fleck and did you not think fleck needed to go off ?

[Rohan 23]

He is not a kid anymore, soon to be 18 and he should be playing reguarly at that stage.

[biotechnology 2]

If none of our "big 5" go what is the chances of Man Utd putting in a £3/4 Mill bid for him as they are very sweet on him.

Would dread this but I can remember SAF saying he likes to get all the best Scottish talent to Manchester as they will reach a higher standard of play through better coaching & will hopefully be a better bet for the national team.

Darren Fletcher is one to start but there are three at Man U just now

David Peter Gray (born 4 May 1988 in Edinburgh) is a Scottish footballer who plays for Plymouth Argyle, on loan from Manchester United. He was brought up through the ranks by Heart of Midlothian until the age of 16, when he signed for United for a fee of £50,000.[1]

During the 2005-06 season, Gray broke into the reserve team, being deployed mainly at right-back, coming from the bench. On 25 October 2006, Gray made his debut for the senior team in a League Cup match against Crewe Alexandra. He started the game at right-back, but late in the second half, he was substituted for Kieran Lee who went on to score the winning goal in extra time.

In January 2007, he was sent on loan to Royal Antwerp to gain match experience. However, after just two games, he suffered an injury which sidelined him for the rest of the season. In November 2007, he again went on loan, this time to Crewe Alexandra for a month, as cover for the club's injured players.

On 1 January 2009, Gray completed a loan switch to Championship club Plymouth Argyle, due to last until the end of the 2008–09 season

Daniel Galbraith was at Hearts & Man U bought him for £100000

and there is another-Liam McClair-Obviously Brian's son.

Played football against him when on holiday in France - he was only about 8 or 9 at the time and I was 14. He was better than most of the older guys on the pitch. Cocky little shitebag though, even if he was only 8!

This is the report from the Official Man Utd website & I know SAF hounded Hearts for him for a number of years

A Scottish international who joined the club on his 16th birthday, Daniel is a left-sided winger and a huge Manchester United fan.

He is a dangerous player with bags of pace and possesses the ability to run at defenders with the ball. He is dangerous in the final third as he strike the ball very well.

Daniel's hard work ethic often pays dividends, he can come deep to win possession back for the team and then likes to turn and run with the ball at opposing players.

[Orangeclement 572]

Can someone please explain to me how a player can possibly be burned out on half a seasons worth of football?

Only if they're young.

Didn't have any qualms about playing McCulloch/Adam/Dailly/Weir constantly last year, did he?

They weren't 17

the same thing happened to rooney why does everyone just go off on one for the sake of it think it through ffs

[Orangeclement 572]

He is not a kid anymore, soon to be 18 and he should be playing reguarly at that stage.

rooney was used as a sub for nearly all the time he was at everton